When are ranks awarded?

[ScoutDadof5]

When a cub scout earns thier Wolf or Bear badge, when is that awarded? I asked one of the leaders of our pack, and he indicated that the boy could get his pocket card at the next pack meeting (where they normally ge thier achievments awarded), but would have to wait until February when the Blue & Gold was held to get thier rank patch.

 

Is that correct? That just seems like a very long time (4 monthes) for a young boy to wait to get thier advancement rank to wear on thier uniform.

[ScoutNut]

If the boys are getting recognized for their accomplishment, with a proper ceremony, at the next Pack meeting, that seems to satisfy the immediate recognition policy. However, to me, it is real silly to do a ceremony 2x for the same thing and to have the boys wait for their actual patch. Even if you have a very small Pack and can afford the time at your Pack meetings, it is still a waste of time. What do they do if a boy does not complete his rank requirements until after Blue & Gold? Do they give him his pocket card and then wait until the following February to give him the patch?

 

What level are you a Den Leader for? Will any of your Scouts be finished with all of their rank requirements before February? Is this the way you have handled rank awards in past years or is this something new from a new Advancement Chair or Cub Master?

[John-in-KC]

Well, 40 years ago, my Cubmaster gave us our ranks and arrow points at monthly Pack meetings. You should have seen the smile on my face.

 

10 years ago EagleSon''s Cubmaster gave him his ranks and arrow points at monthly Pack meetings. You should have seen the smile on his face.

 

7 years ago I was ACM and helped give Cubs their ranks and arrow points at monthly Pack meetings. You should have seen the smiles on their faces.

 

Any old codger stick-in-the-mud sourpuss who doesn''t want to see smiles on Cubs'' faces, and give them their ranks and arrow points (and belt loops and all manner of other doo-dads) at monthly Pack meetings needs be told: Sir (or Madam), you are full of bovine excremental matter, and you stink to high heaven.

 

My two cents.

 

YIS

[infoscouter]

The BSA advancement method incorporates *immediate recognition* as a fundamental concept.

 

You will find that all BSA literature stipulates that Cub Scouts (and Boy Scouts) receive their advancement recognition at the next regularly scheduled meeting after the completion of the requirements.

 

For some reason, I suspect laziness, many packs do not observe this practice. *Every* pack meeting should include an advancement ceremony of sufficient import to properly recognize Scouts who have attained awards that month. Some leaders mistakenly see the Blue & Gold banquet as an opportunity for a big "blow-out" multi-rank ceremony, partly because it is easier to perform one big traditional ceremony, than do the work to properly recognize boys each month. Their other argument is that "its a pack tradition" - and that boys and parents would be disappointed if it wasn''t done this way - which as John says is the product of the wrong end of bovine. Trained Cub Scout leaders know better. If they choose to ignore proper practice, they are failing the Scouts and their parents.

 

How do you change this? You can be a thorn in the Cubmaster''s side and nag him/her into doing it the right way. You can have an "older and wiser" Unit Commissioner/Roundtable Commissioner/experienced Cub Scout leader try and guide them onto the right path. You can use the back door and tell all the parents in your den that the boys are supposed to get their badges at the next meeting and the Cubmaster doesn''t want to do that - parental pressure can be a powerful force! You can get the committee chair on your side and get them to help you exert pressure. If you really want to make waves you can plan your own ceremony, buy the badges and present them at the pack meeting. The other adults will wonder what the heck you''re doing, but you can back up your actions with BSA literature, so if you''re brave . . .

 

As an aside (I know there are some other experienced Cub Scouters on the forum), after 18 years I am getting tired of answering this question. What in the heck are we doing wrong that we haven''t been able to erase this practice?

[ScoutDadof5]

Folks, thanks for the feedback. My understanding and what I was told was that they give the scout his pocket card and then wait until the following February to give him the patch.

 

I am working with a Wolf Den. I suspect that at least 1 will finish this month and several next month. We have some active and motivated cubs at hand. In regards to ..."Is this the way you have handled rank awards in past years or is this something new from a new Advancement Chair or Cub Master?", as far as I know, this is how it is done.

 

I agree that the recognition should come sooner than later. Last year as a Tiger Cub, my son got his Tiger Cub totem, beads, and Tiger Cub badge all at once at the end of the school year, so he never got a chance to wear the totem and beads at all before he became a Wolf Cub.

 

I want the cubs, as well as my son, to keep that excitement, and the prospect of having them wait all that time does not seem to support that.

[Aquila]

>>>For some reason, I suspect laziness, many packs do not observe this practice.

[Pack212Scouter]

"I am working with a Wolf Den. I suspect that at least 1 will finish this month and several next month."

 

Wow! When did you start meetings? Ours started only a month ago and I can''t imagine any of our Wolves being close to completing the requirements. Did they work on it over the summer? Our Pack tends to emphasise activities over the summer rather than plowing through the rank requirements. I can see some of ours being done around the end of the year, but that''s about it.

[scoutldr]

As a practical matter, awards should be presented at the monthly Pack meetings. With 150 cubs, if we had held them all until the B/G, no one would have gotten home until 1 am.

 

At the troop level, we present the pin the same night as the BOR. Patch and card are presented at the quarterly COH.

[ScoutDadof5]

"Wow! When did you start meetings? Ours started only a month ago and I can''''t imagine any of our Wolves being close to completing the requirements. Did they work on it over the summer?"

 

We started back up late August and other than Cubscout Daycamp, a picnic, and a family campout, we didn''t push anything over the summer.

 

We have several boys very motivated and working hard on thier advancement. On top of that, thier parents are quite involved. I was speaking with one of the parents and he said that he tries to work with his son 15 minutes a day on requirements whether it is in the car to/from school (he keeps a wolf book in his car for the occassion) or before bed. Many of the requirements are` simple and easy for the Akela to work with thier cubs. Thier are a few that require either a 2 week or a month to complete with a chart, but other than that, the cub can progress at thier own pace and I have been encouraging it with the boys.

 

Now, we still encourage the belt loops and pins and are awarding many of those. At a typical Den meeting, we may work on a piece of an achievement or two to introduce it and help move it along, but our format is usually...

 

Gathering activity

Announcements

Show and Tell (2 - 5 Minutes centered on monthly theme)

Activity of some sort focused on achievement, belpt loop, or pin

Physical activity or game

Closing

 

OR

 

Field Trip

 

We have 13 boys in the Den...pretty big, but thier are 2 leaders and it seems to be working fairly well and going smoothly.

 

[ScoutNut]

" Last year as a Tiger Cub, my son got his Tiger Cub totem, beads, and Tiger Cub badge all at once at the end of the school year, so he never got a chance to wear the totem and beads at all before he became a Wolf Cub."

 

That explains somewhat. I take it you were not Tiger Den Leader last year or you would have asked these questions then.

 

What happened with their Bobcat rank? The Tigers should have received their Bobcat before their Tiger rank. Did they receive that last Feb at B&G and then have to wait until the end of the school year to receive their Tiger stuff?

 

I must say, this sounds like a rather dysfunctional Pack to me. I sure hope the rest of their program makes up for their idiocy with achievements!

 

My advice to you is - Just say NO! Whenever you have a boy complete his rank award, let your Advancement Chair, or whoever it is that purchases awards, know that you will need the rank award itself not just the pocket card for the next Pack meeting. At the Committee meeting prior to the Pack meeting let your Cubmaster know that you will be doing a rank award ceremony for XYZ Scouts. Insist on it. Remind them of BSA''s policy on receiving recognition ASAP.

 

I am sure their viewpoint is to save the big pomp and ceremony for the big celebration Pack meeting when all of the families are present and they can do it up big. That is all fine and nice, however the boys deserve to be able to wear their awards when they complete them and not have to wait until it is convenient for the adults.

 

If the Pack refuses to do this for the boys, you might consider moving to a different Pack.

[John-in-KC]

Aquila wrote, in part...

 

Not laziness here. We award rank at quarterly Courts of Honor. It has nothing to do with laziness, and EVERYTHING to do with ceremony and recognition.

 

But we''re talking about CUB SCOUT PACKS here, not Boy Scout Troops. As short an attention span as an 11-15 year old can have, an 8 year old has an order of magnitude less. The Den meets weekly, the Pack monthly, there just isn''t any excuse for a Cub Pack not to give rank and awards monthly.

[eagle-pete]

According to the Cub Leader Handbook, the Pack Advancement Chair should "Help plan and conduct induction and advancement recognition ceremonies." It is the job of the Pack Committee to help plan and coordinate, with the cooperation of the Cubmaster, all recognition and advancement ceremonies.

 

Also according the Cub Leader Handbook, "The badge should be ceremoniously presented as soon as possible at an upcoming Pack meeting."

 

Note, the badge is presented as soon as possible, not just the card. The card is merely a record for the boy and his parents of what was earned and when. It is not the award. Also, the handbook specifically states to present these ceremonies during an upcoming Pack meeting. Do not wait until the Blue and Gold to have these presented. That is not the focus or purpose of a Blue and Gold Banquet.

 

Scoutnut brings out a very good point. This is not for the convenience of the adults, but for the recognition of the boy. Let''s not lose sight of this.

 

Eagle Pete

[acco40]

One custom that I loathe, but is practiced by many den leaders, is the desire to present awards, especially rank, to all of the boys at once. So, if Johnny earned his Bear rank in February but Billy was not quite finished we would need to wait until Billy was done so as not to upset him. What hogwash!

 

Also according the Cub Leader Handbook, "The badge should be ceremoniously presented as soon as possible at an upcoming Pack meeting."

 

The above is correct. As for troops, rank recognition should happen a minimum of three times: 1) a public announcement immediately after a successful board of review, 2) a rank patch awarded at the next troop meeting (patches are restricted items and should not be bought in advance) 3) formally at the next troop COH. Many troops do not give out the rank badge until the next quarterly COH. This goes against what is described in Advancement Guide.

 

So, the question of when does not have a singular answer.

 

 

[SSScout]

As in all of life, there will be ''go-getters'' and ''come-alongs'' and the ''eventuals''..

The Go Getters will see what they (or their parents) want (Wolf badge, Arrow point) and will nag and work to get it.

The Come Alongs will see the Go Getters get theirs (the Wolf badge) and say to themselves "hey, I''d like to get that and be patted on the back in front of the Pack" and will come along to work and nag alittle more to get it.

The Eventuals may or may not get it, but hopefully, seeing their friends up front of the Pack "getting it",,, they will, eventually.

 

Give out the awards ASAP at the next Pack Meeting. It is a very active form of encouragement.

 

MiF KiS YiS

[Venividi]

Hats off to you, ScoutDadof5, for getting involved as a cub scout leader, and asking questions.

 

I suspect that there may also be a "that''s how we have always done it" momentum behind this as well, with leaders not knowing that that it is OK to award rank badges at the next pack meeting. I have found many people that have never read scouting reference material, let alone having a copy to consult. It is very typical for pack leaders to learn from the other leaders in the unit, resulting in continuation of such traditions.

 

I would not go so far as to call a unit dysfunctional based on one item like this. I don''t know of any unit that is able to follow the entire collection scouting literature 100% accurately. Every unit is somewhere on the continuum between really bad and 100% ideal, and it is in the interest of the boys for all adults to put effort into moving towards the ideal. Noone can work all problems/issues at once - this one sounds like a good improvement for you to champion.

 

Now that you have found that there is a reference supporting the awarding of badges when earned rather than saving them all to be distributed at the B&G, raise it as a topic at your next pack committee meeting. Bring your copy of the Cub Scout Leaders Handbook, with the page marked, so that during the committee discussion you can show the other committee members that it is in the book. Not in a "in your face" kind of a way, but in a "hey, I think it would be better to do it this way" kind of a way.