Balance

[LauraT7]

Ok - lots of Dads - no Moms?

 

I'm still thrown sometimes by the male exclusivity of boy scouts. I don't think "scouting" in any form should be exclusive.

 

I grew up in Girl Scouting, and while my mom was our troop leader, camp nature lady, on the district committees, etc. my Dad was always involved too. 'long about Jr high, he officially became a girl scout leader. he didn't do meetings - they were after school and he was at work. But he participated in everything else, including every campout. my folks were "cool parents" and my friends envied me. Even if they did hold me to a higher standard (I thought)than the other girls.

 

Now, I am a single Mom. My ex has no interest in our son's school or scouts, or church activities. His loss. I got Jon into scouts because i knew he's love the camping and activities I loved as a kid. Good male role models are important, but secondary. I got into leading scouts, for ME. I love kids. I like Jon's friends, I've worked in the computer lab at his school, taught sunday school, and lead his cub den and now a leader in his troop.

Jon has always known that I do it for him - it's one way for us to do things together that we otherwise couldn't do - but i mostly do it for ME.

 

He will seek me out to share his adventures or his accomplishments -or when he is sick, lonely or hurt . He knows he always comes first with me. But he also knows that he gets no special favors over the other boys.

 

He can ALWAYS get a hug - But I'll never excuse him from latrine duty! LOL!

[SagerScout]

My husband and I both are involved. I was the first to jump in, he came in afterwards (kicking and screaming) but is now kinda liking it. We've not had big problems with our son expecting special treatment, but he did catch a huge load of teasing when I showed up at summer camp two years ago. You know, "you needed your mommy to come." I was there to fill the #2 spot, with everyone working we couldn't get two-deep all week without rotation. Can't say he handled the teasing well but at least there was no bloodshed. He left that troop shortly after, largely because of this type of teasing. Our new troop is composed almost entirely of parents who are loving and interested in their children's activities, and the "mommy teasing" is totally absent. I'm tickled to death that my husband finally got on board after all these years, he enjoys it and the boys enjoy him.

 

Now, in the girl scout troop my daughter has acted up in meetings (talking out of turn, rude to me) to the point of being removed from the meeting area. She wouldn't be like that alone but in front of the troop it's like she has to prove something.

[sctmom]

My ex-husband was my son's Cub Scout leader for 2 years. I was his Cub Scout leader for 1 1/2 years. Cub Scouting is different in that families are supposed to be involved. But with being the leader, I had other responsibilities. My son often thought that since one of his parents was a leader, that made him a leader. It was also difficult because when I practiced a craft or something at home, he was there and knew what was going on before the meeting. Then during the meeting he felt he should be in charge.

 

At the few Boy Scout outings we have gone on, he wants me there but doesn't really need me. Same with a 3 day class field trip. He wants to know I'm there, but I may never really see him all weekend. The scoutmaster has commented on how my son doesn't really need me. Now, he does want me to help him pack to leave camp, but I walk away from that.

 

Sagerscout mentions the teasing about Mommy. Our troop doesn't have that. Very few moms go camping, but some have. The boys don't say anything. I went to summer camp on the last night they were there. I found it interesting that on that trip and others, some of the boys would come over to talk to me about being homesick, missing their girlfriend, what craft they had made, etc. I don't think they were talking to the men about these things! I think they all liked having a Mom in camp!

 

[sst3rd]

We've had women involved in our Troop as ASM's for over fifteen years. On this level, it was a necessity in order to have needed adult leadership. But I found from the very beginning, that there was a positive dimension added to our program because of these women leaders. Just as was stated, some Scouts prefer to talk to a receptive women leader about subjects they need to talk about, but would feel less comfortable talking to a male leader. Our female trained leaders continue to add positive leadership to our Scout's program.

 

sst3rd

[Rooster7]

Just as was stated, some Scouts prefer to talk to a receptive woman leader about subjects they need to talk about, but would feel less comfortable talking to a male leader.

 

I can empathize with this to some degree. If my son was feeling sick or was having some sort of an emotional problem, I can see the advantage of having a woman in camp that might act as a surrogate mother. This idea gives me comfort as a parent. I want to know that my child is being cared for, and treated compassionately.

 

However, I do have one reservation. Let's turn this statement around and reverse the genders. Suppose we were discussing men in Girl Scouts -

 

some Scouts prefer to talk to a receptive man leader about subjects they need to talk about, but would feel less comfortable talking to a female leader.

 

This statement seems a little odd, does it not? Wouldn't a female leader be more appropriate for this discussion? Who knows more about little girls? A woman should understand a girl's fears and desires. I'm pretty convinced that a woman leader would be best qualified to deal with the situation. Likewise, I feel this would be true in the Boy Scout scenario. Yes, a woman tends to be a little more sympathetic. However, we are trying to mentor young men. Perhaps, sympathy (whatever that might translate into - in terms of an adult response) is not what the boy actually needs. I'm not saying a woman would not deal with it properly. What I am saying is, a good male leader is more apt to identify the fear or concern properly and know what the boy needs. If that sounds bigoted - I suppose I am guilt. I honestly believe that a man understands boys better than women. In some respect, we are experts - after all, we use to be boys.

 

[sst3rd]

Rooster7,

 

OF COURSE I was talking about the additional support of a mother type figure, and how she can add to the support of younger Scouts under certain conditions.

For crying out loud, does everything on this forum have to be broken down to the lowest possible interpretation????!!!!

Your "one reservation" stinks!!! Does everything have to be twisted into something sexual????!!!! Obviously so !!!! We're ALL mentors to our Scouts. Yes, we adult male leaders used to be boys. But that was long, long ago, in a galaxy far, far, away.

 

sst3rd

[sctmom]

Rooster, I also wish that the boys would feel comfortable talking to one of the men about being homesick or whatever. In Girl Scouts the girls would probably go to the men for "manly" things, like "I can't open this jar. Please kill this spider." When I am around the boys, I try to remember they are boys, not girls. Society has different expectations for them than it had for me at that age. Right or wrong, society expects different things of boys than of girls.

 

At a campout with the troop, one boy had hurt his arm earlier in the day. His parents were on the campout. That night he was looking for his mom to help him change clothes because his arm hurt. I refused to go look for her and told him that it was NOT cool for mom to help with this, just take his time and do the best he could. The dad later laughed, the mom was not happy with me and went to help him.

 

[Rooster7]

sst3rd,

 

For crying out loud, does everything on this forum have to be broken down to the lowest possible interpretation????!!!!

 

I don't understand what you're talking about.

 

Your "one reservation" stinks!!

 

A little harsh, wouldn't you say?

 

Does everything have to be twisted into something sexual????!!!!

 

WOWI really don't know where you are going with that statement, but I would hardly classify my thoughts on this subject as being "sexual". I simply made an observation about how men should be more qualified to handle boys and their problems. For some folks, I may be stating the obvious, but I didn't want that particular point to be lost.

 

Obviously so !!!! We're ALL mentors to our Scouts. Yes, we adult male leaders used to be boys. But that was long, long ago, in a galaxy far, far, away.

 

To paraphrase Shakespeare, "The gentleman doth protest too much, methinks."

 

Lighten up buddy. Try decaf.

 

P.S. I'm not sure how old you are, but my galaxy doesn't appear to be quite as far away.

 

[sctmom]

After more thought, Rooster comments on a female being more compassionate if a boy is sick. This is where I think a man can really come through as a positive role model. What a great chance to show that man can handle those "mom" things. That a man doesn't have to be dependent on their mom or wife when they are hungry or sick. A great time to show the boys they can be tough AND compassionate.

 

[Rooster7]

Sctmom,

 

I agree. As a generalization (oh no, now that's probably going to get me in trouble), I feel women tend to be too soft on the boys. Some men can be too harsh. There needs to be a balance. For some situations, it wouldn't hurt us (men) if we showed some more compassion. On the other hand, I think men understand that there are situations where we should be encouraging the boy(s) to toughen up. At the risk of being labeled a male chauvinist, I honestly believe that women do not understand the trials that most boys endure. They sympathize. They might realize that a boy is undergoing some sort of trial, but I don't think they usual understand all of the ramifications that are related to the male gender.

[sst3rd]

Rooster7,

 

 

Just wanted you to know that I read your response.

 

That's all.......................

 

sst3rd

[Eagle74]

Knowing I probably shouldn't go there, I'm going to do it anyway.

 

Rooster7, you mention balance. Now there's the key. Both men and women tend toward the ends of the spectrum; too "soft" or too "tough". Us guys tend to wear the tough guy personna to the detriment of some well-timed compassion or tend to make such a show of compassion that it's just not real - "see, I can be more compassionate than you can". Gals tend to have the compassion part right at times to the detriment of an occasional "just show some spine" or tend toward the "you can't see mine, but they're just as big as yours" extreme. Ahh, to simply strike a balance. (Don't look to me for the answer, I'm in the lacking well-timed compassion boat; but I'm trying hard.)

 

Men and women are not the same. Not physically, not mentally, not emotionally, not biologically. (Now I really stepped in it) But . . . . recognize, accept, respect differences and learn to use the best of the differences. We cannot be each other, but we can certainly coexist to the benefit of both.

[yaworski]

"Right or wrong, society expects different things of boys than of girls. "

 

The simple truth is that boys and girls are different creatures. I have one of each and I'm the stay at home parent so my daughter had me as a role model. I was amazed at how as a toddler she started using "cute" as a tool to try to get me to do what she wanted. Also, I was the diaper changer but my son never wanted to play "change the baby with a doll" (well, maybe once or twice) but the daughter loves playing mother to dolls. I do 99% of the cooking and by a strange coincidence, my daughter's two prime playemates' dad does most of their cooking as well but the three girls get together and play "kitchen."

 

We be different, men and wommen.

[sctmom]

"I was amazed at how as a toddler she started using "cute" as a tool to try to get me to do what she wanted."

 

I was shocked when my son as a toddler could pick out the best looking young woman in a public place and start flirting! He could do this before he could walk. If he could not find a good looking 20-something woman, he would zero in on an older "grandparents" looking couple.

 

I agree males and females are different in many ways. Some from the moment we are born, some from society's expectations.

 

The few times when I was a child that my mother had to spend the night away from home, we didn't have grandma come take care of us. My father took care of us. He cooked, did the laundry, and made us get ready for school. I was amazed to find out about men that can't even fix a sandwich for themselves. There are still young men today who have mommy come take care of them when the wife is in the hospital having a baby. Well, those wives already HAVE a baby-- a big one.

 

One of the biggest parts of being a role model is being yourself. I don't try to pretend I'm a man and can do "manly" things when I'm around the boys. I also try not to go to soft on them and remember they are boys.

 

I'm sure there are some things I don't pick up on as being a serious issue for boys or can't completely understand. One is about height. I'm 5'2". I have always been short. As a female that is okay if not preferred. I know that being the shortest boy in the class is different. I am guilty of forgetting that.

 

[Rooster7]

We be different, men and women.

 

It's refreshing that the posters on this board recognize that there are differences. That's not true everywhere you may go in this country. As the French say, "viva la difference!" I particularly like the posters who note that while we are different, each gender brings something to the table. AMEN to that.

 

Yaworski is Mr. MOMWho would of thunk it?! It's a little funny when you consider his hardcore attitudes on some of these issues (not that I necessarily disagree). It just doesn't seem consistent with a guy who stays home and changes diapers. No insult intended...