Troop Committee question

[rlculver415]

I know I've seen this somewhere on the forum, but I can't find it:

 

Who is a "voting member" of the troop committee? I realize that a consensus is the best way to go with decision-making, but occasionally we vote. At our last committee meeting, which I did not attend, there was a firm discussion on whether the SAs had a vote or not. I told the Treasurer I'd consult my panel of experts. I'd like to be able to resolve this by next meeting, with y'all's cooperation. (I don't have the TC Guidebook yet, and I'll bet the info is in there.)

[yaworski]

By rule (that's the referee in me speaking) the committee does not include the SM or any ASMs, only those who registered at Committee Members or Committee Chair. However, reality is often different.

 

My troop had an amorphous committee for a long time, anyone who showed up for the meeting could vote. Then someone pointed out that most of those who showed up had an ax to grind so that changed. Now we have a policy that all Scouters registered to our troop may vote, including the SM and all ASMs.

 

From what I've heard, many troops around here operate in the same fashion, if for no other reason than it is difficult to find people to sit on the committee.

 

 

[k9gold-scout]

In our troop, any parent or scouter who comes to the meeting can vote. We have 70 scouts and seldom have more than a dozen people at any parent meeting. I know if more parents came we would put them on the troop comm. Then the scouters would be happy to give their reports and ask the parents to vote.

[Bob White]

The troop committe is made of registered committee members. According to the Cub Scout Leaders Handbook and the Troop Committee Guidebook, committee members are assigned tasks by the Committee Chair and report on their progress at the monthly committee meetings.

 

There is realy nothing to vote on.

 

The Cubmaster or Scoutmaster, as the program chairs, make decisions with the Committee Chair the Chartered Organization Representative. The committe members each have specific job responsibilities to perform. The committee chair assigns tasks to memmbers based on their areas of responsibility. So the need for votes deoesn not exist in the month to month operations of a unit.

 

Bob White

[yaworski]

"There is realy nothing to vote on. "

 

Sure there is.

 

Do we want cookies or cake at next month's meeting?

Popcorn or wreathes?

Pinewood derby, here or there?

Capital expenditure, yea or nay?

Use local talent or bring in a hitter to get rid of the SM?

 

 

 

[yaworski]

"In our troop, any parent or scouter who comes to the meeting can vote."

 

That can be really dangerous. If you have a hot button issue that the trained Adults are supporting because it is the proper way to do things but it is opposed by a bunch of grumpy parents, you can just get trampled.

 

We used to have the same policy as you do but changed it when the potential problems were seen. We also had a bunch of parents who wanted to have a say, put up their hand, volunteer, and register.

 

 

[Bob White]

At the risk of sounding repititious I will restate my original observation. Nowhere that I am aware of in BSA training or literature does it state that the committee operates by majority rule. If you were to take committee training you would see a video where each committee person reports on the progrees they have made or the actions taken in the area of responsibility they have been assigned.

 

In direct response to another poster, as to who would make specific decisions.

 

Q. Do we want cookies or cake at next month's meeting?

A. The Cubmaster would let the Committee chair know and the committee chair assigns the task to the appropriate person.

 

Q. Popcorn or wreathes?

A. Fundraising Chair

 

Q. Pinewood derby, here or there?

A. The Pinewood Derby Chair

 

Q. Capital expenditure, yea or nay?

A. Program head (Cubmaster or PLC) With the Committee Chair

 

Q. Use local talent or bring in a hitter to get rid of the SM?

A. Chater Organization Executive and the Charter Organization Rep.

 

This is not a 'majority rules' committee. This is a 'here is your assignment now run with it' committee.

 

When in doubt go to training and read the manuals.

 

Bob White

[LauraT7]

Ok Bob - question for you -

 

the boys (PLC) decided they wanted to go caving in Nov. at the same cave we have gone to for 3 - 4 yrs running. (We are trying to convince them to try new things, but they REALLY LOVE this trip - it is attended by a majority of the troop from Scout to Life)

 

our only 2 older boys, age 17, approached the committee about doing a 3-4 day climbing/hiking high adventure trip in Early Nov (teacher conferences - 4 day weekend) to the Shawnee National forest in southern IL. This trip would appeal to those two and possibly 4 other scouts in our troop of 1st class rank and above.

 

The committe thought it was a great idea. (so do I)

 

But...

 

The committee decided to eliminate the caving trip altogether.

 

Can the committe decide to completely disregard the PLC's wants? What about the majority of other boys who are not interested or capable of the high adventure trip?

 

Aren't we bound to "deliver the promise" to them, too?

[eagle90]

On our Committee, everyone who is registered on the charter is eligible to vote when there is an issue. I disagree that there is nothing to vote on. I, as SM, do not want the total responsibility, expecially for financial issues. That only breeds problems. We spent $2400 on tents recently, and yes, the committee did vote on this expenditure. If the committee makes no decisions, votes on nothing, why have the body at all?

[yaworski]

In the Bob White system, the committee reallys serves no function since the Committee Chair and the SM seem to make all decisions.

 

In the Bob White system, the Fundraising Chair makes the decisions about fund raising but what if his pet system is not supported by anyone else in the unit because they tried it before and it didn't work. Now you have some guy operating in a vacuum and creating a disaster.

 

The Bob White system might work IF the Fundraising Chair ran a committee of fund raisers who discussed and voted on things. The Bob White System might work if the Pinewood Derby is actually run by a committee and not just one guy.

 

The reality of the system is that these so called "Chairs" are chairs of a committee of one.

 

 

[Bob White]

Lets get something straught right off the bat, I am not writing about the BOb White System. I am saying "show me a scouting resources that says these committees run by majority rule or even Roberts Rules of Order".

 

The training courses and resources of the BSA say that the committee chair assigns tasks to the committee member and the committee reports progress at the troop committee meeting.

 

By no means does this strip the committee of responsibilities. it focuses their time on active progrewss rather than meaningless debate. In Cub Scouts the annual plan is determined by the Cubmaster and Committee Chair, in Boy Scouts it is made by the Patrol Leaders Council and supported by the committee. Not made by the committee or changed by the committee but "supported" by the committee.

 

Adults looking to have some sort of authority should pick a different hobby. We teach planning and cooperation to the scouts, it would be nice to the same practiced by the adults.

 

There is no need for two decision making bodies in either Cub Scouts or Boy Scouts. The role of the committee is to carry out the plan.

 

If the Cub Master and the Committee Chair decide to do a Pinewood in February that is their decision to make. The committee chair assigns the event to a committee member and the committee member goes forward to make it happen. They keep the committee abreast of progress at the monthly meeting.

 

 

If a Patrol Leaders Council Determines they need new tents they might ask the committee Quarter matr=er to find a selection of tents and prices. The PLC reviews the choices and votes on a selection. They find out through the Committee finance chair if they have the funds to make the purchase. If they do then the tents (selected by the scouts)are purchased (with the money raised by the scouts). If there is not enough money then the PLC can ask the4 fundraising chair to help them with ideas to raise the needed funds. After which the tents are purchased.

 

In a proper Troop operation the boys make the decisions, after all that is the mission of scouting to teach them how to make ethical choices. The only way they will learn this is if they are allowed to practice it. That is the whole reason we as adults are supposed to be doing this. It's not about being in charge, or running the troop or pack. It's about giving kids the opportunity to leqarn practice and gow in a structure that takes them from total dependence on adults to independence.

 

They cannot learn independence if we micromanage the program. If we can trust boys to work indendently than we certainly should be able to trust the adult committee members. Give them a job and let them make the decisions that go with the job.

 

Please go get trained, and really pay attention while you are there! This is not my plan, this is the method by which scout units are supposed to operate.

 

Bob white

[Abraiu]

Your right the committee is not required to vote. It does not state it at all in the committee guide book. Most committees should adapt something as they charter...or vote on makeing a change to vote...or even to use assistant scoutmasters as a voting member if membership is low. Most committees have a rule that they established...say a majority vote is needed to buy $2,500.00 worth of new tents. You may say a quorm of no less than four must be present to vote or 5...try to have your CC, ADVC, Trea, Sec, and Activities chairman if possible. Our parents of scouts that are(registured). We allways try to registure at least one member of the scouts family just to be on the committee just in case. We don't get everyone but there always a good 5 to 7 members on the committee when something big comes up. Good luck.

[Abraiu]

Your right the committee is not required to vote. It does not state it at all in the committee guide book. Most committees should adapt something as they charter...or vote on makeing a change to vote...or even to use assistant scoutmasters as a voting member if membership is low. Most committees have a rule that they established...say a majority vote is needed to buy $2,500.00 worth of new tents. You may say a quorm of no less than four must be present to vote or 5...try to have your CC, ADVC, Trea, Sec, and Activities chairman if possible. Our parents of scouts that are(registured). We allways try to registure at least one member of the scouts family just to be on the committee just in case. We don't get everyone but there always a good 5 to 7 members on the committee when something big comes up. The main point is that the scouts run the troop and the committee supports them...making big expenses should have the support of the committee if it is real expense...or needed in most cases. If its what the scouts want then the committee should support it...as long as it follows "The Aims of Scouting" and is not in conflict with "The Guide to Safe Scouting" Good luck.

[Bob White]

Abraiu,

You say that the committes "should" establish voting roles. According to what resource or method of the BSA? Accoding to who? Why? I have had Cub Packs with nearly 100 members and troops near 50 members that operated for years without committees voting. Why saddle the process with unneeded layers of beaurocracy?

 

Read the Troop Committee Guide it states very clearly that the Patrol Leaders Council runs the program not the adults. That's why it's BOY Scouts.

 

Bob White

[yaworski]

"If the Cub Master and the Committee Chair decide to do a Pinewood in February that is their decision to make. The committee chair assigns the event to a committee member and the committee member goes forward to make it happen."

 

Only to discover that no one will be there except the CM and CC because everyone else is away for spring break. Better yet, no one comes because the boys really wanted to do a raingutter regatta.

 

Your system is fundamentally flawed in that it allow two people to operate without oversight. I've seen that in other organizations and it is nothing but a receipe for disaster.