Cub Scouts 2010

[Nike]

http://www.scouting.org/CubScouts%202010.aspx

 

I received info over e-mail about the changes coming to CS in 2010. I can't tell if this is a serious revamping with a concerted effort to replicate the exact same CS experience nationwide or just a rewriting/refocusing of the CS Helps Program. I tried to watch the presentation, but was having severe buffering problems.

 

Does anyone out there have any knowledge to flesh this out?

[AlFansome]

 

It's a shift from home-based achievements and badge work to more of a den meeting based plan. Whereas before the Program Helps tended to get electives (and some achievements) done in den meetings, the new planning guides tend to have pretty much all achievements done in den meetings (except for those that require family involvement).

 

The requirements themselves haven't changed, just that more emphasis on achievements is suggested (not required) to be done in den meetings. Gives the den leader the guidance and plan needed to get everything done in the meetings if there is no/little parental help. Sort of throwing in the towel, IMHO, but BSA says that retention is up during the pilot program, so there you go.

 

 

 

[Basementdweller]

Assuming the statics are correct, I think we all agree that retention is a great thing.

[eghiglie]

That's great that retention is up with the new method.

 

As a former Bear DL and Web DL, and now as a Scoutmaster one of the biggest issues I see is with the kids EXPECTING stuff to be signed off because that's what happened in cub scouts.

 

This is a great change by the BSA.

 

[rkfrance]

According to the plan, this is a total make over for Cub Scouting with regard to how the den and Pack meetings are run. All leader position specific trainings will be online by May. New leader books and info are to be out at the same time. The program is supposed to be redesigned to follow on a path closer to the current FastTracks program. Also this will be the beginning of the revamp. It will likely need some tweeking.

 

But as with most things in Scouting, it will be up to the Packs and leaders to buy into the program and implement it. I presented the information to our District Committee several months ago and even the more experienced leaders were quite excited about the possibilities.

[jamist649]

I'm on the fence on this one. While I (CM) preach to our Den Leaders to do all they can to help the boys stay involved even if Mom/Dad are little help, I also see the possiblity of (more) abuse from parents looking for a babysitting service; not to mention leader burnout.

 

[Scoutfish]

Well, I could not even begin to guess as why the change was made. I mean, I am now only in my second year of cubscouts. I volunteer as much as possible,and just recently became the ADL of my den.

The one benefit I see to placing more emphasis of reaching electives in meetings is that the scouts themselves might actually meet those requirements.

You know what I mean?

I have seen too many parents get "check off" happy and check off item after item just so Jr can add a few more beltloops or beads to his resume.

When I see a cub scout look at his car for the first time and that first time happens to be 5 minutes before the start of the pinewood derby...somethings not right!

Too many parents do stuff for the scout in order to make sure it's the best dam poster/ car/ t shirt/whatever ...that was ever done.

I see parents bring in the cub's books with 15 electives checked off since last week...and the cub has no recolection whatso ever about what the elective/ requirement was much less any single one check off item

Now, I realize it puts more "classroom" work on our DL and myself, but at least we know that the boys are involved and not over at a friends hous while dad put a 5th cout of laquer on thre pine wood car and mom adds the final touches to a poster that she workd on all week.

[ScoutNut]

It is the den leaders responsibility to keep the Scouts involved during den meetings, and to give them a good program. It does not matter if they are doing requrements, or something else entirely.

 

A good den program will retain the boys, even if they don't earn all the bling.

 

I am not of fan of this new program. I don't buy the notion that everyone now a days is way to busy to commit much time to doing this. I also don't buy taking the parents off the hook and giving them the babysitting they want.

 

However, I will wait and see what EXACTLY BSA comes up with. Without new handbooks to go along with the new program, I think things will be pretty spotty for a while.

 

It should be interesting.

 

 

 

[struax]

I actually am a fan of this new ad"venture".

 

I guess it does come from parents wanting to drop their child off to baby sit..... but what they get in reality is a lesson in how to grow up with the values we so dearly hold being Scouters. Now that is due to leadership of the Den Leader/Cubmaster

 

This type of program change will help bring cohesion to the boys as a Den and subsequently as a Pack. The Den Meetings and Pack meetings will have to be more like what most of us may remember as Pack meetings and Den meetings. A group of boys getting together to have fun and do fun stuff, all under the watchful eye of a Den Leader.

 

Being able to actually have the boys work the "Program" and the parents see how the program is suppose to work is going to be a interesting thing. Now the flip side of this is, Do the LEaders understand the "Program". From a trianing stand point i am really nota fan of what BSA is doing to the Training Paradignm. Having no interaction with other Leaders and sitting in front of my computer to earn my "trained" patch does not give the brand new leader any historical prespective that they could and would receive during "classroom" setting courses.

 

Anyway another rant for another time....

 

I like the CubScout 2010 and hoep that it will prove to all that the boys get more involved and stay involved for a greater lenght of time.

 

YIS

Scott

[Oak Tree]

This sounds to me like how we always did things. I know the official BSA advice was not to focus on achievements at den meetings, but that's pretty much how we did it anyway (and how a number of other packs do it as well). So I expect the change will make little difference to us.

[Scoutfish]

WEll, my point wasn't entirely based on acheivements alone, but also teaching and living the scout values as well.

What I meant to get at is trhis for example: We had a "drive in movie" night. All the kids watched a movie ( Derby Down) and part of it was to take a cardboard box, and decorate it as a car/truck/train/ whatever. Myself, I helped my son buld a tank with true barrel and hatch. I helped, but I always make sure that my son does at least 60% of the work if not at least 85% of the work in all of his projects.

But at the movie, it was obvious that some cubs never helped at all. Matter of fact, it was obvious, that some cubs didn't ever see their cars until about 5 minuted before the meeting.

 

Why? Probably because dad wanted Jr's car to be soooo great, he thought it would be best if Jr didn't touch it lest he "screw it up"!

Now,this wasn't any elective or achievement. It was just fun. Fun for the kids to build what they thought of and designed. Just fun.

 

Apparently, even fun has certain "parent" minimum requirments of show.

Had this been done at the pack meeting, the kids would have actually thought of, created and built their cars. They may not have passed Highway Safety Guidlines, but there would have been fun as well as letting them use their imagination, get experience building, and doing things for themselves.

 

It is along those lines that I agree with more stuff being done at meetings instead of at home.

 

 

At the meetings, the Cubs actually participate in Cub activities!

[Twocubdad]

Hmmmmm....

 

When I would do recruitment talks at school roundups, one of my main points with the parents was that Cub Scouts was a program which gave them the opportunity for meaningful interaction with their sons. One of the first requirements is to sit down with your boy and go over the child abuse awarness phamplet. This can be a difficult conversation and not all parents know what they need to cover. Cub Scouting not only lays out safety program for you and your son, but gives you a reason to sit down and have that conversation with him.

 

The same is true for all sorts of stuff like home safety, phone manners, first aid, faith, nutrition. Not only does Cub Scouting provide parents all the nuts and bolts for these activities, but presents the material in a way that is fun for the kids. "Fun With a Purpose."

 

It seems like a usually got a good response to that pitch. But it now seems all along parents were just looking to unload the little toad for an hour a week. I suppose I'll have to change my sales pitch.

 

(Thanks to Eamonn for the "little toad" tag. I'll use that again.)

 

Retention is great. We can't instill Cub Scout values into boys unless the boys are in Scouts. But isn't family involvement one of the values of Cub Scouting? Are we just throwing in the towel on parent involvement?

 

One of you guys who has trained on the new program help me see the light here. If I want to understand this, which of the online training modules explains this best. (I won't sit through DL Basic again, but I'll invest an hour on the computer.)

[ScoutNut]

There is no training out yet for "Cub Scouts 2010". Just the blurbs, and the pilot Fast Tracks program, on the National site. We will not know anything solid about this new program until later in the year.

 

As for the parents doing all of the work on Pinewood Derby cars, or other take-home projects, that will not change with the new program. BSA will not be mandating that every little thing be done in den and Pack meetings.

 

Not sure what things your den does now at their meetings if they are not doing Cub Scout activities. Currently, everything you do with your Cubs should pertain, in some way, to one of the Purposes of Cub Scouting, or one of the 12 Core Values. If that is not how you are running your Cub program now than that is NOT a programming problem.

 

[Scoutfish]

"As for the parents doing all of the work on Pinewood Derby cars, or other take-home projects, that will not change with the new program. BSA will not be mandating that every little thing be done in den and Pack meetings."

 

And you are absolutely right! BUT....at least during a den meeting the Cubs will get some participation in. At home, they probably wont. The idea I see behind this is: Any extra activity that the Cubs do at a meeting , is just that...stuff THEY do. And everything a Cub does himself, is one less thing a parent did for him.

 

Is the new program gonna be perfect? I doubt it! Matter of fact, I don't even know what it curtails. But if it gets any existing cubs more involved with activities, and put them in a position of greater personal participation...then it's definantly in the right direction!

As for cubs who do pretty much everything for themselvs anyway..they probably won't notice any change at all except wher it's done at!

 

[trainerlady]

When I started out as a DL 4 years ago I left the advancement to the parents as I was taught in Leader training classes. It was TC year. By Christmas the only boy that had advanced to Bobcat was mine. Even the ADLs kids hadn't made it. The only activities signed off were the ones we'd done for "do with den" or "go see it", and only because I was Akela for those activities. You should've seen the looks we got when my son go this Bobcat.

 

Please note that for the 3 months leading up to the "night", I had been telling the parents to go through their sons' books and sign things off. I even sent out email newsletters with exactly what we did (but they were there and active as TC partners)and what page to sign. Still no signatures. It took the threat of no awards at B&G to get the parents to sign the $%^& books.

 

From that point on I have done my own version of fastracks/2010 whatever you want to call it. It works the kids advance, we have fun and learn. The parents have to stay, pack rules. And they are put to work - logging sign offs; assisting with a craft; assiting with reading/writing/spelling; potty breaks; etc. I AM NOT THEIR BABYSITTER, and they know it.

 

I know my way works and I've had success. But because it's not the BSA way and the training way I've been made to feel like a rule breaker at leader trainings and events. I'm a "rogue", an example of what not to do. But I've had 100% retention and 100% advancement with my original group of TCs. We are now Webelos I all with 13-15 pins. All are planning for next year when we join a troop. 3 boys are "planning" for their Eagle trail.

 

Of the previous 4 groups of Webelos to crossover only 1 boy in the 15 that went is still scouting. Only 3 even continued with a troop, but for less than a month each. No leaders before me did any advancement in the den. No one before me held the boys accountable for their work.

 

Advancement in the den works, but it must be thought out and dynamic. I see a great future for Cubs if this new program can get up an running. I see disaster if training staffs, leadership don't buy in to it. Taining staff buy in will be a BIG problem in my area. We're stuck in the "Leave it to Beaver" zone.