Pack Treasury Issues

[nolesrule]

"My point is that the scouts are being punished for what the adults in the pack, mainly the CM, are failing to address."

 

Don't necessarily put this on the shoulders of the CM, even if the CM is against doing fund raising. The CM runs the program. The committee is responsible for executing the budget (which is based on the program), and that includes determining how the pack will raise the required funds.

 

Some packs do fund raising and no dues, some packs do annual (or monthly) dues and no fund raising, some do a combination.

[cubbingcarol]

I don't know about anyone else's Little League but here in our town if we as parents want our kids to have a trophy (or medals, etc.) we have to fork over extra money. Does it seem fair? Not to my pocketbook, but hey, I want my kid to get a trophy (or medal, etc.) Should I expect someone else to pay for my share? No! This isn't welfare, I signed my child up and I was made aware of the potential cost. Same goes for Scouting. If this is the way it is and I was made aware of it then I will pay, after all I signed my child up. As for our pack, we as a unit get free advancement for attending training at our councils roundup back in the fall. Pinewood derby cars are paid for by the pack (we do popcorn and candy bar fundraisers) but we do charge a dollar or two for an entrance fee to help pay for trophies and patches.

I agree when someone said, if your father-in-law would like to see fundraising he should volunteer. It only takes an hour a week .

Carol

[aquaticeagle]

My other problem is that they just had a ridiculously successful year in popcorn sales. I forget the numbers but they did better than my pack ever did when I was a Cub Scout. When I was talking about them not doing fund-raising, I meant outside of the normal popcorn sales. So if they did so well in popcorn sales then why are scouts being charged for advancement materials?

[Basementdweller]

Interesting, then I have experienced a Unit Commissioner Overstepping his bounds.

 

I witnessed a heated argument between a UC, CM and CC about Pack financial record keeping. He said that if the books were not straightened out he would shut us down. So now I understand that he has no power to do any of it. Scouting is more screwed up than I ever realized.

 

Let me see.

Manipulative DE, who cares for absolutely nothing more than his numbers, including scout safety.

 

Power Hungry Dictator of a CM whose son does nothing wrong including bullying and physical harm to other scouts, nope never happened.

 

CC who is worried more about his rank and role in the Charter Organization, and pissing of the CM who is an elder in the church, leaving him powerless to do his job.

 

COR who is also afraid of the CM and wife combo.

 

Treasure, the CM wife who can't/won't provide a treasure report.

 

The UC who is power mongering, a Bully and exceeding his job mandate.

 

 

Thank god I left.

 

This non-sense makes me wonder about humanity and people.

 

Power corrupts, even the those with the purist of intentions.

[Karen_216]

Selling Popcron is fundraising. If they do not charge dies adn then popcron saels do not cover the cost of the program then they need to address the issue of getting the money in dues. My pack does not have a Kernal for next year yet. I let them knwo if we don't have opne dues will need to be 100.00 perperson to make as much as we get in sales.

We pay for all awards, even order specialpack event ones. We also ccover the scout cost for Bleu and Gold. We also gove out neckerchiefs to everyone as well as books of new registrants. We also give out pinewood cars to everyone but do have a cafe and sell foods that families donated the items for. IT ocvers cost of meldas and trophies and sometimers cars too. This we madea counicl goal for membership so got carts for all scouts for free from council.

Other events they pay as they go.

If pack has mopney in it's busget they should not charge for the rank , if they do not then they need to get the money somewhere.

They should addresss that when deciding registration nfees for the next year.

BTY-- where is CC?? He usuaulyy does budget with committee.

[evmori]

So this Pack sell a ton of popcorn. Where do the profits go from the popcorn sale? Does this Pack have a massive bank account?

[aquaticeagle]

"So this Pack sell a ton of popcorn. Where do the profits go from the popcorn sale? Does this Pack have a massive bank account?"

 

That's really the question of the day. There should have been plenty of money to cover these things but there isn't.

[shortridge]

Sounds like the pack committee should be standing up and asking some questions. The treasurer should have this information and be able to present it at the next meeting.

 

The CM may be forging ahead on her own because she's not gotten sufficient support (or, conversely, checks and balances) from the committee.

[scoutldr]

Ditto what shortridge said. Sounds like the PARENTS need to be asking pointed questions as well...and I think a financial audit by an objective party may be in order.

 

And Basement, if I'd heard a UC utter something like that, he/she would have been escorted off the property and invited to never return...followed by a phone call to the District key3.

[Eamonn]

As we all know very little is ever free.

The Council I serve has a Free Advancement Program.

It started out as a good idea, but sadly over time more and more requirements were added (Sell popcorn, allow the FOS Team in, make Quality Unit, allow the Camp Promotion Team in)

In the nd for most packs it just became too much of a chore, as it only covered one rank advancement patch a year.

I don't know what the cost of a Wolf, Bear or Webelos Scout Patch is?

I do remember that back when I was involved with a Pack, we seemed to spend about $75 -$100 a month at the Council Scout Shop. (The Pack had about 70 Cub Scouts.)

We paid for everything -Even the little card came at a cost.

We gave up on Den Dues they just never worked for us. Kids lost the money and Den Leaders had enough to do without spending time collecting and recording this money.

 

I would hope that no Unit Commissioner would ever even think about telling a unit that he or she could shut them down!!

Back when I was District Commissioner I think if one of my staff had said such a thing, we would have a chat behind the wood shed.

Truth is no Commissioner can ever do such a thing.

If a unit is having a problem with their budget the U/C can offer friendly advise he can also ask the unit if a visit from the District Finance Committee might be of help.

 

If you are not a member of this Pack?

Why are you so interested in what they are doing?

Different Packs spend the money they have in different ways.

Over the years I attended a lot of different pack events hosted by many different Packs.

Some Packs spend a fortune on the B&G, others spend very little.

The Pack I was in made money at the Pine Wood Derby by selling hot-dogs and snacks. We didn't go overboard on trophies, I have seen Cub Scouts come away with trophies that were taller than the Cub Scout.

As long as the Pack Committee is happy and are not having a lot of complaints from the parents of the Pack members? The best thing for everyone is just leave them alone, let them do their thing while you serve the Pack that selected you to serve them

Eamonn.

[aquaticeagle]

Why am I concerned? Why do I have to be personally involved in the pack to be concerned about the welfare of their boys? If someone is using funds for things other than the scouts or the program then anyone who knows about it should be concerned. That is what the worry is here. I have seen a lot of replies that makes sense to me here. Not all packs have enough money from fund-raising to cover all of the costs and sometimes scout families have to help out. That doesn't seem to be the case with the pack in question though. The account should have plenty in it to cover these costs but still scouts are being charged.

[Eamonn]

"Why am I concerned? Why do I have to be personally involved in the pack to be concerned about the welfare of their boys?"

 

Without wishing to sound rude.

I really don't see how a Pack charging $5.00 for their Pine -Wood Derby is about the Welfare of anyone!!

The Pack has a Chartering Organization, a Pack Committee and maybe the services of a U/C.

With all of this do they really need your concern?

To put it very bluntly, it really is none of your business.

I see no good what so ever coming from your interferences.

Even if they are making some mistakes, they will learn from them.

We lose far too many leaders because some people who think that their way is the only way get involved when there is no need to.

Unit Leaders main concern should be about the youth they serve.

Of course if a child is being placed in a situation that could harm him /her we all need to be willing to step up to the plate.

But other than that, let the people in the unit take care of the youth they serve and don't interfere.

Eamonn.

[aquaticeagle]

Those scouts are being harmed because they worked their butts off to make the popcorn season incredibly successful and now they have to pay for things that should already be covered. They are working very hard to pay their own way through popcorn sales and are not seeing any of the benefits from it. When a child works hard to earn some money and puts it away in his piggy-bank, it is certainly any adult's business if they see the parent break that piggy-bank open and steal their child's money.

[Eamonn]

If you are not a member of this unit.

How the committee decides to spend the money has nothing to do with you.

If the Chartering Organization has an issue with what is going on?

Then it needs to deal with it.

Let them do their job.

Eamonn.

[shortridge]

I believe aquaticeagle said early on that his father is a member of the pack committee, and asked him for his perspective.

 

I see nothing wrong with asking questions and trying to get a broader view from a group of experienced Scouters.

 

However, making statements such as this -

 

"When a child works hard to earn some money and puts it away in his piggy-bank, it is certainly any adult's business if they see the parent break that piggy-bank open and steal their child's money."

 

- can certainly inflame a situation that doesn't need inflaming, particularly with the use of the word "steal." Based on the information presented, there are no allegations of mismanagement of funds. Nor are there details about just how much the pack has raised or has on hand. Perhaps popcorn sales did raise a ton of money, but that was spent on giving some needy Cubs a free ride to summer camp.

 

The bottom line, however, is that it's the pack committee's job to handle this. They're well within their rights to ask for a treasurer's report and make decisions about the budget and finances. But my advice is to tone down the speechifying a wee bit. You and the people you're advising will get better results that way.