Tiger Adult Partner

[ManyHats]

We have a split family case where the dad has a different address than the scout. We were told by our Council that the dad has to fill out an application, since his address is different. Is this correct?

So the dad filled out an application. He was honest and we don't like what we see. Does the application have to be filled out completely like if he was applying for an adult leader position?

[bbender]

On the question of "does he really need to complete an adult application", the answer appears to be: yes.

 

The Youth Application has a box you check with a note that says "Mark here if the adult partner is not living at the same address; complete and attach an adult application."

-- Sadly, there is no "Tiger Cub Adult Partner" code for the Adult App.

-- So I assume you'd put the "code" as "??" and write in "Tiger Cub Adult Partner", maybe with a note that this is the supplement to the Youth App for Jimmy Tiger.

 

That said, my understanding is that if an adult would be rejected as a leader, that doesn't affect his ability to participate as a parent, and therefore it does not affect his ability to participate as a Tiger Cub adult partner.

 

Especially if that affects the boy's ability to participate, that wouldn't be fair to the boy . . .

 

Of course, since you'll be submitting an Adult App and may get the rejection notice, you'll want to address this up front with your Commissioner and Council contacts.

[ned_rothstein]

Sounds like hogwash to me. I have a different address from my son (two towns away), yet I am the ACM for his Pack, and when he was in a Tiger den, I was usually his adult partner. He only has one application on file- with his mother's address on it. That is where he lives 5 out of 7 days of the week. In addition, there is nothing that I have seen written anywhere that states that only one person can be the adult partner- it can be a parent, grandparent, older sibling, etc. It can be a different person at each meeting as far as I know, as long as there is an adult with the Scout. There is no reason that each person who might conceivably be at a Den or Pack event would have to fill out a separate Youth Application. Your second concern doesn't mean anything unless you can be a little more concrete about what you didn't like.

[ManyHats]

I've obviously not looked closely at an application in a while. Yes it makes it clear that if the adult partner/ScoutParent is not at the same address they have to complete an adult app.

Seems like discrimination. We don't make other parents complete a full adult app complete with references and a CO signature. I can see if the adult partner is not the parent, but just because dad doesn't have johnny as much as mom...

Normally the only issue would be getting the CO signature might take a little longer to get johnny registered. But this case is different. Johnny's dad has been honest and listed assault and OUI.

[ScoutNut]

Not hogwash, and not discrimination.

 

An Adult Partner is REQUIRED to attend EVERYTHING, and do EVERYTHING, with his Tiger Cub Scout. This is a full time one-on-one situation. If the Adult Tiger Partner does not live with the Tiger, the BSA wants to run an extra level of security on them.

 

After the Tiger year the Scouts are not required by BSA to have an Adult Partner with them at all times. They are in a den with a den leader and assistant den leader, both of which must be registered with the BSA, and have current YP training.

 

I, for one, do not have a problem with anything that might help protect the Scouts.

 

Ned, to be an ACM you MUST a registered Scouter. There is no need for you to fill out more than one adult application.

 

As for ManyHats dad - Why is the dad signing the boy up, and putting his info on the boys application if he does not live with his son? Where is the mom, or who ever is the boy's guardian, and whom he lives with?

 

Since it is the non-custodial parent signing this boy up, I would ask for some kind of permission slip from custodial parent, giving approval for the boy to register, and the dad to be his Tiger Partner.

 

I would make sure to use the position code "AP" on the adult application, and have the dad complete the online Youth Protection Training. Turn in to council the Scout's Youth application, the dad's Adult application, the dad's YPT certificate, and a copy of the permission slip from the custodial parent, together.

 

This man is registering ONLY to be the Adult Partner to his son, nothing else. If your CO does not approve of him as a Pack leader, then all they need to do is not register him again once his son's Tiger year is over.

[ManyHats]

Doesn't the BSA run a check on all adult partners regardless of address? That information is taken from the boys application. Why do they have an area for the boy's address on the top and an area for the parent's address on the bottom? If it's different you're going to have fill out all that info again on a separate form.

The boy's primary address is with the mom. That's because of the school he attends. It can still be joint custody. The father shouldn't be considered to have less rights.

In this particular case the mom did sign the form as well.

I don't have a problem with extra security and in this case it surfaced something we need to keep a close eye on. But if this boy had signed up next year this wouldn't have come up. I know how the Tiger program is suppose to run, but how many Packs actually get an adult partner to run a meeting? We always have at least 1 registered leader and usually an assistant.

Having the CO sign to get the boy registered can really delay things unless you meet regularly with your CO.

 

[evmori]

So the dad filled out an application. He was honest and we don't like what we see.

 

This would concern me more than the other non-issue. Care to explain what you mean by don't like what we see.

[ManyHats]

Assault and OUI

We have a friend that is in law enforcement that is running a background check for us.

The OUI was long enough ago to write off as stupid stuff teenagers do. We will not have him transport other scouts though.

The assault is a bigger concern.

[click23]

That brings up an interesting question, does the Tiger Adult Partners who have to fill out adult applications have to be approved by the CC and the CO?

[shortridge]

As for ManyHats dad - Why is the dad signing the boy up, and putting his info on the boys application if he does not live with his son? Where is the mom, or who ever is the boy's guardian, and whom he lives with?

 

Since it is the non-custodial parent signing this boy up, I would ask for some kind of permission slip from custodial parent, giving approval for the boy to register, and the dad to be his Tiger Partner.

 

Concur with what ManyHats said. An address is not an indicator of being a "custodial parent." My ex-wife and I have joint 50-50 custody of our daughter - called co-parenting. Her mom's address might be on the registration form for ballet classes; mine might be on the form for Girl Scouts. But we're both her parents.

 

Do you require a permission slip from parents when a non-parent signs up as their son's adult partner?

[ned_rothstein]

As I already stated, there is nothing that states that one person has to be the adult partner for each meeting/event. So does every possible person need to fill out an adult application??? I was my son's adult partner before I became ACM, and my ex-wife signed him up using her address, since that is where he lives most of the time. I was NEVER asked to fill out any paperwork to be his adult partner, nor was my dad asked to fill out anything for the occasional meeting that he attended in my place.

 

I'm not trying to be argumentative here. Show me the rulebook, and I will be happy to eat my hat. And unless he is actually applying to be a leader beyond working with his own son as a Tiger Partner, I wouldn't be so quick to run a background check without his permission.

[ManyHats]

CO didn't really want to sign the Adult Partner app. We explained the boy could not join without the AP app and eased CO's mind by saying we would have a check run. The check will not be public regardless of what is turned up.

[NJCubScouter]

I guess I should point out when I post in the Cub Scout forum that I have not actually been a "CubScouter" in about 8 years, despite my account name. I do not recall hearing about this issue back then, and I did not know that a Tiger adult partner not residing with his/her son has to fill out an application.

 

I can understand the CO (CR?) not wanting to sign the application. I would be reluctant to sign it too. But that's one of the reasons why this seems unfair. Tiger adult partner is not a leadership position. This man is not asking to be entrusted with other peoples' children. He is merely asking to be able to participate with his own son, and it appears from the facts given that the boy's Mom is ok with that. If there was an issue with whether it is appropriate for this man to be in charge of his own son, that would would be an issue for his ex-wife, and/or the child welfare agency (or whatever it might be called in your state), and the courts. And of course if there were a court order limiting the man's contact with his son, that would be a different story. But there is no suggestion that that is the case, and therefore I don't see why this guy is treated any differently from someone who lives with his child.

 

What really surprises me the most is not that the man has to fill out the application, but that it requires the normal signatures as if he is going to be a leader, or the son can't join. He is not going to be a leader! There might be some benefit to having the application filled out, by ALL Tiger adult partners, whether residing with the boy or not, BUT only for informational purposes -- not submitted to council and not signed. Otherwise you have the CR put in the position that yours is being put in, and it's not really fair to anybody.(This message has been edited by njcubscouter)

[Scoutfish]

 

 

You might want to be carefull here too. If a friend is just doing this as a favor because somebody just wants to know... you could be asking for not only a lawsuit, but your friend could possibly lose his job.

 

Now,if the Co has a requirement that all adult leaders ( which doesn't apply in this case) sign off on a back ground check that is conducted professionally, then that is a different matter.

 

Looking at the youth application, I get the impression that the whole reason behind the secondary adult application is just for the info: name address, employer, phone and e mail address.

 

Not to make sure that dad isn't a psychotic individual who took time to enroll his kid in scouting. If that was the case, dad would probably be crazy enough to say that he was the parent/guardian who,s address the scout lived at...you know, to keep it quiet from mom.

[ScoutLass]

We have been told to never use the adult app. with Tiger Partners. If there are multiple partners for one boy who live at different addresses, they just fill out the bottom half of another youth app and we attach it to the original app for the boy before turning it in. Could just be our district's way of doing it, though.

 

As for running your own background check, I believe you have to notify the person you are doing so by law. It may depend on your state, but that is how it is in where I live.