Pack Family Camping on an Island

[SctDad]

I have a question about a camping activity.

 

There is a state park in our state that has an island where you can go camping.

 

http://ncparks.gov/Visit/parks/habe/main.php

 

It is nice, I have been there before. There are facilities on the island like restrooms and showers.

 

What do the Scouters here think about this. The only thing that would concern me is that the ferry stops running at night. Other than that it seems like a grerat idea.

[FScouter]

Sounds like a great place. Around here, Cub leaders can learn about new places from reviewing the council list of approved camping locations. If it's not already on your council list, you could volunteer to do the inspection and get it added to the list.

[ScoutNut]

It sounds interesting, but I would have a few reservations.

 

What are the procedures the Park has in place if there is a medical emergancy during the night? You can't just drive to the nearest hospital.

 

Are the boys, and their families, ready to backpack in all of their camping gear over a 15 min hike thru hot sand? Remember you have 1st graders, and possible younger sibs, and families who are not experienced campers.

[Docrwm]

You have to be very careful about going on any BSA approved event with Cubs that involves using or crossing running water (in a boat). Perhaps others here are more versed in this but when I did BALOO training last year it seemed clear to me that boats and running water (as opposed to flat water) is a no-no for Cubs. An outing using a ferry and water with a current would fit that restriction in my book if my memory serves me right (at work and don't have my BALOO manual here).

[Buffalo Skipper]

Commercial operators do not fall under the S2SS, which is about unit led activities. We're not talking about the Pack leaders operating the commercial ferry to the island. Look at the Safe Guide under the "Transportation Section" which does not restrict commercial transport of Cub Scouts, rather than the Aquatics Safety section. Part of this directly defers to the US Coast Guard Regulations.

[Rythos]

"Around here, Cub leaders can learn about new places from reviewing the council list of approved camping locations. If it's not already on your council list, you could volunteer to do the inspection and get it added to the list"

 

I wish it was that way here. Our council refuses to keep a list and requires the Pack to Baloo certify each site they wish to use on their own. It would make things easier if they had a list so you get an idea of local places that have met council requirements in the past.

 

[Docrwm]

Thanks, as I said I'm at work. But the commercial operators part makes sense and rings a vague bell.

 

Would an outing on an island that requires a commercial ferry have a) any safety issues as one would be isolated and b) wouldn't activities related to water like swimming and boating be off limits even though tempting?

[Buffalo Skipper]

I have taught BALOO in my district for 4 years. The BALOO material covers a variety of criteria to consider, but specifically states that Pack camping can take place only at council approved sites, so what they are saying makes little sense.

[scoutldr]

The park website emphasizes that this is a "wilderness" area and that "insects can be harsh". I've camped near a salt marsh in the Summer before. Won't do it again. The mosquitoes can carry away your average Tiger cub.

 

Maybe in the fall or spring? Keep in mind that if a young Cub (or his parent) has a miserable first camping experience, he may be lost to Scouting forever.

 

The safety issue is a legitimate one. I would call the Park Ranger and verify emergency medical procedures. They probably have a plan in place.

[Nike]

This looks great for my Star Scout and his older buddies. But, I wouldn't even attempt this with my Tiger and Daisy.

[Basementdweller]

A lot depends on your families. If they are outdoor types, surf fishing and beach combing this might be a great trip. But those islands can be stifling in the summer. The bugs are horrible, I have been ate up in under two hours while surf fishing one night near there. No see ums, or what ever those darn little black bugs are. Benadryl was the only fix.

 

 

[ScoutNut]

Docrwm asks -

 

"Would an outing on an island that requires a commercial ferry have a) any safety issues as one would be isolated"

 

Medical emergancies would be the big issue. I am sure that the Park has precedures to cover. The leaders of the trip should know in ADVANCE what exactly those procedures are.

 

 

"wouldn't activities related to water like swimming and boating be off limits even though tempting?"

 

The leaders for the trip should take Safe Swim Defense and Safety Afloat training. Boating activites would not be allowed on a Pack overnighter. However, swimming, and snorkeling, activities are fine as long as the leaders are trained for the activity, and all BSA rules and safety precautions are followed.

 

[SctDad]

Thank you all for some very interesting points.

 

First - Medical Emergencies: I have this some of the way covered in that I am an EMT - Intermediate. I am also 4 months from graduating paramedic class. No this has yet to be turned into scouting forst aid certified, but I am working on that. For this I was thinking about this for an alternative. (I know this is against some of the G2SS books, but would be for emergencies only) I think there is an area where you can beach a small (less than 20 foot) boat. I wold take mine in and have it beached incase we needed to make a quick egress if they would let me. I will have to find out more

 

2 - Bugs: I would not go camping out there at this time of the year, it would be something that is definatly done in the spring of in the fall, when there are less bugs. We would help the new tiger parents get ready for this so that they can have an enjoyable camping trip.

 

3 - Swimming: I did not intent to allow the boys to go swimming, as it would probably be cold when we were there. There is still a lot of things that would have to be ironed out before we make final plans

[Docrwm]

Locally I've been told that our Cubs may not participate in any activity at our Aquatics based because it is considered to be running water not Flat Water. This, again as I've been led to believe, includes swimming. However, I can find nothing in the GSS section #II on Aquatics Safety that prohibits swimming by Cubs in non-flat water.

 

On the issue of boating, I agree that activities afloat are not appropriate under BSA guidelines for a Pack but per the training I received in Safety Afloat they are also never ok in the location described for the proposed camping - even if sponsored by a District or Council.

 

Canoeing and Rafting and CUBS SCOUTS is to be limited to council/district events on flat water ponds or controlled lake areas free of powerboats and sailboats. Prior to recreational canoeing, Cub Scouts are to be instructed in basic handling skills and safety practices. Does not include trips or expeditions and is not to be conducted on running water (i.e., rivers or streams) ....and I might add the Ocean.

[Gold Winger]

Bug free, it sounds like fun. Being on an island is a great thing becuse it is different.

 

I wouldn't worry about it if it was just me but since you'll have a bunch of Cub Scout and nervous nellie parents, find out what they do for emergency extractions. Sure you're almost a paramedic and that far exceeds my training but what do you do when Jimmy's dad has a heart attack at 2 AM. Will the rangers run the ambulance out on the ferry? Will they bring in a whuppity-whup? I know that most folks don't walk around worrying about a heart attack but there's always that one.

 

The likelyhood of a major emergency is pretty low but knowing what can be done is half the battle.

 

I know! Take an inflatable boat for emergencies!