Cub Scouts Take Polar Plunge

[stevejb]

I do not consider myself crazy (although their are some who think you need to be crazy to be a scoutmaster). For example, they are a number of people each year who decide they need to take a quick dip in a hole cut through the ice of a frozen lake in Minnesota. Would I do that? No way! I am not crazy.

 

But this year in Lake Minnetonka near Minneapolis, Minnesota, hundreds of people decided to bring in the new year by getting nice and cold in the icy water. Crazy, huh? Well, what caught my attention this year is that a group of Cub Scouts decided to join in the festivities. Here is part of the the article from the KARE 11 website:

 

"They came from all over the globe, just to say they did it. Hundreds of thrill seekers leaped into Lake Minnetonka New Year's morning, for the 19th annual Polar Plunge. Organizers say 388 people registered to take the plunge this year, far above last year's record of 298. Hundreds more showed up and registered Thursday morning. In all, 908 people jumped into frigid Lake Minnetonka to welcome 2009.

 

"Among them, Cub Scout Pack 116 from Princeton, Minnesota. The boys recently learned their assistant cub master, Dar Durant, had been diagnosed with cancer, so they took pledges, collected money, and jumped into the lake. The money raised will go to help the family.

 

"Plunge organizers say people from Canada, England, Iran, and Jamaica registered to take the annual dip this year."

 

I have to give those Cub Scouts and their leaders the credit that is due them. They did a great job of putting others first and helping someone in need. I am sure this is one plunge they will never forget.

 

By the way, the link to the KARE 11 website also has a couple videos showing the Cub Scouts taking their Polar Plunge. I am not sure how long the video will be available so check it out quickly.

 

http://www.kare11.com/news/news_article.aspx?storyid=534346&catid=2

[Pack212Scouter]

Wow...while I applaud their intentions and actions, I can't help but be astounded that council would approve this, let alone for Cub Scouts. And if Council did, it makes me even more amazed that we can't take Cubs rafting or climbing, etc,(even with professional services) but we can let them jump into sub-freezing water in a frozen lake? I've done one of these and the stesses on your body are huge, to your heart, adrenal system, etc.

[Kahuna]

Why would they need council approval? They might need a tour permit, otherwise it's a swim. Looks like they had plenty of safe swim defense there.(This message has been edited by kahuna)

[Pack212Scouter]

Tour permit = council approval. As for the rest, a polar plunge is not a "swim". I'm not passing judgement on whether it should or should not be done as a Scouting unit. What gets me is that this is far more "risky" than many of the forbidden activities.

[John-in-KC]

I think the Council H&S folk and the Executive Officer of the Chartered Partner need a serious business conversation (vice a friendly cup of coffee).

 

Who was there to temper the youths' enthusiasm with a modicum of maturity? Cub Scouts is not youth led, it's adult led ... with a reason. We don't ascribe to Cubs the ability to make fully reasoned decisions; at least the last time I read the Cubbing Methods we didn't...

[Kahuna]

Since the last Scouting magazine featured an article on a Boy Scout polar plunge, I would assume they think it's a great idea.

[Bob White]

Would someone please tell us what safety violations were incurred during this activity.

[ScoutNut]

Actually there were 2 (similar) Youth Protection policies that were ignored.

 

1) Proper preparation for high adventure activities - "Activities with elements of risk should never be undertaken without proper preparation, equipment, clothing, supervision, and safety measures."

 

2) Appropriate attire - "Proper clothing for activities is required."

 

It seems, from an article in the Minneapolis Start Tribune, that the event organizers did not want them wearing their Scout shirts because of the risk involved of the shirts holding the icy water against their skins, and freezing solid. The recommended Plunge Wear is something tight fitting like a wet suit.

 

However, the Pack's leaders wanted everyone to know that they were Scouts, so they had the boys, and the leaders, wear their Scout shirts anyway.

 

 

[John-in-KC]

Let's start with Safe Swim Defense Point Two:

Physical Fitness

Require evidence of fitness for swimming activity with a complete health history from physician, parent, or legal guardian.

 

Point Three:

Safe Area

When swimming in areas not regularly maintained and used for swimming activity, have lifeguards and swimmers systematically examine the bottom of the swimming area to determine varying depths, currents, deep holes, rocks, and stumps. Mark off the area for three groups: not more than 3 1/2 feet deep for nonswimmers; from shallow water to just over the head for beginners; deep water not over 12 feet for swimmers.

 

Ability Groups

Divide into three ability groups: Nonswimmers, beginners, and swimmers. Keep each group in its own area.

 

From the Sweet 16 of BSA Safety:

Unit Fund-raisers

Include these safety considerations when planning a unit fund-raiser:

 

Money-earning projects should be suited to the ages and abilities of youth participants.

 

12. Permits and Notices.

BSA tour permits, council office registration, government or landowner authorization, and any similar formalities are the supervisor's responsibility when such are required.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Yeah, if I were the SE, I'd have my H&S lead volunteer come in, then I think I'd call the Chartered Partner in for a long talk.

 

This, simply put, was grandstanding. There were other things the CM, CC, and DLs could do to support Mr Durant.

 

[Bob White]

Scoutnut and John you have both assumed deficienies that are not in evidence.

 

If you listen to the story and watch the video you see the buddy system used, they have adult supervision, they are wearing appropriate apparel for the activity, they are in a controlled area with borders, there are look-outs with rescue poles. In fact most the scouts are being assisted by holding onto the poles the entire time.

 

There are no violations in evidence. Most of the conditions you say they are violating you have no evidence of. You are fabricating facts that are not in evidence.

 

You have no idea how deep the water is, you do not know if they filed a tour permit or not, you do not know what the skill level is for the scouts who participated.

 

Using only the facts that you are given in the story and viewed in the tape, there are no BSA safety violations shown at all.

[ScoutNut]

"You are fabricating facts that are not in evidence."

 

I did not realize that we had to present "evidence".

 

However I did not "fabricate" anything. Rather than simply going by the original news story posted, I DID do more research of other online stories. The comments I made were based, AS I STATED, on a story ran in the Minneapolis Star Tribune.

 

Yes, it DOES appear that many precautions were taken.

 

However -

"they are wearing appropriate apparel for the activity"

 

Again, AS I STATED, based on the story, and comments, that appeared in the online story from the Minneapolis Star Tribune, they were NOT wearing "appropriate apparel for the activity".

 

That, again, AS I STATED, was the basis for my comments that they broke some YP policies.

 

If the leaders had been LESS concerned with making sure they were identified as Scouts, and MORE concerned with the boys themselves, I would have been more accepting. However, after reading other news items, my feeling is that they were down right lucky none of the boys had any lasting problems.

 

 

 

[Bob White]

Scoutnut

Here is what youposted correct?

 

"1) Proper preparation for high adventure activities - "Activities with elements of risk should never be undertaken without proper preparation, equipment, clothing, supervision, and safety measures."

 

What evidence from the story and video tells you that there was not proper preparation, equipment, clothing, supervision or safety measures take? The event appeared well organizized. the activity are was reinforced and bordered, it was was not a hige distance to travel only a few feet, there were lookouts and rescue poles on both sides, the buddy system was used. There was nothing to indicate any of the things you stated.

 

 

Then you said...

"2) Appropriate attire - "Proper clothing for activities is required."

 

According to the Guide for Safe Scouting the proper attire for swimming is to be clothed. No skinny dipping is allowed. The event was a polar bear swim, the scouts were indeed clothed for the event in accordance with the Youth Protection Policies of the BSA.

 

The story and video showed no evidence of any BSA safety violations.

 

[BadenP]

Again Bob White violating the scout law,especially courteous kind and friendly to other scouters on this forum, makes me grateful he put me on his ignore list.

 

Safety guidelines or not if one of these kids suffered hypothermia, a heart attack, or a seizure this thread and event would have taken on a very different tone. This was not a well thought out activity by the adult leadership of this pack.

[Bob White]

 

 

Without the typos

 

 

Scoutnut

Here is what you posted, correct me if it is not?

 

"1) Proper preparation for high adventure activities - "Activities with elements of risk should never be undertaken without proper preparation, equipment, clothing, supervision, and safety measures."

 

What evidence from the story and video tells you that there was not proper preparation, equipment, clothing, supervision or safety measures taken? The event appeared well organized. The activity area was reinforced and bordered, it was was not a huge distance to travel only a few feet, there were lookouts and rescue poles on both sides, the buddy system was used. There was nothing to indicate any of the things you stated.

 

 

Then you said...

"2) Appropriate attire - "Proper clothing for activities is required."

 

According to the Guide for Safe Scouting the proper attire for swimming is to be clothed. No skinny dipping is allowed. The event was a polar bear swim, the scouts were indeed clothed for the event in accordance with the Youth Protection Policies of the BSA.

 

The story and video showed no evidence of any BSA safety violations.

 

What violations did you actually see?

 

 

[ScoutNut]

Bob, as I have repeated TWICE now, the YOUTH PROTECTION policy that I SAW that was not followed was "proper clothing required".

 

From the article that I read (possibly a different one than you read as it was covered by various sources) the LEADERS were QUOTED as saying they were told that the officials DID NOT WANT THEM WEARING THEIR SCOUT SHIRTS. The LEADERS were QUOTED as saying that no one would know they were Scouts if they did not wear their Scout shirts, so they wore them anyway.

 

Comments on the article went on to state that the officials did not want them wearing the shirts for SAFETY REASONS.

 

At the very least, the boys could have been better prepared for what to expect. As one boy was QUOTED as saying, he knew it would be cold, he did NOT know it would hurt.

 

 

BTW - Skinny dipping was only an EXAMPLE used. Please tell me where it states that "Appropriate Attire" means simply clothing while swimming. If you look at the online YPT you will see that the "Policy Exercise" used for the "Appropriate Attire" policy has nothing to do with swimming.

 

Bob, you are entitled to your belief that all safety precautions were taken. However, I too, am entitled to my belief that there could have been better safety precautions taken for these Cub Scouts.