Muslim Scout?

[jamist649]

Does anyone have any experience with a Scout who is Muslim? I have had an inquiry from a Muslim family and I told them they are welcome...but-privately-I have some questions as to how to handle this.

 

Does he promise to do his "duty to God" or can he modify (will he want to) do "duty to Allah"? Are there any special regligious concerns that I should know about? I'm thinking prayers, times, customs, etc. I have no experience with the Muslim faith but I'm kind of excited to welcome this family as it will bring a new facet to our Pack and hopefully do alot to show that not all Muslims are extremists/terorists.

 

Anyone have any ideas/resources?

[moosetracker]

Really it does not need to be "God" they have a belief in, but that of a higher being.. So Allah, God, some alien being whatever..

 

Here are some websites on it. http://www.scouting.org/about/factsheets/operating_orgs/islamic.aspx

 

http://www.scouting.org/filestore/pdf/02-928.pdf

 

Good luck, and I am sure they will be a great asset to your pack learning about diversity.

[Scoutfish]

Treat him just like everybody else. Other than the name they bestow upon their god, and that this boy may need to step aside and pray 5 times a day... he is just another boy.

 

Personally, I think tis is a great oppertunity for your pack.

 

My pack is lucky as we have several different religious cultures involved.

 

It hasn't been a problem yet.

[Basementdweller]

He is another boy...... But I think Scoutfish has never actually dealt with it.....A lot depends on the family...... this isn't like getting a catholic, baptist, Lutheran and protestant scouts together.

 

The den and Pack meetings are not an issue, it is day outings and camp outs that can be a problem. All of the muslim families I have dealt with understand that when we pray in scouting that "god" refers to the god that each scout believes in and it has not been an issue to this point.

 

We have one family who has integrated into our Pack very well, They do not expect everything to stop while they fulfill their obligation. They bring their own food and cook using the camp kitchen. We offered to adjust our traditional camp fare, but they said no. They attended our scouts own and participated. Interesting additions to the Blue and gold potluck for sure.....

 

Previous experience was not that positive.......The group was expected to stop everything and they expected for the Pack to adjust the camp menu to their requirements......

 

I have no experience with Muslims as Boy Scouts or Venturing, Just as Cubs with their families.

[ScoutLass]

I have extensive experience working with those of the Islamic faith, just not in a scouting context. As said above, it all depends on the family and how strict they are. The traditional food restrictions, halal, are similar to the kosher restrictions in Jewish fare. Like those of the Jewish faith, Muslims follow the halal restrictions to varying degrees. Some just avoid pork products, though others only eat fully halal meat (raised and slaughtered in a specific way, then blessed in the name of Allah). In my experience, those that follow the strictest halal diet usually supply their own food. Before food events like a campout, I would ask about food restrictions ahead of time.

 

The same with the five prayer times. Some do the whole prayer, bowed down flat, facing Mecca, long prayer. Others take a quiet moment of personal prayer, faced properly, but without chanting, bowing or prayer mats. It just depends.

 

Ramadan is tricky. Depending on where it falls, it can happen in the middle of summer or the middle of winter. It's a time of fasting, and depending on the family, the boy's participation may drop during that time.

 

The easiest way to find out what the family and pack expectations are is to ask and work them out ahead of time. Let them know that you don't know much about the faith, but are willing to meet with the family half way to make them comfortable. Chances are, it won't be a big deal. For example, if it isn't a pain to move the ultimate frisbee game 10 minutes later so it isn't at prayer time, do so. If it is a problem, let the boy join the game after it's in progress. Work out the details beforehand so there are no hard feelings. it' all about give and take.

[packsaddle]

This unit has had several Islamic families. Just ask them what they think is best. They'll be glad to think about it and let you know. They may already have the answer and are waiting for you to ask.

[Lisabob]

There is no place in the scouting literature where a specific deity is specified. Consequently, a scout pledges to do his duty to whatever he believes that word means, in his religious tradition. It could mean something similar to the Christian concept, or not - that is defined by the scout & his family (not the pack, or the BSA) & doesn't require any kind of public statement on the scout's part.

 

Treat him just like you treat every single other boy in the pack. If religious questions or issues come up, ask his parents to provide input. It is no different from having a Hindu, Jewish, or Buddhist boy (or Southern Baptist, or Catholic, or whatever) in your pack. Keep in mind that in all religions, there are different interpretations & degrees of observance. Just like not all Christians go to church several times a week, not all Jews keep kosher, not all Catholics regularly go to confession, etc..

 

And by all means, don't expect him to be an example for the rest of the boys - just let him be a boy in the den! That alone will teach the boys more than anything you might do.

 

 

[jamist649]

Thanks so much for the bountiful replies! I have no experience with this, so it's wonderful to see so many have. This family (I think) are converts from Christianity so they probably know what we're going through. This may help.

[Scoutfish]

"But I think Scoutfish has never actually dealt with it. "

 

WEll, yes, I have. But I guess that depends on what you mean by deal with it?

 

WE don'r deal with it actually,. We just treat all boys as boys. WE treat all cub scouts as cub scouts.

 

The family was with us for twop years untiul they moved away. During that time, our pack never made any issues about any differences or dwelled on them. Did the family have 100 percent participation in every event all year long?

 

Nope, but the same can be said of all the rest of the families also: Vacations, oter obligations, work, sports, schools taking priority over scouting ,religious observations and restrictions, etc...

 

THis family may not have been the most strict of muslim families...or they may have been fairly strict. I really don't know since I didn't look at the boy as a Muslim scout. .. I just say him as a scout.

 

Every person in my pack has some issues, restriction, belief, code or something trhat causes them to not fit 100 % with everybody else. WEther it be against Decorationg Easter Eggs, Santa CLause,celebrating Christmas, birthdays, allergic to chocolaye, nuts, allergic to anything and everythiung in the woods to being allergic to humidity ( actually it was eczema that worsened due to high humidity)

 

Anyways, our pack has mand has had it's share of diversity amongst it's members.

 

WE just keep ourselves focused on what common things we have.

 

LIke I said, the scout may have to bow a few times a day. He may not eat half burnt hot dogs cooked over a campfire.

 

So what? Treat him for what he is...just another cub scout.

 

No issues unless people want to make them.

[shortridge]

I know you're trying to be helpful and open... but this --

 

"...and hopefully do alot to show that not all Muslims are extremists/terorists." --

 

struck me as exceedingly odd, even offensive. That's like saying that you're glad a kid from West Virginia has joined up, because he'll help show that not all Appalachian-state natives are banjo-twanging hilbillies. He's a kid, he's going to have fun in your pack, and he shouldn't be treated any differently from any other kid except for respect for his faith and cultural practices. He's not a walking, uniformed lesson of tolerance. He's a kid.

 

http://www.islamicscouting.org is another good resource to tap into.(This message has been edited by shortridge)

[Scoutfish]

I know you're trying to be helpful and open... but this --

 

"...and hopefully do alot to show that not all Muslims are extremists/terorists." --

 

struck me as exceedingly odd, even offensive.

 

It made sense to me.

 

in my area of soutrhern persuasion.... way too many people think terrorist when you mention Muslim. They don't all understand that Muslim is not a race or that it isn't a country.

 

After 9-11 especially, any dark skined person was harrassed for possibly being Muslim..even when it was completely obvious they were Hispanic, ASian, Indian, etc...

 

I took " and hopefully do alot to show that not all Muslims are extremists/terorists. " to mean the OP knos rthis to be true, but knows that once people meet this scout and his family, they will soon realize that not all people of the same race, religion, local, country, etc are exactly the same as every other .

 

 

[Engineer61]

I agree with the posters who say how well the Muslim Scout integrates in to a Troop depends on he parents.

 

One thing outside the norm to be mindful of would be activities during Ramadan, as the Scout would most likely be fasting.

[jamist649]

Oh good grief! "Offensive"? Please. Here's offensive: "I don't want no dang Muslims in our Pack cuz he's liable to blow himself up in his tent while we're camping one night!" TRUE STATEMENT from one of my parents. Thanks goodness, those feelings are in the minority in our group...but it's there.

 

THAT'S what I'm dealing with...I'm not going to parade him in front of the group and say "tell us all about your religion" but hopefully the group can realize through casual interaction that all Muslims aren't "bad".

 

I agree with Scoutfish, and have seen the same types of opinions down here in the South. What am I supposed to do Shortridge? "Hey, here's little Billy, shhhh don't talk about where he goes to Church!" "That's offensive!" Church is as much a part of life where we live as getting up in the morning and having breakfast. Life revolves around Church for most of the people in our group. Heck, we're CHARTERED by a Church! It's GONNA come up! Trying to dodge the issue isn't going to work and will be more "offensive" than simply asking them about it and having them explain that they have no intention of blowing themselves up at a Pack Meeting (and no, I wouldn't use those words)

 

 

[shortridge]

OK, yeah, that parent's comment was incredibly offensive. But also offensive is holding up a single family as representing an entire racial, ethnic, cultural or religious group. Lisabob put it far better than I ever could.

 

Church, synagogue, temple, mosque, no religious affiliation at all ... it doesn't matter. We're all Scouts and Scouters, and we are all welcome. Unless the CO explicitly restricts membership to members of its organization, being "welcome" in Scouting should NEVER be a question!

 

I'm glad that you don't plan on asking them to talk all about their religion to introduce themselves. From the way you opened the thread, it sounded like you kind of *were* aming to do that - I honestly wasn't sure.

 

The fact that this little boy is Muslim is just one thing about who he is, just like being Christian is one part of who most of the members of your pack are. He's probably also a comic book fan, a soccer player and a video game expert, just like most of the other kids in your pack. To elevate one of those things about him over all the rest is to make him a token above all else.(This message has been edited by shortridge)

[jamist649]

I still don't get it. Why not embrace the fact that we have someone in the Pack that may teach us a thing or two that we wouldn't have known before. We also have a boy who is a second generation Mexican immmigrant. He VOLUNTARILY did a presentation on Mexico, Mexican traditions, dance, food, etc...I guess that was "offensive" too. We all came away from his presention with a deeper understanding of Mexican immigrants and maybe we changed a few minds from "shiftless, drunks that take Americans' jobs..." to "Hard working folks looking for a better life...just like our Ancestors were" God forbid...

 

Nonetheless, I'm not trying to pick a fight, I just want to open a few eyes and show these folks that they have something to offer instead of something to fear. If that "offends" anyone, I'm sorry.