A returning Leader, with a history

[Sarge]

Basement, I too feel your pain.

Not along the same means, but I, too, became unhappy with my sons pack and the CMs attitude.

We looked around and found a new Pack to join, and my son and I couldn't be happier with the new digs.

Even inspired me to join the adult leadership ranks.

 

Sometimes, it's just for the best...

[Bob White]

I never said that the pack should operate like that. I said that you were responsible for your den and not for judging other den leaders.

 

The fact that you took over for all the absent leaders was your choice. I would never have suggested that you do that.

 

Ever play team sports? If you are the third baseman, and you don't care for the right fielder, it's not your job to decide if he gets to play or not. Nor is it your role to cover for him if he doesn't show up for a game. Your the third baseman. Your job is to take care of the things the third baseman is responsible for. Nothing more, nothing less. Being on the team does not make you in-charge of the team.

 

As a Den leader your role is to take care of the program in your den. Not judge the other den leaders and not to tell the Cubmaster what he should or shouldn't do.

 

I think your decision your leave probably was the best decision you could make. Now the test of your scouting values will be if you can putthe past behind you and not go to the next pack and say unfriendly things about the people you chose to leave.

 

 

[Basementdweller]

It's not my job is a poor excuse. That is why programs fail IMHO, maybe this one needs to meet that fate.

 

If your baseball analogy means we should have forfeited that particular game fine then. But it seems we don't have enough player to even to field a team. You are correct that I it is irrelevant if I like the first baseman or not. But if he is on the field I would EXPECT and TRUST him to do his job to the best of his ability after all he is there by his own choice. If he does not do his job, management should do theirs and remove him. I would expect that, just as if I was inadequately preforming my job, I would expect to be removed. Our Success as a team requires everyone to at least show up for the game, even if they don't feel like it.

 

So Bob exactly what would have you done in that situation?

 

Would a better solution been to get back in the car and go home?

Would a better solution been to go into my class room with my den and shut the door?

One possible result would have forced the CM to deal with it.

Many others are less desirable.

 

Bob your right who cares as long is my den is taken care of, It isn't my job to worry about the rest of the pack.

 

 

(This message has been edited by Basementdweller)

[Karen_216]

Soubnds like you are felling liek you are being taken advantage of. You are right. It's one thing if someone comes as asks you to help them out but another to dump it all on you. Next time go to the leaders and say- hey, you need to come back here and get your boys I have my own activites planned.

(Sounds like what happens at work lots of times - you say look at this problem and then it becomes yours!!)

you need to do what is best for you. Our pack started having a few kids each year join from anohtewr local pack. We told DE and he said that the other pack was a good pack.No probelmes that he needed to lokk into. This year we had a whole den- leaders and all come over. I found out they had the only den doing everything.

The CM's own son did not even like scouts and the committe was basically non existent- they were amazed at committee meetings we have an actual agenda and that every den has a leader show up. That pack's loss is our gain as these parents are terific.

Meetings at same time/place can be beneficial but it sounds liek some other leaders are looking for their own play time.

 

[Bob White]

I would have explained to the cubmaster that I have a plan, resources, and adult supervision for the cubs in the den I serve, that is my role in the pack. If the other dens need leadership then the Cubmaster and the Committee chair will need to deal with at problem, right?

 

I would say it with a smile and tell him if they need to get new leaders I would be happy to help train them. Then I would go back and work wit the scouts I was responsible for.

 

If you asre going to be taking care of the other Dens then WHY would anyone try and find someone else. They have no problem. You solved their problem by being willing to do everybody else's job for them.

 

You are their savior and your own worst enemy.

 

Here's what else I would have done. I would have minded my own business. The situation with the other leader is between the pack administration and the parents of the Den, and you are neither.

 

That situation affected you only because you allowed it to. No one made you take resposnibility for that Den. The CM and CC should have resolved the problem themselves but you voluntarily gave them a reason not to. All the extra work and all your frustration was created by you, and now you are acting the martyr over it.

 

You are right, it's not your job to worry about the rest of the pack, its your job to do your job correctly. If everyone on the team does that it all works fine. If someone isn't getting the job done then it is up to the Cubmaster and the Committee Chair to fix it, not a Den Leader from another Den. You are as much a cause of your situation as the Den leader who stopped coming.

 

 

 

 

[BadenP]

In his own demeaning and callous way Bob intent is correct here, even though it could have been phrased much more politely.

[Basementdweller]

Baden,

 

I understand Bob is in his own little world where everything is perfect, enough volunteers, enough caring parents, enough money, enough training, enough boys, enough rules, enough of "fill in the blank". His world is black and white, My world is gray scale. I am not denying that his points are valid.

 

Some of us live in a less than perfect world and must make do. I am far from perfect, but I love scouting and the boys in my dens. I never felt taken advantage of or even the Martyr. I never said that, what I was commenting on was a person who abandoned the Pack and is being welcomed back.

 

 

 

 

[Bob White]

So given the choice Basementdweller would you rather be in a scouting situation where you had a good Charter relationship, enough leaders, enough money, supportive parents, and good equipment...or would you rather have the problems you have.

 

It's a choice. Units that have these things did not get them from dumb luck. There is no Scouting fairy that come in the night and drops these things in you r lap. They come from following proven methods.

 

Units that don't have your problem did't get this way by whining about other people in the unit and the job they do or don't do.

 

So would you rather have your problems or the successess that others enjoy?

 

It's your choice.

 

 

By the way, you never serve enough scouts!

[CubPack28]

Hi Basementdweller,

I had a similar situation last year, before I became CC in our Pack. We had a Wolf leader that signed up with her son, took on the leadership of the small den, and then repeatedly did not show up. Of course, the parents sat around, wondering what was going on, the boys ( one of them, one of my sons) suffered, was talking about quitting. We wound up recruiting one of the other parents in the den, but she wouldn't take on the den until this year, so they met with my Tigers. The Wolf Den worked on their stuff, with my guidance, and I helped the Den parents in my Tiger den, work through their time with shared responsibility. It wasn't ideal by any stretch, but it kept the boys in both dens interested, gave the boys in the Wolf Den consistant, fun meetings, and a chance to be the older boys who knew more than the Tigers and could be "leaders" of a sort to the younger boys and we got through the rest of the year.....

I applaud you for trying to handle a tough situation. And someone should have had the courtesy to say thank you for doing what you did.

I would not welcome that Leader back without a good reason for her absence last year, but that is me and my Pack. We expect our Leaders to be just that....Leaders.

It is one thing to have two dens meet together to get through a week because of an illness or unexpected problem, it is another to have the situation that you and I have dealt with, with no support from your Pack or Cubmaster.

In our Pack now, if for some reason, a Den Leader can't make it, they have to let me know, and we will have the CM or ACM come fill in for a night for them. We also have Den Coaches available this year, but it is a first for us. Thankfully, we haven't had that happen but it is in place if it should.

Not all of us have ideal Packs, it is something that we strive to improve, but it does take everyone on the same page to make that happen and it is not always as easy or black and white as we would like .

Best wishes to you as you continue on your Scouting journey.

Pack 28