lcjones Posted September 6, 2007 Share Posted September 6, 2007 Hey folks, New pack and working to get a charter. We're a very small town. I was wondering if packs can charter with the local elementary school? Thanks, LC Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lisabob Posted September 6, 2007 Share Posted September 6, 2007 Hi LC, Not if it is a public school. Private schools are ok. You might try local service clubs (Elks, Lions, Rotary, VFW, American Legion, etc.) or local churches, mosques, synagogues, etc.. Your district executive ought to be able to help you identify likely charter partners in your area as well. Good luck to you! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lcjones Posted September 7, 2007 Author Share Posted September 7, 2007 Thanks Lisabob, I appreciate your time. I'm reading through the Cub Scout Leader Book and on 7-2 under the heading of The Chartered Organization: "This organization, which might be a church, school, community organization, or group of interested citizens, is chartered by the BSA to use the scouting program." Does that exclude public schools? I want to perfectly understand what I have to do to get this off the ground. Thanks again! LC Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lisabob Posted September 7, 2007 Share Posted September 7, 2007 Yes it excludes public schools. Others can cite specific documents to back this up (I know they exist but don't recall the exact citation). However, since the late 90s, BSA National has sought to end charter agreements with public schools and other government-run groups, due to issues with regard to some of the BSAs exclusionary policies (atheists and gay leaders). While the courts have ruled that the BSA, as a private organization, has the right to establish these membership criteria, having public schools - which are part of the government - charter such a group raises Constitutional problems with regard to the 1st and 14th amendments. Hence, the BSA has migrated units away from charters with public schools. I hope that's a pretty fair summary, but of course others are free to add or clarify if they feel the need - this can be a touchy topic for some (check out the "Issues and Politics" forum and you'll see what I mean). Bottom line is, public schools should NOT be considered as charter partners for your new cub pack, and it is quite unlikely that your BSA council professionals would give their stamp of approval to such a move, even if you did try to proceed in that direction on your own. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beavah Posted September 7, 2007 Share Posted September 7, 2007 Welcome ICJones! Depends where yeh are and what your pros think, but I'd stay away from public schools. As Lisa'bob says, the guidance from National is not to use 'em any more. However, a separately incorporated public school PTO is OK as a chartering partner. Methodist, LDS, and Catholic churches in particular tend to be familiar with the program and willing partners. A fair number of mens and coed service groups/clubs also work fine. Local businesses, da Chamber of Commerce, Unions, etc. are also possibilities. Beavah Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scoutldr Posted September 7, 2007 Share Posted September 7, 2007 Welcome, lc...sounds like things are "cart before the horse" here. Normally, a Chartering Organization (CO) will decide to form a unit then they come looking for leaders. Your District Executive's job is to find willing COs and get them to sign on the dotted line. That's how they get paid and promoted. That's the textbook version, anyway. If you don't have a CO, you don't really have a Pack...yet. Good luck! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lcjones Posted September 7, 2007 Author Share Posted September 7, 2007 Folks, Thanks for the clarification. Lisa, Beavah, that is about as crystal clear as it gets. Thanks for that. scoutldr.. Yep. The DFS recruited like the beejeebers last week at the school. We wound up with two dozen boys and 4 dens with leaders. I spent an hour after the recruit meeting just signing papers and such! And then was told to find a CO ASAP. So here I are And I'm sending out our first newsletter tonight to the den leaders so they don't feel left out in the cold. Folks, thanks again for the heads-up and knowledgebase to pull from! Very cool. LC Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
insanescouter Posted September 7, 2007 Share Posted September 7, 2007 Wow LC which we could get that kind of response recruiting .. but we have the problems of big city to fight against too ... I cross my fingers that the next few weeks at the back to school nights we get lots .. lol LC I would also suggest you check out a great website http://insanescouter.org Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
beardad Posted September 7, 2007 Share Posted September 7, 2007 You could always do like our pack does and self charter. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John-in-KC Posted September 8, 2007 Share Posted September 8, 2007 Beardad, Welcome to the forums. Self-chartering, since 1910, has been the antithesis of how Scouting goes out into the community. Simply put, SCouting is designed to provide a youth serving program in support of community organizations. In fact, IIRC, this is part of how Congress gave BSA its charter in 1917. (Can one of our Scouting historians validate that last?) One objection I have to self-chartering is that units can and do have bad days, and divide in anger. Too often, I''ve seen a unit that HAS, and a unit that HAS NOTHING. This is wrong. What''s the backstory here? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SSScout Posted September 8, 2007 Share Posted September 8, 2007 Volunteer Fire Companies... Hospitals (Charitable Foundations, Public serice departments)... Service Clubs (Lions, Rotary, Elks, The Grange, Kiwanis, etc.)... School PTAs... Private schools... Outing Companies.. Animal Rescue Organizations... Yachting Clubs... Police Fraternal Clubs... Union Locals... Audubon Society... Isaac Walton League... Friends of Troop XYZ (so called self charter)... Community center/club of Ourtown... Friends of Correctional Center... Church... Synagogue... Shrine... Temple... Mosque... Consider first the REASON behind having a charter org... leadership, liability, meeting place, support. Youth ministry, helping hand, good stuff versus bad, alternative to gangs, ... Have fun with your Cubs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lady_Leigh67 Posted September 8, 2007 Share Posted September 8, 2007 LC, we just started out last October. We initially (for paperwork) had our school as our CO, but when February came around, we presented before our school''s PTA. The PTA is now our CO. The school administration is very much behind the Pack, though. We even have our Charter displayed in the front office area. If you can get the PTA or PTO of your school to charter you from the beginning, it is easier in the paperwork area. Go to them and ask what you can do for them. Let them know that BSA insurance, not the PTA/PTO''s, will cover the Pack. That was a huge "selling" point for us. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
beardad Posted September 10, 2007 Share Posted September 10, 2007 John in KC: I am fairly new to the pack, and just recently found out that we are self chartered, so I don''t know the whole backstory, but as I understand it, we were chartered by a school (a public elementary school, I think) I think we either had an obnoxious parent that the school disagreed with, or it was something to do with the don''t ask don''t tell policy. After that we went to our district and they said they would help us with getting a new charter "with in a couple weeks" that was a few years ago. I also think there is some kind of bad blood between our pack, and the district, specifically the DE. and our pack gets zero support from district. case in point we had a local parade at the end of July and our pack won first place for our float and costumes in the parade, and got no recognition from council or district, but anytime any other pack farts and it smells like flowers there are press releases and news stories, and such. again I am new to the pack (I will be just starting my 2nd year in the pack) so I don''t know the whole story wow it was good to vent. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mtm25653 Posted September 10, 2007 Share Posted September 10, 2007 If you have a Methodist church, try them - they church on a national level supports scouting, and some church districts have committees to support/expand scouting in their area. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lisabob Posted September 10, 2007 Share Posted September 10, 2007 Beardad, obviously I don''t know what the local story is in your district. But your pack''s perception that they''re being slighted by the DE/district *could* be a matter of lack of a good PR effort on the pack''s part. In my area, for example, our district commissioner is also the editor in chief of a local newspaper. He''s made it clear that he''ll find room for scouting stories whenever possible, all units have to do is feed him information. Most don''t do so, and then a few have gotten mad when his paper hasn''t covered "their" event. Go figure. So, next time your pack does something fun/interesting/neat, take a photo, write up a blurb, and email it to your DE with a quick, positive note. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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