Bears and Webelos in the same den

[AKdenldr]

Who we are: My husband has led a den of 5 boys since tigers. They are 4th grade Webelos now. The den is successful (productive and fun) and all 5 boys will have AOL sometime this spring. I am leading a wolf den of 8 which is also successful. We have had a lot of fun, boys are growing and most are earning their achievements. Overall we have parents who will help out if asked directly and will work with their boys at home. Our pack is young, leadership is learning and developing.

 

The challenge: Suddenly the Bear leader between us resigned and her son pulled out, leaving 3 boys. That den's program was not as active and they had accomplished little as a den in the last year. My husband offered to absorb the 3 remaining boys, keep them in scouting, and provide a better experience. The idea is that the 3 boys would stay with his den till the original 5 boys bridge to BS. Then the 3 would join the younger den as the younger den was becoming webelos.

 

Here is the resouce we need: I noticed that many of the electives in the bear book could tie into the activity badges of webelos. Has anyone matched up the two programs and created a document on how they mesh?

 

Thanks much in advance.

[Buffalo Skipper]

The first year I joined scouts and became an Assistant Cubmaster, we had a Bear den leader go south and abandon the program. We also had a Wolf den which had some problems. The CM and I took over these as and met together (but separate). Many of the requirements from Wolf-Bear are mirrored, just presented on slightly different levels. We were able to use this and ended up saving both dens (recruited new leaders after the year was up).

 

My point is the Wolf-Bear programs are very similar. Bear-Webelos are quite different. For one, Wolf-Bear are signed off by Alela (parents) and Webelos requirements are signed off by the den leader. The differences in these two years is significant. The whole method of the program is different. Webelos dens can go camping without the Pack. And the program is designed to be a prep for Boy Scouts. Webelos work on the Webelos requirements as well as earn Webelos Activity Badges, for which there is no comparison in the Wolf-Bear years. Likewise, the Wolf-Bear programs have elective arrow points, while again, there is no similar recognition on the Webelos level.

 

I would not jump at combining these programs (Wolf and Bear) for the remainder of the year, but if push comes to shove, it is not so bad an option. I would not, however, consider combining Bear and Webelos dens. I would look for other alternatives.

 

Just my 2.(This message has been edited by Buffalo Skipper)

[dg98adams]

We picked up a a couple Wolves in my sons Bear Den...and they hung in until the Bears became Webelos...We had a couple DL's and (1 Wolf Dad) would make sure to target/sign the Wolf specific activities. It works, but it was hard to find games both groups could participate in once we got outside. But we kept 2-deep leadership and 2 dens that way.

 

I think when those guys became Bears themselves and worked with the new Wolf den they were better for it. Eventually they had picked up a couple boys and had their own den again be the time they were Webelos.

(This message has been edited by dg98adams)

[gwd-scouter]

Your Webelos Scouts are in fourth grade and will finish the Arrow of Light requirements this spring (meaning, while still in fourth grade)? Wow, that's fast. Assuming none will be ten years old in the spring as well, what will they be doing next year as fifth grade Webelos? Just curious.

 

Back to your question. I assume none of the three remaining sets of parents is willing to step up and be the Bear Den Leader, otherwise you wouldn't be asking. In my opinion it would be much better for you as the Wolf Den Leader to absorb these guys into your den and help them along to finish out the school year as Bears. It's only a few more months.

 

Then in the fall, those Bears as fourth graders can go ahead and join the then fifth grade Webelos Den. Many packs are not large enough to have separate fourth and fifth grade Webelos Dens so it is quite common to have them combined.

 

By this time next year, your now Wolf den will be a Bear den about to graduate to first year/fourth grade Webelos. The three current Bear guys, will have already had their fourth grade year in Webelos (with your husband's den) and will become the 2nd year Webelos in your den. Again, a combined den, but nothing wrong with that.

 

Good Luck.

 

 

[DeanRx]

I would advise a couple of things....

 

1) Absorb them into the Wolf Den for the time being.

 

2) Begin recruiting NOW for a new Den Leader. Flat out ask each parent of the 3 remaining boys. Remind them that THEIR son's enjoyment of scouting is directly linked to the amount of parental involvement.

 

The only reason I caution you about taking on the extra Den on a permanent basis is, once you do it there is not longer any incentive for any other parent to step up and LEAD. What happens if the Tiger DL does the same thing (hopefully not - but it could happen). Are you going to fold them into your den as well?

 

3 is a small number and can be incorporated if need be. However, I would reserve that option as a last resort after politicing ALL the other scout parents to consider stepping in as DL. Offer to hold their hand and help them, but you need to get someone (other than you guys) to commit to this Den.

 

Additionally, if you and your husband are the 'driving force' in the Pack and not one else is stepping up, what happens to the pack after your boys age over to Boy Scouts? Does the pack then die b/c of lack of leadership?

 

As a CM, I'll be the 1st to admit I raise my hand FAR too often to chair activities / events / etc... One thing I have made an effort to do is put leadership opportunities out there for other parents in the pack. Noone wants to volunteer to organize the campout? Then if not - we might need to cancel it. Funny how the sign-up sheet tends to fill up after an announcement like that.

 

Its really sad, but sometimes you have to GUILT TRIP parents into becoming involved with their kids. But in the long run most adults will find they like it AND its good for both the scout and the parents.

 

Its admirable that you want to step in and help. However, I would resist the urge to automatically 'fix' the situation, least you become the 'do it all' family in the pack.

 

Good Luck -

 

YiS,

 

Dean

 

P.S. Welcome to the boards...

[AKdenldr]

Thanks everyone for your feedback. I thought I would post an update. You all advised not to include the 3 Webs with Bears in the same den. Based on your advice (plus a few more reasons) we are not combining the dens.

 

I did sit down and try to map out the requirements from one book to another. There are some items that could be done as a group. But in my opinion, it would cause both programs to be scattered and disjointed if they were combined.

 

We are going to keep in mind the connections and invite the 3 boys if it makes sense for an activity.

 

In case it is helpful for someone else, here are the connections I found:

 

Aquanaut: elective 5e, e19, swimming beltloop and pin

Artist: e9c, e9a, art belt loop 3, e10a-c, 12a-b, e21b, 19e

Athlete: r16a; r14f, Physical fitness belt loop

Citizen: r3f, 3h, 3g, 3j, 7f, 17d, service projects

Communication: r17c, r18g, r18b

Craftsman: r20b, r20a, e7, e1d, 312h, activity at Tandy leather

Engineer: r21c, e4

Family Member: 6c, 6e, 6f, 10b, 13c, 9f, 9g, 9c

Fitness: 9d, 11e

Handyman: r14c, r14d, 17e

Naturalist: 6g, 5d

Readyman: r14a, r11e, e19d

Scientist: e1d

 

Thanks all, these forums are great