Dropping out of Elementary School

[Buffalo Skipper]

Bob White, I guess that really depends upon you perspective. We have a pretty good crop of leaders in our pack, who do a good job of following BSA's Cub Scout curriculum. From my perspective (which is to say our pack's situation), I want to know how to reach the parents.We have our School Night this evening, and I am looking for a way to explain to the parents the importance of weekly participation without cramming it down their throat or ticking them off in the process. We explain it all clearly in our Pack Handbook, but that donesn't always mean they will take the time to read it. On those lines, we had a father sign his sonup last year (Wolf), took home a Pack Handbook, and when the mother read it called, wanted a refund and demanded to drop out, because for us to parent and teach her child once a week (den and/or pack meetings) was more than she was willing to commit to. View last year's handbook here:

[Lisabob]

For some parents like the ones who called you demanding to drop out I really don't think much of anything you say is going to make a huge difference. Some people just can't be bothered to spend time with their own kids.

 

One of the other things I notice in cubbing though, is that there tend to be two groups of people. On one hand you have folks who have been with the program for a while, maybe as youth, certainly as adults, and they have bought into the BSA's approach. They may or may not be able to spout off the official mission and vision statements, they may or may not have gone to every training available to them, etc., but they know, understand, and want to be an active part of, the BSA program. I'd say the great majority of posters on this board fit into this group.

 

On the other hand, you have a lot of young, busy, inexperienced, new parents who are not that familiar with the BSA. They probably have an overall good impression of scouts or they wouldn't be there with their kids at all, but these folks often do not have an implicit understanding of the program. They see scouting as one of many youth programs out there, on par with rec league soccer or what have you - something fun, something social, and probably something fairly temporary in their child's life.

 

Especially in cub scouts where there is the greatest influx of new families, interaction between the first and second groups is sometimes a challenge. The first group can't understand why the second group isn't more committed to a program that the second group hasn't really bought into yet. The second group thinks the folks in the first group are a little over the top and they get annoyed by that. Frustration on both sides is a frequent outcome.

 

I think that there are three things you can do to begin breaking down the frustration between the two groups. First, market your cub scouts pack in a way that stresses regular family involvement. Point out how it is different from other youth activities in that regard. The presentation using a rope/measuring tape/ribbon of paper where you mark off the amount of time a parent really has to spend with their child in life, can be powerful here, if well done. At least people will know what they're signing up for then (or if not, they clearly weren't paying attention). Second, once you get people registered, be sure your pack leadership is explaining to parents what the mission and vision of the program are, and how the fun activities your pack has are really more than just a good youth program. You probably need to be sure that your leaders are all current in their training, in order to do this well (some of your leaders may not have bought into the program yet either). Third, make sure you have a really fun program that kids want to be part of all year long, as others have said!

 

 

[Karen_216]

We had a really good roundup last year and went form 6 to 14 in our den. Wow what a big den!!

Not so much. First meeting when a parent did not show I called. He saw a group of scouts (Boy scouts) in the main church and went there instead of the classroom behind- and yes I gave very specific instructions that the rooms were behind the church and you go up stairs and it's end of the hall.... etc.When he sat and figured out these were not 2nd graders he just left.

Well needless to say this rather clueless Dad did not make many meetings. Boy was in my sons class and said how much he loved it but Dad wasn't all into it or supporting him. I asked at Pinewood if he'd done anything at home and he said no.

We also had another fmaily drop out because of parents work schedules- they were all very sad this boy was great and loved it.so it's not always the prgram. Many times as stated it's the parents not making time- heck I even offer to pick up!! i understand homework or tests but every meeting this does not happen.

So now we are back down to 8 in the den.

i concurr that you need to out your best efforts forth if you are going to do something. Yes I give choices but the scouts is not one. i think boys who lose interest don't have it from the parents- Scouts is so all-encompassing with acedemics and sports aspects- also once we take the boys camping (even if parents dont' like it) I have yet to have a boy say he did not like it. (actaully LOVE IT) so when I hear- "we're not campers" i laugh. I'm not either but what are you willing to do for your kids??

My son said after an event- "Mom why do you always sign me up for these evetns i don't want to go to?"

Afterwards I said- "are you glad you went?" and the answer was YES.

Same for resident camp- did not want to go. on day 2 was asking about next year.

 

[DYB-Mike]

Buffalo Skipper,

 

Now I see where youre coming from and the problem is somewhat different from what I understood it to be. It appears not so much Johnny wanting to drop out as Mr. And Mrs. Johnny not holding up their end of the bargain.

 

Maybe if you prepared a Notice to Parents, separate from your packbook, that succinctly (no more than two pages) outlined what your expectations for participation are, how casual attendance can be detrimental on several levels (boy, den, pack), and that for the pack to run a successful program the cooperation and assistance of the parents is essential. End on a high note though: By making the commitment your son, and even yourself, will enjoy a beneficial and fun scouting experience. The Notice should be brief enough for parents to skim through at a Roundup to help them determine if they can meet the commitment you expect. I dont think there is any easy way to state what you expect and not risk putting some folks off your requirements are what they are. Better that parents recognize that they cant or dont want to be bothered making the commitment up front than having them sign Johnny up and then letting everyone down. I naturally feel badly for the boys in this case though, particularly if they really want to participate.

 

Nice packbook by the way. The link you provided didnt work for me but I found it by browsing. Thats something our Pack is hoping to develop in the near future.

 

YIS,

Mike

 

[Buffalo Skipper]

Let's try that link again.

http://p418.org/Pack%20Handbook.pdf

 

[Buffalo Skipper]

Ok, that was better.

 

Lisa,

You put that very well. There are two groups. Our pack is a good example. 35 years ago, I joined this same pack as a Wolf. One of the boys who was in my den as a youth was the pack's Cubmaster 10 years ago, and is now the SM of one of the best troops in the area. The Cubmaster who preceeded me came from a scouting family. Her brother is on the SR board, and her father (age 82) is still a Cubmaster at the other end of the council. Her nephew is replacing me as Cubmaster. Our COR eagled in our organization's troop in 1954, and he has been active in scouting ever since, even serving for a time as District Chairman.

It is easy to quote the statistics "out of every 100 scouts..." but not everyone gets it. I like to use (a shortened version of) this, and I just finished making this year's adding machine tape/timeline, which I use as well. Both powerful tools when employed skillfully. But there must be someway to reach across without making it an us-and-them situation.

Mike,

Sorry if I wasn't clear on making my point, but I still support what you and Ohio Scouter said: having a quality program will go a long way toward keeping the boys intersted. But Karen sees the issue as well. There is a point when you are not "forcing" the boys to participate. As a parent, we must give direction, even when our children don't want it. That's what it is to being a parent.

[DYB-Mike]

Buffalo Skipper,

 

Oh the irony!

 

One thing I did not mention in the discussion was that our Pack was awaiting word on whether our Wolf Den Leader would return this year.

 

Well, we just got the word no. The reason? Her son has dropped out of cub scouts! We had heard rumors about her son being up and down about returning but now have the confirmation. She has another boy, a Webelos, who is remaining, but apparently she doesnt want to lead the Wolf Den if her younger son isnt in it. For the record she was a good Tiger Den Leader and has, and Im sure still will, helped out the Pack in other ways. Now begins the scramble for a new Wolf Den Leader.

 

While I stand by what I said about listening to our kids and their opinions, I can now also say that I feel your pain!

 

YIS,

Mike

 

[Buffalo Skipper]

Mike, (sorry, I can hardly stop chuckling, and no I am not laughing at you but with you)

Irony can be so...ironic. But I am sorry to hear about that. Not to turn this into an "I told you so moment," but this is a problem which genuinely concerns me (at a level which goes beyond a Cub Scout Pack).

 

To update my situation, I kept it all clean, but I did add a remark about parental responsibility and commitment. I hope it did not fall on deaf ears.

 

We recruited 14 Tigers (and 2 leaders!), 7 new Wolves (and a leader) 1 Bear, 6 Web-1 (my new den where the other leader stepped down, and 3 out of five dropped with her) and 5 Web-2. We also have a great new Committee Chair, so we are looking at getting off to a great year!

[markeverett]

LisaBob I could not agree more with your comments. I think that there are some parents that think of the Cub Scouting program as a cheap babysitter service until they realize that parental participation is required for tigers. I myself cannot understand why in the World parents would miss out on the opportunity to spend quality time with their boys, of course I was also kind of disgusted when at the Roundup my hand was the only hand that went up to volunteer. But my son was given a choice as well, it was going to be Cubscouts or something that involved a group activity that was beneficial for his growth as a productive member of society. Ninetendo wasn't a choice he was given. What ever happened to leading a child in the direction he needed to go?