Piecemeal Crossover

[dfscott]

I'm facing a hairy situation as a Webelos Den Leader. I'm leading first year Webelos, but two of the boys are newly joined 5th graders (our 2nd year Webelos Den fell apart early in the fall). Things have gone great with the den to this point, with 7 of my 9 boys earning the Webelos Badge at the B&G.

 

At the same time, my two fifth graders have been independently working towards AOL, and plan to get it by May. A couple of the other boys have caught the "AOL Fever" and have been working on it as well (they are "red-shirt 4th graders" so they are eligible age-wise.

 

So now, it looks like we'll have 4 boys crossing over in May, but a couple of others want to cross as well. As an FYI, I'm also Scoutmaster of the Troop that at least 3 of them are planning to cross over to.

 

So, it looks like I'm going to start a fall AOL den with 5 boys. The question is, as they become pass the AOL requirements, should they join the troop right away, or remain in the Web den (effectively marking time) until the rest of them are ready? Based on the schedule I've laid out (which includes a lot of group Web/Scout camping) most of them should be ready to bridge by the end of October, which the remaining few just needing to wait until they're 10-1/2. However, my Pack CC is encouraging me to keep any that don't make it in May in the Pack until next May, which I'm afraid it going to bore a lot of them. However, he has a point that if the strong boys leave, that will leave the den with only the less motivated boys, and it may suffer the same implosion fate that the previous 2nd year Web den did.

 

 

[AKdenldr]

What does the current Bear den look like? Could the pack plan be that the WI/WII dens join forces boys could bridge when they are old enough and have earned the AOL?

 

Also is your troop receiving cross overs at any time? Some in our neck of the woods have a specific time they receive cross overs (so that new scouts are welcomed well and ready to camp in warmer weather.) March is the main time around here -- so the boys have time to get used to the troop before boyscout camp.

 

-- AK

[dfscott]

The Bear Den has some issues as well. It's made up of 12 boys with a single Den Leader (no ADLs). The CM has been pushing him to split the den and/or get an ADL, but he's resisted, saying he can "handle it." I'm a little worried pushing more boys into that Den.

 

The Scout Troop is brand new (will be chartered this April), so we have some flexibility on when we accept scouts.

[qwazse]

compromise and cross-over the younger boys in February. That gives the AOL boys a chance to contribute to the life of the den. Meanwhile your troop (and any other for that matter) can invite them to activities. That way they can keep in touch with the two 5th graders who would have moved up. Best of both worlds! (This also helps get adults acclimated to your troop's culture before the date of transfer.)

 

The boys who haven't earned AOL by Febrruary, have the option of delaying crossover until they've completed those last couple of requirements, or moving up straightaway. Sometimes, when a boy sees his buddies getting awards and attention he "snaps to" and catches up quickly.

[dfscott]

Thanks, qwazse - I like that idea. I've mapped out the AOL year, and it works out that everything wraps up around that time anyway. I'm planning a couple of fall joint campouts (for Outdoorsman and AOL) so that should keep them all in touch.

[Eagle92]

My advice is to get them to the troop ASAP. I've seen AOL and CROSSOVER ceremonies done "piecemeal."

 

If you make them wait you may lose them.

 

Now a compromise may be to start having ALL of the eligble or soon to be eligible meet with the Boy Scouts. Those old enough/met requiremetns can officially join while the rest are guests using the troop activities to meet AOL and other requirements. THEN when they are eligible, do the ceremony for all.

 

 

KEY THING IMHO is to get them and the parents comfortable enough, AND have enough money saved, foer them to go to summer camp. IMO, summercamp is the hook to keep folks in Scouting.

[Jay K]

I did this with my Son:

We transfereed him to the Troop via paperwork in December, and attended the B&G in February where he "formally" crossed over.

[ScoutNut]

>>"So, it looks like I'm going to start a fall AOL den with 5 boys. The question is, as they become pass the AOL requirements, should they join the troop right away, or remain in the Web den (effectively marking time) until the rest of them are ready? Based on the schedule I've laid out (which includes a lot of group Web/Scout camping) most of them should be ready to bridge by the end of October, which the remaining few just needing to wait until they're 10-1/2."

[AnaMaria]

Being age 10 1/2 is not a requirement for joining Boy Scouts. 10 years old with Arrow of Light is it (or 10 and finished 5th grade or 11), the 10 1/2 is an old requirement. Of course for some boys, 10 1/2 might be their ticket to Arrow of Light. Last spring we had a boy run into 2 or 3 troops in our area who were still erroneously quoting the 10 1/2 with Arrow of Light requirement. Some of those adults are very involved district level volunteers in addition to their troop involvement.

[SR540Beaver]

Around here, Webelos is a 1.5 year program with Cubs crossing over at Blue and Gold in February. We have a few Packs that put it off until March. I know some here will disagree with it, but crossing them in the February to March time frame gets them acclimated to the troop prior to summer camp. Sending newly crossed Scouts to summer camp in June as their very first campout can be tough on them. Not all as some will thrive on it, but for those who were iffy when they crossed over, sending them a couple of hundred miles away for a week of camp without benefit of knowing the boys in the troop or having any camping experience can cause them to leave.

[Twocubdad]

I don't understand. Are your "newly joined 5th graders" the same guys who are on track to earn AOL in May? How can they do that?

 

I think the answer depends more on the troop's program that the den's. My first thought was to talk to the Scoutmaster, but I see you have that covered.

 

If the troop is running a New Scout Patrol, Webelos trickling in is a problem. It forces the Troop Guides to "start over" every few month and makes is difficult to lead instruction which is what all the boys need. If the troop only has "regular" patrols and new Scouts are incorporated into those patrols, when the Webelos cross over is less of a problem.

 

From my perspective as a Scoutmaster, I would prefer to see the Webelos cross over at least in sizeable groups. Makes for a more rational program for the new boys. I also think having several new scouts together creates more esprit d' corps among them. I came through Scouting when everyone joined the troop the Monday night following their 11th birthday. There was no big deal "crossover" and everyone joined at a different time. Personally, I think having the boys join as a group is much better.

 

I'm a bit bothered by the idea that once a boy earn AOL he's just "marking time" in Webelos. Is the program really that boring? Is my Eagle son now just "marking time" until he turns 18? Sounds like a whole lot of emphasis on advancement and not on doing the fun things Webelos do.

[Eagle92]

2Cub,

 

It is possible to do AOL in 9 months. Heck that was how ya did it back inthe day b/c Cub Scouts was 3 years instead of 5 like it is today.

 

 

Man I'm old.

[dfscott]

Good point, 2Cub. I had "bear" of a time with my Wolves when they transitioned to Bears. We started early in the spring and went whole hog after advancement in the summer, but then in the fall when we got our new influx of Cubs, we had to either repeat stuff or force the new guys to play catch-up.

 

Also, to further complicate matters, the troop is a brand new troop. We're only getting my 4 early boys, the 4 leftovers from the Web 2 den that imploded, and 2-3 others from a nearby troop that has also ran out of gas. So for all practical purposes, we're going to have nothing but new scout patrols.

 

The way I envision it going is to form 2 small patrols with the first 10-11 boys. When the remaining 5 come over (hopefully with more from other Packs), we'll either add to the existing patrols or completely dissolve the existing patrols and reform them all

 

I know that whether to keep patrols together or to periodically mix them is a hot topic of debate, so I'd love to have input for the vets on that as well, even if it is something I don't have to worry about for a while.

[SR540Beaver]

Cubs basically follows the 9 month school year with a few Pack activities encouraged over the summer months. Why were you going whole hog on advancement thru the summer?

[dfscott]

We were getting pushed by our DE to run a "year-round program." Our pack misinterpreted that to mean "start working on advancement ASAP." Live and learn...