Being asked to step up to CC in a new-to-me Pack

[RipVanScouter]

I recently returned to scouting after a 28 year hiatus. I am currently a TDL in medium sized (70 boys) Pack that appears to fairly young (less than 10 years I would guess). While I have been enjoying the Tiger program, it has been a bit frustrating (parents who think I am a free babysitter, etc. and Pack leadership that could use some serious help with organizational skills).

 

Now comes the tricky part - we have a CC who is moving on with his WII son after B&G. No one has stepped up to take over as CC - not the CM or any of the other folks who have been in the Pack for 2-4 yrs. The CM and a couple other leaders have asked me to consider it (mostly because they don't like "dealing with council"), due to my experience (12+ yrs back in the 70's & 80's) and my comfort level with council (most are my OA lodge brothers). Trouble is I'm at my limit of time commitment - so I would have to give up my Tiger den (Tiger parents aren't too happy 'bout that - and would prefer that I eventually became CM). Pack leaders also expect that I take this on as a four-year commitment.

 

While I think I could really help this pack (if the leaders don't fight me about changes), I am very concerned about the Tigers successful transition into Cub Scouts if I step aside as TDL. The Pack had a less than 25% retention of Tigers last year - I'm expecting about 75% based on the progress and enthusiasm so far.

 

So I find myself torn between my commitment to my son and the other Tigers (and obviously the retention issue), and to accept this to help the Pack grow and (hopefully) run smoother.

 

Any words of advice, similar experiences, etc. would be helpful. Thanks for reading.

- Rip

[clemlaw]

If you ever see another guy with an OA flap on his TDL uniform, be sure to say hello, because that's me.

 

I was kind of in the same position in the pack we were with last year. (Our council has a pilot program for Kindergartners, in case you're wondering how we were in a different pack before the Tiger year). I think they had pretty much decided that I was going to be CC in a year. We were able to dodge it, because we had to change packs due to meeting night issues.

 

In the new pack, I think they have pretty much decided that I'm going to be the CM in about a year. Frankly, I feel a lot more comfortable with that, and I'm guessing from what you're writing that you would too.

 

I go to enough meetings as it is, and I don't think my talents are well spent running another meeting and dealing with the "business" issues that the CC should handle. I can do a lot more to help the program, rather than dealing with those things. While it would be nice, I don't think prior scouting experience is all that important for the job of CC. It's much more important for a CM (or even den leader).

 

Since you're in pretty much the same situation I am, I suspect you're also a better fit for CM (or continuing as Den Leader).

 

As for the "dealing with council", as is probably true with you, I actually _like_ going to Roundtable, and I started going as TDL without anyone asking me to do so. I let it be known that I can take on the job as our "roundtable person". Interestingly, after I made that known, I think we have more leaders going to roundtable than we did in the past. So if you volunteer to be the "roundtable person", that might take the pressure off. The CC will still have to worry about things like getting the recharter in on time. But you can be the one communicating things from the district and council back to the committee. Ideally, the CC ought to be going to roundtable. But if you agree to take on that duty, that might make the job seem a lot more managable.

[FScouter]

You are wise to understand that doing two jobs doesn't really work. One person can do one job well, or two jobs half-way. BSA recognizes it as well, which is why you cannot register in both those positions.

 

No one is going to automatically "step up" to a position. That's just wishful and naive thinking. The pack CO and CO rep and committee are going to have to identify some candidates, and recruit one of them. Den leaders and the Cubmaster cannot be candidates; others are needed.

 

"Dealing with Council?" Somebody's got a misplaced notion about that. What's to "deal" with? You file a tour permit when needed, turn in a recharter once a year, turn in advancement forms periodically, and take advantage of the events and help the district and council has to offer you. All simple stuff, mostly not done by the committee chair.

[dg98adams]

IMO,

Stay a DL then go WL or ACM/CM - encourage others to step up and get active.

 

One thing to bring up at the next leaders meeting - Leader transition plan should be a topic that gets revisited at least 1-2 times a year, so you don't have the "2-minute warning" from the outgoing cub Parent.

 

That also leads into over lapping training for positions (DL, CM, WL, CC, PAck Trainer, BALOO, etc...).

Keeping track of who has what and when, whats needed, and when is the next training is also a Pack Trainer task.

 

 

 

 

[ScoutNut]

If you have been using the Tiger program running TEAMS of Tiger/Adult Partners working/playing together, and using Shared Leadership among the Tiger Teams in your den, you would not have anyone thinking you were a "free babysitter". They would be to busy having fun working with their Tiger at every den meeting.

 

Also, by now, you should have had a good chance to see how the various Adult Partners interact with others in the den. It should be fairly easy to pick out which adults would make good future den leaders for the den. Keep an eye on them, and gradually give them more responsibility. Then, when you know for certain if you are going to be stepping down as den leader, you can approach them personally (with the approval of your CC, and CM) and ask them to step up as leaders for the den. If you promise (and follow thru on the promise) to give them any and all help they might need, there should be a fairly easy transition.

 

 

[clemlaw]

>>>>>If you have been using the Tiger program running TEAMS of Tiger/Adult Partners working/playing together,

[RipVanScouter]

Clem-

Thank you so much for your advice - that is an awesome idea. In fact, it's got me springboarding into looking at how the leadership handles a lot of the responsibility at the Pack level. They've basically made the CC job into "everything and anything that no one else wants to do - and then wonder why they have trouble filling the job. Hopefully I can change things a bit - before they become a victim of their own success (this structure/system is a carry-over from when the Pack was much smaller).

[ScoutNut]

Sorry, but I have been a "real world" Tiger den leader for 11+ years.

 

Every year I let the parents know - up front - what is expected of them. I let them know - up front - that they will be required to attend every meeting, and do every activity, with their son. I let them know - up front - that if there is an emergency, where they will not be able to bring their Tiger son to a meeting/activity they can ask one of the other Tiger families to stand in for them and bring their Tiger son - to that ONE activity.

 

In 11+ years, I have only had 2-3 Tigers who did not earn their Tiger rank award. Every year, in the "real world", I have 95-100% retention of Tigers, and they continue to be retained over the years, and even recruit new members to their den.

 

So, don't pull the "it's not possible in the real world" card with me. It IS possible.

 

 

 

 

 

[clemlaw]

Well, I guess I've never had the problem of being asked to be a babysitter. It happened last year, but I wasn't the leader, so it wasn't really any of my business.

 

But you informed the original poster that he had not been using TEAMS of Tiger/Adult Partners, and I didn't see any indication of that whatsoever in his post, other than a single offhanded comment about some occasion when he was asked to be a babysitter. Chances are, that didn't literally happen--the parent did not say, "please babysit my child."

 

Since the comment was obviously not meant literally, I don't think it was called for to tell him that this was evidence that he wasn't doing his job, especially since the thread was talking about something else.

[83Eagle]

I know this is off the original topic, but since it was brought up:

 

>>We had one kid who got dropped off at the meeting, and because of some weird disfunctional family situation, he was there on his own. Should they have just kicked him out because his parent wasn't there?

 

If it was one particular meeting where Tiger Cub showed up without his parent, I would keep him there, then talk to the parents when they showed up to let them know this is unacceptable.

 

The application form, which parents agree to when they sign, lay out the "parent agreement" including to "participate in all meetings and activities." If they are not going to adhere to this, it is their fault and not yours.

 

 

[ScoutNut]

I never said he was not doing his job.

 

The OP stated he was having a problem with parents looking at him as a "free babysitter". That sounds pretty literal to me.

 

I stated a way to avoid, or diminish, that problem.

 

Using the the Tiger program, as written by BSA, works better at getting families involved in, and enthusiastic about, Scouting. If the adult partner is in attendance at every meeting, and is actively included in every activity the Tiger does, you are not going to have the "babysitter syndrome" problem.

 

 

 

 

[clemlaw]

@ 83Eagle:

 

Again, I was not the leader at that time. It was a family situation where if she would have said that, I suspect that he wouldn't have been able to participate at all. I also suspect that the parent had already talked with her about it.

 

She handled it well, and in effect, she became his "adult partner" for the entire year.

 

Obviously, ScoutNut is right, and this is how the program is supposed to work. And my reference to the "real world" wasn't appropriate, and I apologize.

 

But I guess what made me pipe up was the fact that someone had posted a question, and during the course of asking that question, he mentioned that he had been frustrated by parents who "thought" something that was mistaken. He didn't provide any details, and he didn't say that he went along with this erroneous thought process. I suspect that he corrected the parents in question, although perhaps he didn't do it at the first meeting, as ScoutNut knows to do with his eleven years of experience.

 

Someone with eleven years of experience is probably going to do a better job of it than someone who is brand new. So he has the experience to dispel a common misconception at the first meeting, before the parents are able to "think" it at a subsequent meeting.

 

But the original poster gave absolutely no indication whatsoever that he was not using Teams of Adults/Tigers in his program. Perhaps he was not doing so _as well as_ someone with eleven years of experience was doing it.

 

But because of this side remark, he is told, "if you had been using the Tiger program". Again, I see absolutely no indication whatsoever that the original poster wasn't doing so. He apparently isn't doing it perfectly, and he apparently isn't doing it as well as someone who is doing it for eleven years. But I think it's really out of line for someone to be told that they are not "using the Tiger program".

 

A Scout is Helpful; a Scout is Friendly; a Scout is Courteous; a Scout is Kind. I don't think those standards are met when someone asking a largely unrelated question is accused of not using the program. To reach that conclusion requires making a lot of unwarranted assumptions.

 

And as a relative newbie around here myself, I hate to say that seems to happen to a lot of newbies.(This message has been edited by clemlaw)

[clemlaw]

>>>>I never said he was not doing his job.

 

[83Eagle]

And as a relative newbie around here myself, I hate to say that seems to happen to a lot of newbies.

 

@clemlaw--I completely agree with you; this can be a vicious forum where assumptions are made and judgments quickly cast.

 

But I find the "ignore user" function works pretty well.