In the line of Cubmaster duty...

[AnnLaurelB]

I respect your opinion. As I said, everything in life is a judgement call. And everyone's judgement has different shadings, leanings, etc...

 

I used my judgement under the circumstances of the moment to make the call that 90 minutes+ was sufficient time for him at least to not drive HOME intoxicated.

 

I've taken the necessary steps to make sure that he's not allowed to drive church kids OR Cub Scouts, again.

 

He may have gotten a "grace" card from me the other night (which he may not have gotten from everyone, I accept), but you must not assume the "next" time (and there will in all likelihood BE a next time) that he will enjoy the same degree of grace, having used up his grace allotment with me, already.

 

 

[SeattlePioneer]

Pack leaders don't have an obligation to call the cops, and are not experts in decidinfg when someone may be violating the law.

 

We are entitled to use good judgment about such things.

 

If the parent was driving someone other than their own family, I'd be more likely to make the call myself.

[Scoutfish]

No, pack leaders may not be obligated to call...but as citizens, we are. WE are obligated to make those kinds of calls for the good of the public. I say obligated, but not necessarily legally required.

 

I see the potential killing of one innocent person outweighing embarassment in front of kids by 1,000,000,00 percent!

 

BUT.... I =was not there. AnnLaurelB was. If she did indeed keep dad there until a time when his level of intoxication was below the in ability to safely operate his car..I see that as trhe same as taking away keys until a person is able to safely operate a car.

 

Same as when I used to take friends keys until they were okay to drive.

 

I'm not convinced that 90 minutes is a reliable standard due to all people being different and having different reactions and tolerances, but if she kept dad out of his car until she thougfh he was okay to drive, they she DID ACT in a manner which kept people safe. At least for now anyways.

 

And honestly...in my opinion..it wasn't even about dad. I could care les what his opinions were. But it did keep the kids from being embarassed, horrified, and hunmiliated in front of there fellow scouts.

 

IN a world that too many people use black and white guidelines for a gray scale world...Ann did what I see as using good judgement and common sense.

 

I' m am assuming that if dad did get into his truck and was wasted drunk, she would have acted in a manner that was appropriate. Including calling the law.

[Basementdweller]

We have folks on here from every possible socioeconomic and geographic location.

 

 

True in the Rich Suburbs a drunk parent is never ever tolerated. So it is real easy to have a zero tolerance attitude, because you have never had to make the call. In the rich suburbs, the rich folks hire good attorneys who will make a plea deal and get the drunk off. I have seen it first hand. co worker blew 2.5 x legal.....after legal wrangling, he got a seat belt violation and wreckless operation. I couldn't believe it....The entire episode cost him $7k.

 

But ya know in the hood mom and dad are known to take at best a drink at worst shot or smoke. We have a lot of functional alcoholics.... In the hood, the poor folks may get a public defender or a cut rate attorney...the results are much more dire, loss of license and jobs.....

 

Laurel, I probably wouldn't have called the DE and had a talk with him.......if that didn't get him to straighten up, then I would have had a chat with the DE especially if the COR wasn't goint to do anything about it......The COR should have been the one to fire him.

 

 

[AnnLaurelB]

UPDATE!!

 

You know, I VERY MUCH appreciate ALL of your words and different points of view on all of these topics. It really helps to hear different facets of interpretation. I'm very new to this game; every day I deal with something within Cub Scouts that's foreign to me.

 

I was mistaken about the DC coming in on a black horse; he explained that if the *CO* decides to remove him for drinking, then he (DC) will send a letter to BSA and someone "up there" will decide whether to revoke this guy's membership.

 

As it turns out, the guy, the CC elect, the drunk... DIDN'T EVEN REMEMBER THERE WAS A COMMITTEE MEETING. I called him about 5 minutes til and said, "Are you on your way?"

 

"On my way where? No! I'm at the ball field. My boy has a game! Take notes for me!"

 

Um... he's THE COMMITTEE CHAIR! I GAVE him a flyer Monday night reminding him of HIS MEETING, but, being intoxicated, he had no recollection of it, nor had he mentioned to me ON Monday night that he just plain didn't plan on showing up.

 

Whatever, dude.

 

So my DC and my UC arrive, and ONE other Committee member: the Advancements guy. No CO Rep, (obviously no CC), no treasurer (out of town), no other-guy-who-admitted-he-only-signed-up-to-make-old-lady-childrens-minister-happy.

 

So there I am with two spiffy uniformed BSA reps, and ONE Committee guy. Hello?!? So basically they said, "Well, are the TWO OF YOU in agreement that he (the drunk guy) should be removed from leadership?"

 

We concurred that we were. Now, about that time the CO Rep DID show up, and the Advancement guy had to leave. So I told the CO Rep what had happened, the DC and the UC filling in spots, and the CO Rep agreed that the guy should be removed.

 

THEN the PASTOR shows up (he'd had another meeting before), and we told HIM what had been discussed. Poor guy--he said, "Oh, so you gentlement have decided to do such-and-such?"

 

I said, "Um...pastor? This is what I've been trying to explain. With Miss Betty (the retired Children's minister) gone, you're now considered the head of the Charter Org. You sort of own this thing."

 

He said, "Oh! I see. Okay, then..." Bless his heart. So he and the CO Rep (who both agreed that the next time, I'm to call the police) said that they would set up a meeting with him and tell him he's been released, and ask for his keys back.

 

The pastor is also a mfc counselor, so he's going to approach this more as, "What's going on with you, man?" and see if he can get him some help. Which is a good thing.

 

Meanwhile, the gal from the other Pack said that since she's pretty much free over the summer, she's going to come on board to help us figure out some stuff. We all agreed to strategize over the summer, then reasses when school starts in August.