Oh My! Seeking advice on this one...

[ASM1]

I have spoke to him since we returned from summer camp. He called me on the phone and told us to leave the troop.

 

I do not know what his problem is with me. I think it may be that he is career military, and I am career civilian. I think out of the box and he cannot predict or anticipate my thoughts or intentions. I think he does not like me because I am a mystery to him.

 

He is now assembling his ASM's (excluding me of course, which is fine with me) and assigning them specific duties that they cannot stray from. ASM's now have to ask his permission to attend campouts and activities. I don't think I can be restrained like that. I am a free spirit and I move around to Cub Scout packs and other troops in our district activities. I have no intention to ask his permission to go anywhere or to do any activities I choose to attend. Now that I am seeing this new SM unfold, I am thinking he will self destruct very soon and the problem will be over.

 

ASM1

[Dan Williamson]

Ok. Not sure my question was answered. Where is it written.....If there are no written bylaws/directives/rules from the National HQ then ok, that alone explains a lot of what I am seeing in Scouting today....if there are, tell me how to get them...website or address or phone number. I also fully understand the Scout Law and Oath business but the reality is that sometimes, for the good of the boys who want to be Scouts and the Troop as a whole, certain boys need to be sent home FOREVER. We just had this exact situation. A boy did not respond to any leadership technique, appeal, request or discussion with parents. In fact the parents, as many are want to do these days, tried to defend the boy's actions against a room full of witnesses. VERY FRUSTRATING. If there are commonly accepted procedures then I would like to know what they are (some have been discussed here) but it would be more useful for me to know what the corporate body's rules are. I hate to sound like I am trying to hide behind a bunch of rules but I am trying to get a dysfunctional troop functioning again and I get a lot of resistance from the parents with the bad kids. I also am determined to not get sued. I am also doing this by myself. The COR is not helpful, there is no functioning Troop committee (working that one hard however), and the traing I got did not prepare me for any of this. I want to rebuild a troop within the BSA guidelines. Where are these guidelines? How do I get a copy?

[ASM1]

Dan, If you COR is not helpfull to your position, your sunk. I got an idea, let's you and I start our own troop! ;-)

 

ASM1

[Dan Williamson]

I have in fact thought of pulling up stakes and leaving this mess behind and starting another troop with the American Legion. They want to start one here and we speak the same language. (26 years-Army....and contrary to your SM we are not all bad...not all close minded....in fact we invented "out of the box", and the internet [not Al Gore], and lots of other useful stuff). Starting our own troop would be great. We'll meet every Thursday at 1900 somewhere between Tidewater, VA and Baltimore.

[Mike Long]

That's it? Nothing more?

Just, "Hello Mr. New SM here. Get out of the troop. Bye"?

I fail to see how anyone in the troop could support your removal without some sort of reason. You need to find out what those reasons are.

 

[Dan Williamson]

Well I have solved my own problem. There in fact are BSA rules and regulations...publication no. 57-492 and BSA charter and bylaws...publication no. 57-491. One has to special order them...an important clue...from where we know not yet but I'll figure that out too.

[dan]

Try here to order them www.scoutstuff.org

Link supplied by Bob White.

[ASM1]

Dan, Please see what you can find out. I looked on scoutstuff.org and did a search on the publication no. I got nothing. Let me know if you find it. I am very interested to see what my fate holds. But I think Bob White is right when he said only the COR has that power.

 

ASM1

[lasteagle83]

ASM1, your latest post that describes his behavior in trying to control the other ASMs finally helped me peg this guy for who he is.

 

This guy sounds to me like a control freak who's really, really accustomed to controlling everything and everybody, and transfer or fire folks he just doesn't like. He obviously doesn't like you, because your experience (Scouting) is a perceived threat to his experience (recent military or otherwise). That makes him very uncomfortable, so not only must you go, but your wife and son as well. And if simply telling you to "go away" doesn't work, he'll ignore you (and your son, and wife), and work every emotion you have (anger, frustration, curiousity of why a problem, etc) until you finally get frustrated and leave.

 

DON'T GIVE HIM THE SATISFACTION.

 

He perceives you as having the most to lose by leaving the troop. You're his convenient scapegoat; his hope is that the other ASMs will see that he got rid of you, wife, and son because you "didn't fit the mold", and they will get frightened enough to "toe the line" - HIS line ONLY.

 

As my father always said, "give him enough rope and he'll hang himself". He's managed to bully the committee so far; and he's working on the other ASMs now. Keep with the program; eventually the committee, ASMs, and others (with the help of your ally, the COR) will see him for what he is - the new bully on the playground.

 

[ASM1]

The AXE has fallen.

 

I am going to do something I rarely do, I am going to copy and email I just received from one of the ASM's of this troop. This ASM's wife is also the CC. I am still trying to get in touch with the COR. Copy of email follows.

 

It is time that somebody stated the facts clearly:

 

It is my understanding that you are no longer an ASM in Troop &^*. Your attendance at the NorthGrum flag ceremony, while commendable, was as the parent of an individual Boy Scout.

 

Please do not bother to attend the leader meeting tomorrow. You are no longer an adult leader and not welcome in my home. I will turn you away at the door. My patience and diplomacy have limits, and those were surpassed some time ago.

 

And please don't waste both our time with a lengthy email response. As you have noted recently, I will not engage in pointless electronic diatribe. I will simply not respond.

 

From one individual to another, I suggest you consider looking for a new troop home.

 

ASM (name removed to protect)

(This message has been edited by ASM1)

[Quixote]

Sounds like none of the ASM's or the SM is trained as well - they should know that they can't keep a parent from attending a meeting, let alone a registered leader.

 

I hope you get some satisfaction from these people, but in the end, it sounds like the rest of the troop is in agreement with the SM.

 

Have you ever thought of seeing if the COR want's to retire for a while and have the CO appoint you as the COR - that would be very interesting....

 

Good luck - I think i'd be looking for a new troop.

[sctmom]

ASM1,

After your last update, I had to read back through the whole thread again. Have any of these people said exactly what you did that was so wrong? Or just is it "we don't like you"?

 

[OldGreyEagle]

What in the world did you do, or rather, what in the world do "they" think you did?

 

You must have some idea, just how did it get this extreme?

 

You said you were a bit of a free spirit, is this what they are referring too? Can you give an example of what you may have done that the SM and at least this ASM would make them want to shun you?

 

I have to be missing sonething

[ASM1]

What I did was make a complaint that the new SM was nowhere to be found at summer camp and was not participating in the troop functions while at summer camp. That was it. Nothing else was done by me or any member of my family to this troop. I thought it was a valid concern and brought it to our CC. This was the reaction.

 

Sounds like fair BSA policy doesn't it.

[Rooster7]

ASM1,

 

Here's a thought...Join the chartering organization, volunteer regularly, work your way up the ladder, become the COR and/or the IH, and fire the new the Scoutmaster. Wouldn't that be something! Sorry to hear of your situation. It sounds ugly. Frankly, given all the ongoing ugliness that you'd have to deal with in order to bring about change, I would leave that sinking ship. Or, to turnabout an old cigarette ad - "I'd rather switch than fight!" Save yourself the ulcer and put yourself and your family in a friendly troop that believes in the Scout oath and law.