Question about Cub Scout Leader Awards

[qwazse]

RW, pursue what you can for your adults. The worse that can happen is council will say "no" to a particular award, but they may direct you to other ways of recognizing them.

 

Some could care less about awards and knots. The best thing about the one I got was a note my daughter and her friend composed listing the reasons I should be nominated for it! So, SP's suggestion about letting the boys be part of giving the award is really significant.

[Basementdweller]

Is it me or is just plain tacky to submit yourself for awards?????

 

We have a husband wife team in council that nominate each other for everything available....Including the silver wood chuck.

[SeattlePioneer]

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Heh, heh! I think it's just you, Basement!

 

Personally I encourage people to go for awards. My theory is that awards such as most knots tend to shape people's behavior and encourage them to do a quality job at filling a position.

 

Maybe they need to have a certain percentage of boys advance a rank or attend several Roundtables. That's all to the good of the program for everyone. (except your district Roundtable, Basement....)

 

I just turned in my application for my district committee leader knot, a position I've been filling since 2004, and I'll be turning in an application for my Cubmaster knot (or whatever they call it now) a position I've filled for two years.

 

Frankly, few people are paying attention to such things for other people around here. I sell the knot program when I do the Tiger Cub Den Leader Training and include the application in the Tiger Cub Den Leader Handbook I've put together for participants.

 

So I'm a knot chaser. It's just the froth on the latte. Sue me!

[Scoutfish]

I think it's tacky to submit yourself for the award if you only did your job to get the award.

 

But at the same time, if earning the award means you have to complete a pre set, distinct amount of requiremenmts in a particular way...and you do complete them..then it's all on the up and up.

 

 

That knot is about the closest thin we can recieve as a "pay raise" in this job.

 

And when it comes to working ( for an actual check) , I am not above asking for what I think I deserve, especially if I know I do the work to earn that raise.

 

But again, I think it depends on why. If take a position just for the sake of getting the knot, tacky isn't descriptive enough.

[drmbear]

Since I am the one doing the work to meet the requirements of the award or knot, I print the card out at the beginning of the year to make sure I did the things necessary to earn the award, etc., why would it be tacky to claim the award. I did all the work to earn my Eagle as well, and turned in the paperwork for that - no one thinks that is tacky. It is the only way to earn it. Some of these new Alumni knots are so complicated, no one else but you would ever pay enough attention to what you are doing to actually submit you for the award.

[robertwilliams]

 

 

I think if the award has definite requirements, and you achieve them, it's legitimate to request the award. But if it's something with vague requirements like Silver Beaver that you have to be nominated for, then yeah that's pretty tacky.

 

This is my 3rd year as a Den Leader and I didn't even know about the knots when I started. But sure, some of the things I do are motivated partly by fulfilling the requirements of the awards - like going to UoS and having regular planning meetings with my ADL. Those are useful and help me run a better program with or without a little cloth knot, but it did provide a bit of extra motivation and a nice checklist of things I might not have done otherwise.

 

I hope that the knot program will provide other adults a little bit of incentive to get involved in the program, as well as help shape their involvement - get some DLs going to Roundtable and UoS, get some other leaders doing the same and volunteering to organize pack activities, maybe encourage our Cubmaster to pursue the Quality Unit award, etc.

 

[Basementdweller]

drmbear lots of I's in that post.

 

 

Well never submitted a for a know for myself. never will. The last knot I received was WDL knot.. At the B&G all the den leaders and committee members had received their knots.... Someone realized I didn't get one and submitted it for me.....At the time it could have been one of 4 knots. I could still submit myself for the three remaining, but won't do it.

 

To me, submitting it yourself significantly cheapens the award. If you half heartedly doing the job and don't receive it then fine.....If it takes you doing a stellar job to be noticed and have someone notice and submit the paperwork that makes the knot more meaningful.

 

 

Just tacky.

 

[Basementdweller]

So Robert.........I see you are taking care of yourself. typical American attitude, me me me me me me me.

 

I gotta, How many other folks are you going to submit for the knots?????

[83Eagle]

Basement you are missing the difference between earning and being nominated for an award.

 

The knots, at least the leader knots, are essentially training awards with distinct requirements...do five of the following seven things, etc. They do not require nomination but they do require approval. So it is perfectly appropriate to submit the form when you have completed the requirements.

 

For an award that requires nomination, it is inappropriate to nominate yourself or have a buddy nominate you.

 

You could do with a lot less judgmental attitude in your post. Robert what you are doing is completely appropriate and part of the reason for the knots--to encourage training, retention, etc.(This message has been edited by 83eagle)

[Eagle92]

For the various training knots, I have no problem with people submitting themselves for it. In fact since a "scorecard" is given out with the requirements and is to be duplicated as needed, I think that is the intent of the knots: recognize those adults who go above and beyond.

 

As for submitting yourself for some of the special awards, or making deals with other (I'll submit your name if you submit my name), yes that is very, very tacky.

 

But I know a lot of volunteers who are to busy with program to remember submit paperwork. I know I've been on district committees on and off (mostly on) since '95, and earned the DCK a long time ago. But I didn't turn in the paperwork until the DE reminded me that I earned it and should turn in the paperwork.

 

One thing I will say is this. With the coming of MANDATORY TRAINING (caps for emph.), if you earned the knots, I'd go ahead and submit the paperwork and make sure it's in your SCOUTNET records, even if you do not intend to wear the knots on your uniform. With SCOUTNET records having the habit of getting messed up or incomplete, having the knot on the record, or in my case having the certificate, may help in clearing up training records since the knots shows you have gone beyond basic training.

 

And that reminds me, gotta turn in the peperwork for my TCDL I earned 2 years ago.

[robertwilliams]

Thanks 83Eagle and Eagle92.

 

In my opinion these knots are kind of like the "Trained" strip. I didn't submit my ADL for that either; he did the training and then I pestered our Cubmaster until she remembered to pick up the strips for us and everyone else who'd finished the training. If I remember correctly, she just handed them out privately, with no ceremony or anything.

 

However, I distinctly remember one new leader asking an older leader "Hey, how did you get that Trained badge? How can I get one?" So if a cloth badge motivates someone to get trained and better serve the boys, then I'm for it.

 

To the best of my knowledge, no other leader in our pack besides me and my ADL is qualified to receive these particular knots, because they haven't met the requirements (we have low Roundtable and UoS attendance, for instance, and low parent involvement other than the DL/ADLs). I hope to use the knot program to remedy that situation.

(This message has been edited by robertwilliams)

[qwazse]

RW - in my experience, it will only help if you use them as potential conversation starters: "And you could earn this knot if you'd just do ___".

 

They might say "I don't care about your stinkin' knots." But at least you'll have put out what you would like to see from your adults in terms of action. If they're like me, they'd wind up doing what you want, and refuse the knot!

 

I think knots are a nuisance. But, if you're going to recognize me anyway, I'd rather a knot than a plaque or a mug.

[Eagle92]

Wearing knots reminds me of this quote by one Devil Dog who, when asked about what his ribbons represented, stated things done during "a misspent youth."

[Jay K]

I once had a Tiger Cub ask me, in detail, about every knot on my shirt. I told him that some were ones for stuff I did as a Cub Scout. (I was a Cub Scout 50 years ago.) That Tiger has grown and has gone on to earn the youth religious and the Arrow of Light. I saw him at a court of honor, and he ran over to me and happily showed me his Youth religious knot and told me that when He became a uniformed Adult, he wanted knots just like mine.

My heart was filled with joy. I brought our DE over, and I pointed out one that I don't have: Eagle. I told the Scout to get Eagle.

At every training event, I've gotten a card, and I've tracked the requirements that I did and turned them in. I don't see why you can't turn in your own card, that they gave you at training, when it is done. I can't sign the stuff myself, any more than a Merit Badge candidate can sign off his own Merit Badge card. I effect, when a CC or a DE or an RT Commissioner signs off a requirement, they are , in effct, "Nominating" you. I went to Unit Commissioner Basic training this last Saturday. At the end of training, thay gave me a " Unit Commissioner progress record for the Commissioner Key/Arrowhead Honor award. Of course, I will use it to track my development in the position, and if I get everything checcked off, will I turn it in? OF COURSE I will. The whole purpose is to provide motivation to others.

[Eagledad]

We solved the problem of knots by assigning one of the Committee Members to track and prepare paperwork for all the scouters. We do that not so much to make sure everyone gets knots, but to make sure the adult records are kept up to date on the council record. You would be surprised how many scouters five or ten years down the road are asked to track the past record for various reasons, Council recognition being one.

 

Knots are pretty clear, but District Awards have their own issues. Its not unusual for the same units to be awarded the same district recognitions every year simply because the other units don't even apply.

 

Folks ask here all the time how they can recognise the hard work of a volunteer in their unit. Unit and district recognition awards are very good and easy ways of doing that. I personally don't wear knots, but I was very humbuled to recieve awards to be recognized by the pack and troop that I recieved on their behalf. I don't wear them on my shirt, but I cherish my Adult Religious Award presented by the Pack and my Scoutmaster Award of Merit presented by the PLC. I have many others like everyone else who puts in their time, but those are special.

 

Barry