Adult volunteers who do not have boys in the program

[Beavah]

 

In fact, identifying yourself as a homosexual reduces the chances of child molestation. The vast majority of child molesters and pedophiles say they are heterosexual when asked which adult sex they are attracted to.

 

LOL. Yah, back to statistics 101 for yeh.

 

Let's keep da gays stuff over in Issues & Politics, eh?

 

I agree with E61 that yeh need to walk slowly with folks who are brand new to the community. I'm not sure if that's just a personal prejudice on my part, though. The pedophile community has a lot of Jerry Sandusky types, eh? Long-time, upstanding members of da community. These days, the nation is pretty mobile compared with what it once was, so it might be that folks who move into a community have skills that are in demand, are upwardly mobile, and aren't just hangin' around to insinuate themselves into youth groups. Da risk might actually be less.

 

Beavah

 

[BSA24]

> LOL. Yah, back to statistics 101 for yeh.

 

If you have some statistical analysis or data that will disprove what I wrote, please provide it. Otherwise, I'd suggest you study this topic as it is of grave concern to children and their safety, and you are charged with caring for them.

 

Understanding the demographics of the enemy instead of imagining them through prejudice is probably a better approach.

 

> Let's keep da gays stuff over in Issues & Politics, eh?

 

I disagree. This is not a discussion of politics. It is a discussion of volunteers and their demographics... and the threat to children.

 

 

 

[Beavah]

Yah, BSA24, I don't reckon any of us here are "charged with" anything, eh? We're just volunteers.

 

Second, Statistics 101 would teach yeh things like correlation is not causation, and that conclusions in a multivariate system cannot be drawn from univariate analyses when there are confounding, multicorrelate, or interaction effects. For those reasons, your two statements are not logically equivalent, eh? The majority of pedophiles may self-identify as heterosexual and identifying as homosexual could still not reduce the risk of molestation.

 

I was suggestin' that yeh study this topic because child abuse is of course a concern for folks as yeh suggest, and yeh might want to develop a better understandin' of it then yeh have at present.

 

But now let's let da thread get back to young adult leaders, eh? Da relative merits of gays in leadership is an Issues & Politics kind of thing.

 

B

[BSA24]

> Yah, BSA24, I don't reckon any of us here are "charged with" anything, eh? We're just volunteers.

 

By volunteering and agreeing to the responsibility, yes, we are charged with certain responsibilities. If we are not willing to perform them, we're not welcome to continue.

 

> Second, Statistics 101 would teach yeh ...

 

Thank you for the admission that you have absolutely zero data related to this topic and cannot contradict the numbers with any data or evidence of your own.

 

The claim stands firm: 90% of pedophiles self-identify as heterosexuals in their adult relationships. Homosexuality does not predict pedophilia.

 

[johnponz]

BSA 24, I understand what you are saying but your stats do have a flaw because the majority of people are heterosexual. You would need to compare the percentage of heterosexuals in the population with the percentage of heterosexuals in the molester sub-population.

 

Then you would need to calculate the percentage of homosexuals in the population and the number of homosexuals in the molester population. You may find (I don't know) that being homosexual does indeed predict molestation when you control for the population difference.

 

I really do not believe that is the case, but just wanted to show that your statistics were a little simplistic to use as a basis for a conclusion.

 

This is something the media does all the time. They pull out any numbers that sort of corroborates their point. It is kind of a pet peeve of mine.

 

[Beavah]

Yep, what johnponz said. No additional data is required, your current data do not support da conclusion yeh draw.

 

In addition to what johnponz mentions, you'd have to consider what percentage of those who self-report being heterosexual are in fact homosexuals who are still closeted, or homosexuals who believe that reporting as heterosexual will be beneficial to them in court proceedings or sentencing, or any number of other things, eh? Self-reports of personal/private data are notoriously unreliable and conditioned by circumstance and place.

 

Then yeh would have to consider interaction effects by sub-population. Self-reporting as homosexual is strongly correlated with socioeconomic status, eh? So it might be that in the general population it's not predictive, but in da higher income brackets it is predictive (where self-reports are more accurate). Or vice versa. And so on. Then there are additional complexities because human subjects research is often highly restricted when it comes to these sorts of issues and funding is agenda-driven, so neither studies nor samples are likely to be unbiased.

 

Alas, da real world is more complex than simply citing a percentage, if we want to be honest with each other and with the data. That's less fun because we can't wear as much war paint and beat drums, but I reckon it does more good.

 

Now perhaps we can get back to volunteers without kids in the program as Cub Scout leaders?

 

Beavah

 

[packsaddle]

I was a CM for a couple years before and then several years after my son moved on to boy scouts. It actually was welcomed by the CO and parents because it allowed continuity and growth for the pack. The advantage of a long-term CM, or for that matter SM, is that you have a known quantity who is experienced, knows the system and likely has an understanding far beyond the training that is required.

 

I really like the cub scouts, actually more than boy scouts. I've written this many times in these threads. Sometimes I'd like to go back to working with the pack again...all they need to do is say the word - but they seem to be doing fine without me right now. Besides, in just a short time my grandsons will be there and I'm going to enjoy that thoroughly.

 

Now, I'm tempted to take Beavah's advice and move this to I&P. If you folks do NOT want this to happen, say so and please stick to the topic.

Alternatively, Ohanadad, if you DO want me to move it (and I'm already counting Beavah's vote on this) just say so. I'll be glad make it happen for you.(This message has been edited by packsaddle)

[acco40]

I've got a novel approach, why don't we let the CO do their job and choose the Scouters of their unit. I think we should start with a basis of trust.

[Ohanadad]

Must be nice to have all those parents volunteering to choose from....

 

Anyway, I talked it over with my District Chair and he loved the idea. While we were talking we came up with a plan to also offer the volunteers to be merit badge counselors as a way to ease them back into scouting. The have a lot of skills and expertise that could be leveraged. Who knows maybe this could be the start of a MB clinic at the base.

[ScoutNut]

>>"we came up with a plan to also offer the volunteers to be merit badge counselors as a way to ease them back into scouting."