Should Roundtable be a joint venue?

[tdyer56]

For those individuals that are involved in both levels of scouting, I would suggest that the other leaders that attend share the info. KISMIF. Kepp it secret, Make it fail. The information discussed at roundtable should be shared with all leaders to make it effective.

 

If someone feels as if they are missing out, then that seems to be a problem within that unit.

 

Tim Dyer

[jbroganjr]

You are the RT commish, it is your job to mediate the round table. You are responsible for the program content of the RT, much like the CM is responsible for planning pack night.

 

No Songs???? No wonder the RT's are no fun. You have been commanded to run a no fun program.

 

Stand up. Get a copy of the Cub Scout Round Table Guide if you do not have it. Every month is a song! A ceremony! A game. RT without songs or games is not round table. I include this on the boy scout side too! at least a song!

 

Start with a song that is not so silly (read fun here), like Your a Grand Old Flag or God bless America. You have introduced a song, made it part of the agenda. Follow that agenda every month and add to it.

 

Unfortunately, Rome wasn't built in a day. My question to you, is your district suffering from the "younger boy problem" (cub scouts?) Well if the unit leaders do not want to have fun, come away from a RT with something to take back to their pack (ceremony, skit, song etc.) then the district might as well fold up the program entirely, because what you are experiencing is just the tip of the iceberg.

 

If it is the D.E. or D.C who doesn't like songs, then tell them to stand int he back of the room and pretend to hum along. RT is training, darn it and in the cub program, fun things are training. beside this is a program centered around the boys and these fun things are there for them.

 

You still have the right, if you find the resources, to hold RT on a different night. It is your ace in the hole. NO matter how many times the key three tell you how inconvienant it is for them, tough, YOU are responsible for planning RT program. Try to do this in the "catch more flies with sugar than vinegar" There ace in the hole is to get a new RT commish.

 

Thanks

J. Brogan, Jr.

CSRT - HAD

 

[tdyer56]

Okay, update time.

 

I sent an e-mail to the DC telling them that I was moving the CSRT back to the original night. I then sent an e-mail to the old DE to forward to the units stating the change and what they could expect from myself and my RT staff.

 

The old DE called the DC to ask if he should send it out (since it was a change and did not come from the DC)

He was told not to send it out. I then got a call from the DC. They were furious. I was told that I had no athority to change the RT format they came up with or to change anything for that matter. When I was asked why I changed my mind from agreeing to do it there way in the beginning, I told them "I went through training." The reponse....ready for this? "I don't care about your training."

 

I think you will all be happy to know that I did take a stand. I informed them that I would do it my way, the way I was trained, the correct way, or I would not do it at all. So as of right now, I am no longer a CSRT Commissioner.

 

Since that phone call. I placed one call to the right person, and now, people all over the Disrtict and Upper level of my council are in an uproar. I have more support than I ever imagined.

 

I did this for 2 reasons:

1. I grew up in Scouting and belive in the program. It works.

And

2. I was only going to do what was tuaght to me through training, which is the same training tought on the national level.

 

So that is the just of it.

 

Advice as to were to go now?

 

Tim Dyer

Former CSRT Commissioner(This message has been edited by tdyer56)

[scomman]

I may be to late to reply to this but in my district we have the roundtable at the same time for both groups in the same room. We look at roundtable as a coordinating meeting. We can get away with this because we only have one scout troop and three cub packs in the district and a explorer post.

[Tiny1pj]

Only one of the posts mentioned the primary reason for having the BS and CS RTs on the same night, time and location. Many of us are registered and active in BOTH! Especially in districts with small populations, this makes sense. We have fewer people in our county, the size of Rhode Island, than many cities have!

 

Other than the common information, and things like recharter, our RTs are seperate. There have been a few instances when the BS RT group wanted to join the CS because they sounded like more fun.

 

I usually find out from the RT leader (may be differant each time depending on program) what will be done. Since I am a Cubmaster, and will not have another den, I usually attend BS, unless there is specific things presented that I need. FWIW, I am occaisonally the CS RT presenter.

 

For the most part I attend the BS, since I am the troop Committee Chair, and often an acting Scoutmaster for camps. I need more information from the BS RT than from the CS.

 

For those of you who live in districts with large numbers of units and people, the seperate RTs make sense. But that does not work where I live.

 

Paul Johnson

[Tiny1pj]

PS. I forgot to mention that the RTs do not come back together after they have finished. Usually the CS finishes first, and it would waste their time to wait for the BS to finish.

 

Each RT takes until it is done, or a set time is reached. Sometimes it is less than 45 minutes, but we have 1 1/2 hours planned for the night.

 

Paul Johnson

[tdyer56]

Here is the latest.

 

I regreatfully announce that I have resigned as both RT commissioner and Unit Commissioner. I could not convince the new DC to let me have a shot doing RTs the right way, nor could I agree to do it wrong.

I stepped down as Unit Commissioner because I could not encourage units to go to a RT that I cannot support. As well as, I obviuosly can't work well with this DC since I would like to do things right and they want it their way.

Thanks to all for their support.

 

To Bob, thanks. The training I have recieved has made me a stronger leader. I know were to go and how to get many new resources. I am going to make the unit I serve be the best one in the district and council.

 

Because of the stand I have taken, I have already begun to be asked to assist with district and council events.

 

YIS,

 

Tim Dyer

Den Leader & Asst. CM

[Tiny1pj]

Good for you Tim. I know that it is hard to take a stand, however, you are starting to reap the benefits of that.

 

It is very unfortunate that some people are so stuck in the way they do things that they are unwilling to change. It goes both ways, in that BSA may be wrong and the unit leaders may be wrong. We need to be open, and use what we have learned to incorporate the PURPOSE and INTENT of what we have learned in training.

 

1) BOYS FIRST. If the boys are not why we are here, then we need to leave

 

2) BOY LED. Some of our leaders (at all levels) have forgotten this. If we do all the leading, then the boys will not know how.

 

3) Age appropriate. At each age the boys are differant. Cub Scouts are NOT Boy Scouts! They have differant needs, therefore the leaders have differant learning needs!

 

Paul Johnson

[Bob White]

Tim,

I think you handled things in a very mature way.

You accepted the job, took the training, followed the program and unfortunately ran into a manager who didn't. I'm glad you won't let your training go to waste. I'm sure you will make a big imopact with your scout unit.

Keep up the great attitude and happy scouting,

 

Bob White

[Earl 1111]

Tim,

I like it when a person takes a stand on their principles (I tried standing on a Principal once and almost got suspended from school, but thats another story)

 

I'm glad this experience hasn't soured you on Scouting and I'm happy to see that SOMEONE in your District and in your Council has thought to tap into your training and skills.

 

Question-Has the new District Commissioner been through HIS Commissioner Training???

 

Earl Dowdle

 

 

[sctmom]

I only attend a Roundtable a few times as a Webelos Leader. The parts that I remember and liked the best were singing songs, playing games, having an indoor scavenger hunt, acting out an advancement ceremony. Usually I already knew the "news" part from our cubmaster. The "fun" things were the things I couldn't wait to share with the other leaders and to do with the boys.

 

[tdyer56]

No, the DC has not EVER been trained. They don't care about training. That was their words, not mine.

 

I am a little unsure how they got into this position without it. Our old DE made the choice himself, without a nominating committee.

 

May problems have come to light because of my stand. I know that in the end I will "win the war".

 

I have already been asked to help on a council event that is 2 years in the making.

 

Instead of souring me on scouting, they have made me stronger. I have made the choice that everytime they turn around, I'll be there. In force, with my energy and passion for the program.

 

Thanks to all for your input.

 

YIS,

 

Tim Dyer

Den Leader

[jbroganjr]

I believe this information is correct as to the leadership positions of the Key Three of a District (District Chairman, District Commissioner and District Executive). The D.E. stays constant, as they are the professional advisor, (that may be were that statement that the D.E. picked teh D.C.) BUT the Chairman and the Commissioner are elected, together (on the same slate) by the district members (also called members at large and Training folk, FOS, membership, etc.) I don't know if commissioners vote, as our district runs great and we have not had this turmoil during my tenure as a RT commish and as such, I do not go to the "election/nominating meetings, as they are at the end of the year and a I like to steal back every hour a week I can.

This is normally done in June/July so that the "new" leadership can plan the next year.

There is always a person in charge of the nomination committee, and that person will call the election meeting to order, announce the results and hand over to the district chairman.

Changing the slate, while not impossible, can be difficult, as the D.E. HAS to rely on the D.C and Chairman for the district to work. To effect change, you will have to be involved on the district level (you already have a year, as RT commishes have to be reg. on the district roster, though you don't have the job, you are on that roster (charter), only now you are a "member at large".

Please note that council and district are different, though the jobs are very similar, the responsibilities are different.

I encourage you to keep up the work and work the program. The program, separate, RT, endorsed, encouraged by Philmont, National publications and the training you received all serve to help the cub scouter, to ensure a fun (Sounds like your district forgot that scouting is fun...with a purpose) which brings numbers 9scouts) to district events as well as council events.

Good luck

JBrogan,Jr