How can the BSA get all members on the same page?

[ScoutParent]

I cut and pasted Bob. I did not infere that there were no other parts to the conversation but rather copied the parts that were relevant to what we were discussing.

 

Now on to the team analogy--where are the refs in the BSA?

[dan]

sctmom

Oh no you had to bring up menus!

The troop my son is in has a rule of no candy no pop no cookies, unless you make them at the campout.

They also have a rule of no hot dogs, hamburgers or BBQ chicken. But if you look in the scout handbook, hamburgers are listed as a good meal. The handbook talks about a well-balanced meal, so I really think this is in writing, the troop I am with took this to extremes! Many leaders ask if we are trying to make the scouts gourmet cooks!

 

Mike Long

Excellent Idea, on line training guides to be accessible to all! I like it. I would be willing to help also in my free time!

 

[Bob White]

ScoutParent,

 

The officials are found in the scouting professional, commissioners and varios council and district volunteers. just like there are different refs to watch certain parts of the game there are different scouters who are responsibile for different parts of scouting. Remember though the refs only look at how the game is played, the league can look at how the team is operated by only has limited power, the owner still controls the business end of team operation.

 

Training On Line-

One hurdle in putting all training on line is recouping some of the cost of development, and that a major part of training is the hands on experience and networking with other volunteers.

In addition there are copyright restrictions that would be violated.

I'll add one more problem, how do we varify that the person actually viwed the training?

 

Bob White

[dan]

As Mike L. said the online documation would be referecne material only. Not to replace training.

 

ScoutParent

I guess I do not trust my local council to do a good job with anything! But I do like you idea where a survey could be sent to national to answer the questions.

[Mike Long]

Online training could be a future goal but a searchable online knowledge base would not be difficult to implement imediately and would be of great value to many Scouters.

 

Copyright restrictions? I never suggested stealing content. I'm not a shade-tree developer, I've done this before. I'm talking about doing it right with the blessings of the BSA.

 

Cost of development is the only real major issue I see. The benefits need to be weighed vs. cost. If the BSA considers it worthy then just budget it and do a fund drive to pay for it. Every time my council wants a new facility they do it that way and it works. Pay to view is one method but that would most likely be counter-productive and I wouldn't suggest it. A volunteer development team is another. There are quite of few of us in the scouting movement that are web developers. Right now I could assemble a team of former Scouts and current Scouters to do the work. Granted not everyone can work pro bono but some will and others might be willing to do it cut rate.

 

The one thing about cost is that other than hosting the costs would be one time. Once it is built it is done and if it is done right with a admin module. Then anyone could update the content with having any special development skills. If you can send an email you can use the admin piece.

 

How do we validate it? Easy, with the web we can easily access the BSA membership database and confirm those members who access the training. We add an entery in their file that states they accessed a training course. When they finish the course give them a test. If they pass then another entry is made that states they passed the course. We can track a user from the time they log onto the site through every page of the site untill they log out. As a matter of fact it is possible to track a users movement anywhere they go on the internet.

 

Once again, traditional training is something that I clearly stated should be preserved and continued for exactly the same reasons as Bob mentioned, hands on experience, networking and don't forget fellowship.

 

Heck, why don't we talk to Bill Gates Sr.? He's an Eagle and I'm sure jr. would listen to his dad....Just kidding y'all.

[evmori]

I feel all BSA manuals & handbooks should be on line! We as volunteers need as much information as possible at our fingertips.

 

Cost shouldn't be an issue. The most important thing should be having properly trained leader & Scouts to carry out the program.

 

Ed Mori

Scoutmaster

Troop 1

[ScoutParent]

Doesn't seem like there would be much of a downside of having reference material readily available to leaders and parents alike.

[Rooster7]

I think the NFL is the closest example of how scouting works.

 

Okay...I'm not going to join this debate because I see it leading to a conversation that Bob and I have had time and time again. Regardless, I just felt compeled to tell Bob (to his delight I'm sure) that I am a fan of the politically incorrect Washington Redskins. I'm sure he can work that into his analogy somewhere. I'm not a glutton for punishment (whoops, that's another thread)...I just found it rather humorous.

[KoreaScouter]

Rooster;

 

There's gotta be an Indian Lore tie-in there somewhere -- ride that horse as far as you can!

 

Personally, I'm a big fan of online resources. I'll stick my neck out and say we're further from Irving than anyone else -- it's not the end of the world, but you can see it from here! The supply lines are long, too. Many of the printed resources are hard to come by, and to visit our council, I need an international plane ticket and a passport. Online access to everything, including national by-laws and the other Jedi Knight stuff would be great.

 

We do a lot of online training in my military field, and it's easily verified through things like online testing...

 

Bob, I do agree that there are many bold-print policies that are not universally followed, but there are many grey areas subject to adult interpretation too. In the area of hazing for example, I've seen Scouts expected to sing in front of their troop, camp, etc., to recover a personal item they dropped, misplaced, whatever. Is this hazing? Apparently, many think not, because it's a common practice. I happen to think it is (and not very Scoutlike, either when you consider the Oath and Law), and do not permit it in the troop I serve. Yet, it's a grey area...

 

KS

[EagleWB]

Dan, National does have a training program written out. You should ask your District Training chairman for a copy of "Scoutmaster and Assistant Scoutmaster Leader Specific Training" and the "Introduction to Outdoor Leader Skills." Each district should have a complete set of all programs for any training courses, some also have CD's. These have schedules and topics to be covered.

[bigbeard]

How about an online board @ National to review "field calls". Posters could ask for guidance/ rulings/interpretations on G2SS issues and receive a National-sanctioned decision. Responses could be archived for reference. Maybe limit it to boldface issues to keep it under control.

[Rooster7]

OGE,

 

In another thread you said, "I am a little disconcerted here. On this forum we have a raging debate over what constitutes hazing and 'just punishment' (of which I am an active participant) while a quite salient issue, such as how do we get everyone on the same page, same book, or in this case, the same universe if not ignored, has not received the same passion."

 

I'll bite.

 

Our Supreme Court justices frequently have significantly different interpretations of the U.S. Constitution. A document which I submit was crafted with much more forethought and understanding than BSA's Guide to Safe Scouting or any other BSA manual. In short, I doubt seriously if all members will ever be on the same page. Scouting, while an admirable and worthwhile pursuit, still must operate within the confines of this universe. We shouldn't expect complete agreement amongst ourselves when that cannot be found anywhere else. On the other hand, when we do disagree, we should expect to be treated in accordance with the Scout Law.

 

I do not believe that there are two basic camps as some have suggested"us" (those who chose to follow the methods of Scouting) verses "them" (those who do not). I feel this is an unfair portrayal, which assumes one is always on the right side of the argument.

 

"There are still people who refuse to accept that 'death camps' existed during WWII, or that man actually landed on the moon."

 

I'm sorry. I thought we were talking about Scouting.

[Bob White]

"There are still people who refuse to accept that 'death camps' existed during WWII, or that man actually landed on the moon."

 

I'm sorry. I thought we were talking about Scouting.

 

No I think we were talking about how to get everyone to come to a common understanding. My point was that it was human nature for some people to only believe what they want regardless of the evidence presented. That is a stumbling block that no measure of information access can overcome.

 

Bob

[OldGreyEagle]

Rooster, I guess I was being too subtle and should have been more blunt, we have 79 or so postings on hazing and tons more on interpretations of policy and to this date 10 postings on a family ready to give Boy Scouts "the death penalty" in their family.

 

For all our talk about doing it for the boys, here is one boy who may miss out on the chance of a lifetime and we are parsing words and trying to determine how many boy scouts can sing on the head of a pin.

 

I just see huge disparity in where our energy should be and where it is.

[ScouterPaul]

OGE

Wow!! Sometimes we need to be hit over the head. You are correct. The loss of one boy far outweighs any of our "deep" discussions.

 

Thanks

 

Paul