AOL, crossover, and Boy Scout questions

[83Eagle]

I'm a new CM this year. Previously, our pack would always award AOL and cross Webelos over to Boy Scouts at the final pack meeting of the year in May. This year, the second-year Webelos would like to target their AOL for the B&G in February.

 

So I have some questions that I can't find addressed in the literature anywhere, unless I missed it:

 

1. Can a boy earn the AOL and wait to cross over into Boy Scouts? That is, earning the AOL is one way he is eligible to be a Boy Scout, but if the scout or den would prefer to wait until the end of the school year, can they?

 

2. If a boy does cross over into Boy Scouts as part of earning his AOL as is usually the case, what can/would you do if the boy wants to be part of Pack activities for the remainder of the school year?

 

 

[AnaMaria]

AofL and crossover are two separate events. No, a boy does not have to crossover as soon as he's awarded AofL. He needs to be either a Cub Scout or a Boy Scout, though. If he does crossover, you could still have him as a guest at your Cub events, but if he's that interested perhaps he should remain in Cubs for a while.

 

We're bucking tradition in our pack this year. We've traditionally awarded AofL and had boys crossover at our Blue and Gold in April. Our guys will be crossing in February this year. We're still working out when AofL will be awarded. Some will have the requirements finished this week. (I'm parent and den leader for one as well as Committee Chair, so I'm trying to balance my personal wants with what is reasonable and works best for the boys involved and the pack.)

[Eagle92]

While receiving AOL and Crossing over are two separate activities, they are usually combined and done at one time b/c most Webelos are ready to move on to Boy Scouts, and let the fun really begin. By earnign AOL they should be ready and willing to move up.

 

But if you have soem who want to stay behind a little longer, then by all means let them.

[perdidochas]

Well, May seems a little late for a crossover. Most troops would like the crossover in March or April, so that the new Scouts can go on at least one campout with the troop as a scout before summer camp.

 

1. Yes, AOL is not the same as crossover.

2. Crossover isn't part of AOL. Crossover is after AOL. Have an AOL ceremony, and then have the crossover whenever they want.

[83Eagle]

We have some derbies that happen after the B&G. We've also added several new activities and a winter camp that happen after B&G so the WDL is concerned the boys will be a little bummed if they miss out on all this new stuff (basically, just when the program finally got fun, they're leaving it). But, they're anxious to become Boy Scouts.

 

On the other hand, there's no reason that the boys can't be invivted back as Boy Scouts, just as with other Boy Scouts. It's just they're not officially Cub Scouts any longer. This might actually benefit the interaction between our Pack and the troop we feed to.

[Stosh]

Why is AOL awarded only once a year? When the boy earns the award, he gets it regardless of when the B/G or end-of-year occurs. He can earn the AOL anytime before he turns 11.

 

To think that because a boy doesn't get all his requirements in before B/G is not BSA policy to state to the boy he missed out. He misses out on his 11th Birthday! Same for the Boy Scout that misses out on his Eagle when he turns 18.

 

There's nothing to say that some boys can't get AOL in February and move on to Boy Scouts immediately if they so chooses. Other boys may want to do the Pinewood Derby and hang with the Cubs for a while, their choice. If that upsets the troop's program, so what, he's not a Boy Scout yet and the troop needs to adjust their program to accommodate their new boys. If some new boy has never camped before summer camp, it's not a big deal, summer camp can accommodate them. I have yet to find a boy that can't quickly figure out what tent is his and get to the mess hall. Summer camps have been taking on last-minute boys for many years, it's not a deal breaker unless some adult gets their undies in a bundle. Maybe it wouldn't be the worse thing in the world for the NSP patrol leader who crossed over in February, has a camporee or other activities under his belt to take under his wing a newbie on the first day of summer camp. After all a few months earlier, they were both in the same den, duh!

 

Adults make too big of a deal about this whole transition thingy. Get a life, make it work for the boys!

 

Stosh

[ScoutNut]

Ahhh, Feeder Packs. Hopefully someone has mentioned to these boys that they are not restricted to just their "Feeder Troop". They can join ANY Boy Scout Troop they want to.

 

If the Troop they join is active, the Scouts will be doing their own share of fun, new stuff with their Troop. Including camping.

 

If they do attend any Pack activities, they, and you, must realize that they can no longer participate as Cubs. Pack activities are for Pack Cub Scouts and their families. They would be there as observers/helpers only. If you have a separate section of your derbies for adults, and siblings, they can participate in those, but can NOT compete against the Cubs.

[gwd-scouter]

83Eagle. You will probably get a lot of different responses to your question, since many Packs handle AOL and crossovers differently. I will say that most do the AOL and Crossover at the B&G banquet (ours was in February), but it is quite nice to give the Webelos Scouts their own special ceremony apart from the B&G.

 

1. Yes, a boy earns AOL at the time he has finished the requirements. No need to crossover immediately to Boy Scouts.

 

2. No, once he crosses over to Boy Scouts he is no longer a Cub and cannot be a participant in Cub activities.

 

If you have boys that don't want to miss out on the upcoming Cub activities, have their AOL ceremony at your B&G in February and then let them wait to crossover to Boy Scouts at the end of the school year. Besides, this way your Webelos get to show off their Arrow of Light badge while they are still in your Pack.

 

As far as Troops wanting the boys earlier: many Troops use summer camp as a reason to get the boys earlier and have them camp a few times with the Troop before going to summer camp. We've had guys crossover to our Troop in February, May, and last year just a couple of weeks before summer camp. I've seen no difference in how the Scouts manage summer camp among those crossing over early and those later.

[kari_cardi]

I'm a fan of doing AOL in advance of crossover, and let the boys who have earned the highest award in Cub Scouting wear the award as Cub Scouts. It should be more than just the final check box to move to Boy Scouts, IMO.

 

Regarding summer camps, our troop didn't care when boys crossed over in the spring before summer camp and my son's den ran late. It did make a difference to the boys and their parents. My son, among others, was quite nervous about committing to camp before he had a chance to get to know the boys and leaders that he would be camping with for a week. Several scouts did not attend camp as their parents felt the same way.

[Greaves]

I'm expecting some boys in my den to earn their AOL by December--so they get the cool 2010 AOL badge.

 

We will award the badges at Pack meetings as completed, then have a hoopty-doo Indian arrow ceremony/crossover on the OA dance team's schedule in the spring.

[83Eagle]

Thanks for the answers to the questions posed, which confirms my interpretation of things.

 

Regarding some of the miscellaneous points brought up--my view is these boys have given 4+ years of effort (and fundraising) to the CS program and we have a close-knit pack. They don't want to miss our year-end activities and parties but they are also anxious to become Boy Scouts. Why not do both and end up with happier boys in the process? So that's just what we'll do.

[SR540Beaver]

I'll echo what others have said. AOL and crossover are two separate things, though often combined and usually done at the B&G. But that varies from pack to pack. 83Eagle, you might consider getting hold of your Order of the Arrow Chapter Adviser or Lodge Adviser and see if they have a ceremony team that can do a ceremony for you. There are AOL ceremonies and there are crossover ceremonies and there are combination ceremonies. I'm a Chapter Adviser and our team does a crossover ceremony. We leave any AOL doings to the Pack. Often they will do their AOL ceremony and we follow with the crossover ceremony. Like others, I would encourage you to take a look at crossing your Webelos over to the troop of their choice in February. There are a number of reasons. The boy is quickly tiring of Cubs and dragging an 18 month program into a 2 year program causes them to start dropping like flies. Also, it allows them to get into the troop, learn the troop's culture and get some campouts under thie belt before leaving for summer camp for a full week. I've always heard that studies have shown (but I admit to never seeing one) that a boy who goes to summer camp his first year is more apt to stay in long term. Also, that kids who cross over in May and their very first campout is summer camp are somewhat intimidated by the challenge and will often opt to not go. Just some food for thought. Good luck in your position!

[83Eagle]

Ahhh, Feeder Packs. Hopefully someone has mentioned to these boys that they are not restricted to just their "Feeder Troop". They can join ANY Boy Scout Troop they want to.

 

Yes, but the closest non-feeder Troop is over 50 miles as the crow flies and about 90 minutes drive away. So while it's possible to go to ANY Boy Scout troop, it's not very practical, particularly for 11 year olds whose parents might not want to spend 3 hours every week taking their sons to and from Scout meetings.

[tdk101]

We broke tradition last year and had some scouts earn AOL and crossover at B&G in February. Our pack had always done it in May prior to that. There were some scouts that wanted to wait until May. All the boys in the den - including those that crossed over - were allowed to participate in all Cub events until the end of the year as a den. Our Pinewood Derby was in March and we also had a Space Derby in May. They were all kept in the loop with e-mails from the Pack and could participate in any of the events. We kept them on our e-mail list through the summer. We have a camping trip to an island that many of them still wanted to go on.

[kbandit]

As a member of a troop we do like to get them Feb./March to get used to relying on themselves at campouts. Every boy is different. It's nice to have the time to get to know the new scouts and their parents before we take them to summer camp as we do not go to our council camp.

 

Some parents have doubts that their son can make it through a weekend without them. We don't doubt it but they do. Another plus is parents get to know the scouts and leaders in the troop.

 

Our troop trys to do things with the Webelo den prior to crossover such as they came to camp with us last weekend on Saturday and then came to our meeting to practice for a flag retirement ceremoney they will participate with us on Thursday. But no matter how much we do know them before camping there are things that come up that are better known before a week away.