Campers VS Tents on Scout Campouts

[Justadad1999]

Hello Boys & Girls..

 

Here''s a question for ya''ll..

 

When your Pack/Den go on campouts, is it ok to use a "camper" instead of a tent?

 

I am somewhat of an "Ole Goat" at 52 with a 8 year old son (a Bear) and medically retired & when we go camping with the Pack/Den we try & use the tent BUT the ground almost kills me so I went and bought a small Popup and my son is not to the point yet of sleeping in the tent by himself and I sure don''t want to leave him and maybe another scout alone in the tent at night and due to 2-deep leadership he can''t sleep in another tent with a adult present.

 

what is your opinion and ideas?

 

So is it acceptable to use a camper as an alternate?

 

Larry Brooks

Unit Commissioner/Pack Trainer

Sam Houston Area Council

Texas Skies District

[scottteng]

I am a couple of years younger and it kills me to sleep on the ground but I make it with my air mattress. In a year or two he will only want to sleep with another boy. It would depend on the campground you were going too if the camper would even be allowed. Most places that packs or troops go are tent camping only. I can also see the camper rocking the boat of some leaders in the pack. Cub scouts only do very limited camping as a rule maybe 4-6 nights per year.

[SR540Beaver]

Justadad,

 

Welcome to the forums. For no more camping than you will do with Cubs, you might want to try a cot of some sort. It is a lot easier to transport and is sure a heck of a lot cheaper. Cabelas makes a heavyduty cot that you can purchase a thick pad for. Coleman has been making an army style cot that has a sleeve that an air matress slides into. Air mattresses don''t do as well as pads in cold weather though.....but Cubs rarely do really cold camping.

 

Unless an absolute medical necessity, you''ll find most Boy Scout troops in your future resistant to hauling along an extra trailer and trying to get it into some of the tight spots they''ll be going.

 

I''m a 50 year old with a 14 year old Life Scout. I appreciate what you are going thru since I have opted to quit messing with the extra weight of a cot and just tough it out on the ground with a pad every month. It gives me bragging rights.

[insanescouter]

Welcome to our virtual campfire ...

 

Here is my 2 cents...

 

1) To my knowledge there is no BSA rule that says you cant use some form of a RV. I know of a leader in another Troop that would only attend if he could bring his family 5th wheel toy hauler rv trailer (around 25-30 feet long). He had some kind of medical problem with his back. The Troop generally allowed this as long as no other Scout including his own were allowed to sleep in the trailer.

 

2) I would generally try to discourage using a rv and know most units do. Even the unit in above example discouraged it as much as possible.

 

Now for a bit of clearfication. Are we talking like a small camper on back of a pick up truck, a small trailer, etc. How noticeable is it.

 

Just my wacky cents ...

 

 

Scott Robertson

http://insanescouter.org

[Justadad1999]

Scott,

 

My popup is "noticable" It''s a JAYCO that when opened sleeps 6-8.

 

But like others said, I''ll "tough it out" and use the tent BUT OOOOOOOOH that''s gonna hurt the next few days! LOL

Wouldn''t be so bad I guess if I wasn''t "round" in the middle LOL

 

Larry

[John-in-KC]

A few Cub camping specific policy blurbs from the National Council, courtesy of the G2SS:

http://www.scouting.org/pubs/gss/gss03.html

 

Overnight camping by Tiger, Wolf, and Bear Cub Scout dens as dens is not approved and certificates of liability insurance will not be provided by the Boy Scouts of America.

 

Tiger Cubs may participate in boy-parent excursions, day camps, pack overnighters, or council-organized family camping.

 

Wolf and Bear Cub Scouts and Webelos Scouts may participate in a resident overnight camping program operating under BSA National Camping School-trained leadership and managed by the council.

 

A Webelos Scout may participate in overnight den camping when supervised by an adult. In most cases, the Webelos Scout will be under the supervision of his parent or guardian. It is essential that each Webelos Scout be under the supervision of a parent-approved adult. Joint Webelos den-troop campouts including the parents of the Webelos Scouts are encouraged to strengthen ties between the pack and troop. Den leaders, pack leaders, and parents are expected to accompany the boys on approved trips.

 

Overnight activities involving more than one pack must be approved by the council. Council-organized family camps must be conducted in accordance with established standards as given in National Standards for Council-Organized Family Camping, No. 13-408.

 

Pack Overnighters

 

These are pack-organized overnight events involving more than one family from a single pack, focused on age-appropriate Cub Scout activities and conducted at council-approved locations (councils use Pack Overnighter Site Approval Form, No. 13-508). If nonmembers (siblings) participate, the event must be structured accordingly to accommodate them. BSA health and safety and youth protection guidelines apply. In most cases, each youth member will be under the supervision of a parent or guardian. In all cases, each youth participant is responsible to a specific adult.

 

At least one adult on a pack overnighter must have completed Basic Adult Leader Outdoor Orientation (BALOO, No. 34162) to properly understand the importance of program intent, youth protection guidelines, health and safety, site selection, age-appropriate activities, and sufficient adult participation. Permits for campouts shall be issued locally. Packs use Local Tour Permit Application, No. 34426.

 

To the matter at hand: I''m almost 51, and I will have two Army field mats and a lightly inflated air mattress in my backpacking tent this coming weekend for our District New Cub Family Overnighter.

 

[eagle-pete]

My $0.02

 

Well, our CO does not permit any overnight camping for Cub Scouts (exception: if it is a ''family'' camp when parents are with their boys, overnight camping is fine).

 

I am, however, involved in our Boy Scout program. Something to consider is requirement 2b for Second Class is to "...sleep in a tent that you pitched." IMO, camping out of doors means sleeping in a tent.

 

That having been said, depending on the age of a Cub Scout, he may or may not be ready to sleep in a tent without a parent. I would not push it if a Cub Scout feels apprehensive about it. In a couple years he''ll be ready.

 

Eagle Pete

[ScoutNut]

I can not see most Council Cub Camps allowing a popup camper. They are definitely NOT "leave no trace" and most do not have the hard surfaces or facilities to accommodate them.

 

Consider buying a bigger tent, one you can stand in, and a sturdy cot with a nice pad on top. That should give you the comfort you need.

[Eamonn]

Hi and Welcome.

"So is it acceptable to use a camper as an alternate?"

I can''t see why not.

As far as the LNT?

You might be asked to place it somewhere off site. (Maybe the parking lot?)

This might in some way lead to you and your son not feeling that they are part of the group?

But it''d better than you both staying home and not being part of the group!! (Some camp sites have cabins that you might want to ask about.)

Have to admit to having never been in a small Popup!!

For the Jamboree I bought a cot from Alpine and it was almost like sleeping at home!

For weekends and hikes I use a Thermorest pad.

Having had half a dozen back surgery''s, I do know about bad backs!!

Sleeping on a hard surface isn''t bad, but you need to avoid the cold (At least I do!!) Buy a really good quality bag and use a liner, that along with a good pad and you should feel as right as rain when you get up. -Well almost!!

I think you will find that when the time comes for "Big Boy Camping ??" That a pad beats the heck out of a cot. -The cold air under the cot is not good for bad backs. But do you ever have any cold weather in your neck of the woods?

Eamonn.

[Gonzo1]

As to RV''s and campers, even sleeping in the car because it''s raining, I would say NO!

 

If it''s your own family camping, use what you want, but, on scout camping, um, no.

 

Get a bigger tents, get a cot or air mattress.

 

Set a good example and sleep in a tent.

[insanescouter]

I am weird I don''t generally even use a tent most of the time I just put a tarp down and sleep under the stars. However this also depends on location and weather of course, and I am only older then the young and way younger then the old

 

My Wackiness

 

Scott Robertson

http://insanescouter.org

[scoutldr]

Being on the far side of 50 (my BD is Sunday!), I have thought about a camper myself. But I would never live it down with my fellow scouters. I have had a bad back for years and now sleep apnea requires a CPAP machine, so my camping is within 100 feet of a power outlet, or I just visit for the day, if within a reasonable distance.

 

BTW, in the LNT training I had, they said that brightly colored nylon tents were a no=no too.

[Pack212Scouter]

Scoutldr,

 

My wife also has sleep apnea and has struggled with campouts, often not attending more than one night. Last weekend I went out and bought a 200W inverter for $35 at Wal-Mart. It worked great. I set up the tent within 100 feet of the car and used an extension cord. It ran for a little over 7 hours and the car started right up in the morning. 30-40 minutes of charge time and we were ready for night 2 A warning though...my wife slept in on night 2 and it died at 9 hours. So if you sleep early to morning, you may want to consider a marine deep cycle. Just thought that I''d let you know that it worked well for us.

[Stosh]

Being closer to 60 than 50, I fully understand the problems that come with age. However, there have been plenty of nights when I slept on a rubber blanket with a wool blanket and a backpack for a pillow. When the weather goes bad, I have 2 canvas shelter halves (no ends) that pops up quickly. For real luxury, I have a canvas tent (no floor) with bug netting and a cot.

 

Do I wake up stiff and sore? Yep, but after getting up, moving around and getting busy, it goes away.

 

I must also state that the best part of winter survival is sleeping out under the stars in a -40 sleeping bag.

 

I figure when I can no longer sleep out with the boys, I''ll hang up the walking stick and get a nice soft bed in the nursing home.

 

For those with medical problems, I think it''s great to do whatever it takes to get out with the boys.

[scoutldr]

Thanks, Pack212. I tried the inverter, and it kept tripping the breaker when I would start the CPAP (which is just a blower motor). I then bought a bigger inverter, but the instructions said not to run it more than 2 hrs at a time. Now it''s a convenient excuse, especially when the temp drops below freezing ;-). I knew that there was a reason that the young dads (and moms!) should be out in the woods with their sons rather than me.