A Young leader

[SctDad]

During my recruiting this year I found a young man whose cousin was signed as a new tiger Cub. Just a little background on what I know about him.

 

He is 18 y/o. I found out that he is an Eagle Scout. The tiger is his cousin and his aunt has been bringing him to the meetings to help out.

 

I talked with this young man today about joining us as a leader in the pack. Now I have looked at the requirements for leadership. According to the Cub Scout Leader's book, at 18 he can hold one of two positions. Asst. Den Leader or Asst Cub Master.

 

A little bit of how we are doing with our leadership quest,

2 Tiger Dens with Tiger Den leaders

 

2 Cub Scout Dens - One Den leader, myself and a couple of very involved parents. No assistants

 

1 Webelos Den - No Den Leader (I have one person who can do it as a last resort, but he has only let me know about this)

 

One ACM (No child in program, the guy loves the outdoors and wanted to help)

 

My CC says that he wants the young man as a DL, But Itold him according to the BSA he cannot be one because of his age. He says that it seems OFF that he can hold a position as ACM but not as DL.

 

I can Understand his question about how things work. I was surprised myself.

 

I had been thinking about putting this young man into the position of ACM, so that he can serve in a position that can be versitile.

 

I know that I am going to get som comments that the CC makes the decisions, but there is only two positions that this young man can fall into.

 

Is there something that I am missing.

 

 

[ScoutNut]

The BSA rules are simple enough, in order to be a LEADER you MUST be at least 21 years old. ASSISTANTS may be 18 years old. Nothing at all "off" here. BSA wants the leader in charge to be a full-fledged, legal adult.

 

Before you go and sign this fellow up, make sure he knows EXACTLY what his responsibilities, and his time commitment, will be. This is a difficult age (possibly why BSA does not want them in leader positions!). Their time can be VERY limited, and VERY inconsistent. School schedules, and thus available time, changes every few months. Work schedules are also inconsistent.

 

My son was an Assistant Bear Leader last year, but found that between school and work, he was missing more meetings than not. He had to step down as Asst DL, but still keeps active by helping out with some Pack events, staffing at Day and Summer Camps, and helping out at some trainings.

 

Also, if either the boy or the Aunt is the Tiger Partner, and they do not live at the same address as the Tiger, they must fill out an Adult Registration form.

 

[Eagle92]

Yes the 18-21 year age bracket is a tough time for young leaders. Been there, done that, have the tenure to prove it. Again full fledge leader roles are 21 and above, assistants 18 and older.

 

Don't quote me, but I think he can serve on the pack committee, something to consider. Why I mention this is that a committee member's primary role is support, and if his schedule is crazy that position may be viable. That way he is registered with the pack and covered by insurance, while being able to help out as he can. Again check out the viability of the MC role.

[Stosh]

By federal law a full-fledged, legal adult is 18. BSA rules is 21 and that's just the way it goes. It's kinda like the Venturing age rules. It's just BSA policy regardless of any legal adult issues. If BSA said 24 it would be 24.

 

Get the boy registered in a position, have him be involved as much as possible and groom him for when he turns 21. If he hangs around in the area he'd be an excellent resource for your pack.

 

Stosh

[Xtreme]

I think just because someone is 18 doesn't mean they are not capable of handling a leadership position. The assistant role is a good experience for them to grow into a leader when they turn 21. It will give him the opportunity to be in charge, but not have all the responsibilites on his hands alone. Coming from boyscouts he should have experience running a troop (like Senior Patrol Leader, etc.), but now he can get new experince being in-charge as an adult and viewing the changes and similarites between the two. I would just recommend that he is fully willing to take the time to be a good leader. It is important that if this is something that he really wants, then he will make the effort to be commited to your pack. If he is not in it full-heartedly, then you might get a routine of not showing up meetings on a regular basis. Don't get me wrong, I believe that he is fully capable, just make sure he is in it for the right reasons and is commited.

[Stosh]

Of course one can assume anything they wish to justify their ideas, but what if this young man has had 3-4 years of Den Chief, PL, SPL and/or TG experience and would be a better DL than the DL who comes in as a parent and is taking over for the first time with no training/experience? Kinda makes one wonder doesn't it?

 

Get the boy DL trained and assign him to a den. Just because it says DL and ADL on the sleeve doesn't mean much when it comes to working with the kids.

 

Stosh

[frank10]

Stosh,

18 is an adult, but they are not used to being legally accountable for the kids. It's best to give them time to get the idea in their heads that was a prank or a joke last year is jail time this year.

 

SctDad,

Keep in mind that this adult can not tent with his cousin.

 

 

[DenZero]

Since you're short on den leaders, I would sign him up as an assistant den leader, and use that as leverage to get one of the parents to take the main den leader position, explaining that it will be easy with an experienced assistant.

 

[Stosh]

Wingnut, I'm fully aware of the problems with this magic 18 number. Somehow this person is to switch gears overnight and everything is hunky dory. Real life doesn't work that way.

 

However, with that being said, some 18 year-olds are very mature and can handle the responsibilities and then there are 30 year-olds that can't. This is why I spend a large amount of time training my boys maturity and leadership so that they will be ready when that bit 18 comes their way.

 

Every situation needs to be evaluated on it's own merit. I do like the idea of having a DL that will oversee the process if this young ADL wants a little more hands on than just standing in the shadows of a DL.

 

What's really difficult is for the boy that was a tent-mate one week is no longer able the next.

 

Stosh

[Gold Winger]

"By federal law a full-fledged, legal adult is 18."

 

Maybe, maybe not. By federal law, you cannot buy a pistol over the counter at a gun store at 18. Also, I understand that you can no longer drink on a military base at 18.

[scouter-mom]

Eighteen years of age: old enough to commit to the service of our country, old enough to die in service of our country.

[Gold Winger]

Your point?

[hotdesk]

First, I would ask him what his interests are. Make sure that what the pack wants him to do is what he wants to do. He may simply want to work with his cousin in Cub Scouts. Perhaps he as truly enjoyed the program so much that he wants to share it with him.

 

Second, I would use an adult under the age of 21 for whatever the Pack Committee Chairman and Cubmaster and the adult feel comfortable doing. This would include anything from conducting fundraisers to working with the kids.

[Stosh]

There may be exceptions to the federal laws about 18 year olds not being able to drink and buy guns. In some places a 65 year old can't buy a gun either but a 12 year old can carry one. There are those who can legally drink before they turn 18 as well. With such hypocracy in our legal system, maybe that's why so many people feel it appropriate to make up their own rules along the way as well. I do believe that a person is considered an adult at 18 regardless of the exceptions out there that are designed to keep lawyers employed.

 

Stosh

[NeilLup]

There is one other possible leadership position. Not saying that it is a good idea, just an idea.

 

If he is registered as a Venturer, he can be a Den Chief, I believe up to age 21.

 

But I would suggest, as you have, that he either be an ACM or ADL. My thought would be that it would be more impressive to the Cub Scouts if he is an ACM. He still, as an ACM, can assist with a Den or two if he so chooses.