Need help getting a TAX ID number for our Pack

[mjengels]

Can anyone tell me how to go about getting a TAX ID number for our Pack. I heard from a Committee member we have a company that wants to give us money but we don't have a TAX number so we can't get the money yet. What do I need to do??? What does it cost? Any help greatly appreciated.

[SemperParatus]

You use the tax id number of your chartered organization. Ask your CO for that.

 

A scouting unit is not a separate legal entity and so, does not have its own federal identification number or state sales tax exemption number.

[anarchist]

First I am not a CPA, (so all you bean counters correct me if I am mistaken)...but you need to realize that a tax ID number (IRS EMPOLYER ID number)...does not convey tax exemptions on any "donations"...You would have to figure out a way to get registered as an educational not-for-profit (501-c3) to be able to 'offer' benefactors a tax exemption or write off....that means, establishing a corporate entity rather than a 'scout troop'...

 

some States exempt Scout units in their sales tax legistation for your purchases but even there many stores do not know how to deal with that issue...but they understand how to deal with a church tax number (if your CO is a church)...

For donations under $500 IRS does not usually require a reciepted statement but the troop itself should not imply that donations are TAX EXEMPT...you would be on much better ground to have the funds funneled through your C.O. if that is an option.

 

Getting an I. D.# is a couple a minutes worth of paper work sent to IRS...getting '501-C3' is a different story..as in "you need an attorney or at least a good CPA...or both"

 

As SemperP posted a better bet is use the CO's number if that group is exempt(This message has been edited by anarchist)

[SemperParatus]

A federal tax identification number (aka federal employer identification number or FEIN) is obtained by filing a Form SS-4 with the IRS - this can be done over the phone as well in a matter of minutes. HOWEVER, because a scout unit has no separate legal existence (e.g., incorporated) separate and apart from the chartered organization (it is merely an extension or separate budget item for the CO), the IRS will not grant a scouting unit a FEIN.

 

To clarify, tax-exempt status requires first of all, separate legal existence, and second the granting of exempt status by the IRS following the submission of an application by the organization, along with a $600 user fee. Note - tax-exempt 501©(3) status does not itself make it possible for an organization to receive deductible charitable donations - that benefit is conferred on an organization under IRC Section 170 which defines those organizations that constitute public charities and/or private foundations. Scout units may receive donations that are deductible by the donor, only through the public charity status of its CO.

 

As I said, you need to get the Chartered Organization's tax id number. Your unit cannot get a tax id number.

[nldscout]

Semper,

Its funny how you and others say a troop cannot get an EIN to open bank accounts when our troop has one and has had it for years

[fgoodwin]

When I started a Pack in 2003, we needed a tax ID in order to open a bank account. Getting the tax ID took ten minutes. As others have said, obtaining a tax ID does not convey tax-exempt status.

[packsaddle]

We also have a bank account. I believe we used the church tax ID number. If the CO is a 503© charitable organization, the check can be written to the CO and the donation will be tax-deductible. Non-profit status is fairly easy to attain. However, additional application must be made to attain eleemosynary recognition and 503© status with the IRS.

If you make an appropriate arrangement with the CO, the donated funds can be earmarked for use in scouting. It is useful to make this arrangement in advance to avoid potential confusion.

[frank10]

Packsaddle,

We ask for checks to be made out to "BSA Troop ### of Church Name". Seems to work for every one including our bank.

[fgoodwin]

To get a tax ID, go to this website:

 

https://sa.www4.irs.gov/sa_vign/newFormSS4.do

 

The process takes less than ten minutes -- it is free.

 

Be sure you print a copy of the form before you submit, because after you click "Next" its gone!

 

Also print a copy of your tax ID number after the system assigns it.

[Vicki]

Tax exempt is something you can only get through your CO. BSA does not allow individual troops/packs to incorporate so applying on one's own for tax exempt status is not an option. Anyway, here's a very good explanation of the federal tax status of scout units...

 

Federal Tax Status of Scout Units

The IRS recognizes the Boy Scouts of America National Council as tax exempt under IRS Section 501©(3). Through an IRS-granted group exemption, this status is extended to local councils and council trust funds. The tax exempt status of the Boy Scouts of America does not extend to, nor include, any Scout packs, troops, crews or other units, and no Scout units may be included within the BSA group exemption for the National Council. They are not subordinate organizations, and this is an IRS restriction.

 

 

Units must obtain their own Employer Identification Number (EIN) or use the EIN of the chartering organization. Under no circumstances can a unit use either the EIN of the council or the BSA's group exemption number for purposes of gifts, federal taxes, or other related purposes. If a unit's chartering organization is tax exempt, and it allows the unit to use its EIN (or includes the unit under their group exemption), the unit could then be considered tax exempt as a subordinate of that organization. Gifts to the unit would be tax deductible as gifts to the chartering organization.

 

 

 

Also, units should not apply for their own independent tax exempt status. Article XI or the BSA Charter and Bylaws states that "Contributions shall be solicited in the name of the Boy Scouts of America only through or by the authority of the Corporation and shall be limited to the National Council or chartered local councils...." Also, the BSA Rules and Regulations vests in each council power to "control the raising and expenditure of all funds for local Scouting work in their jurisdiction."

 

 

 

Application for an Employer Identification Number

IRS Form SS-4 is used to request an employer ID number from the IRS. This is needed to open a bank account for a Scouting unit unless the unit is allowed to use the EIN of the chartering organization (see above). This IRS Form SS-4 Acrobat (.pdf) file above can be filled in on computer from with Acrobat, but the Acrobat Reader will not allow a user to save the fill-in form to disk.

 

 

 

This link takes you to a SS-4 form that is not filled in on computer. To fill out the form please follow the following BSA Instructions (2 Page Adobe PDF File) to ensure the form is filled out properly for your Pack, Troop, Crew, etc. NOTE: these are a complement to the below IRS Instructions.

 

 

 

This link takes you to the IRS Instructions (6-page Acrobat document) are available to help units complete the form. The process is relatively simple, and there is no cost.

 

 

 

 

 

 

[fgoodwin]

The Sam Houston Area Council website has a great webpage explaining how units can open a checking account and how to obtain a tax ID number:

 

http://www.samhoustonbsa.org/Home/DistrictSites/UnitResources/CheckingAccountInstruc/

 

http://tinyurl.com/575ty

[Rixkidz]

you will have to use YOUR Social Security Number in order to get a TIN for your pack!!

 

I had to do it for our Pack (we are chartered to our parents, not to an organization) Just make sure that when you leave the pack that you have the TIN information changed to someone else's SSN.

[va-scouter]

We have an "interesting" situation. Our C.O. is a church.

 

Due to an organization in the area giving away money to non-profit groups, we decided to request the church's tax-exempt number in order to take advantage of the opportunity. Other troops and packs in the area are taking part in the give-away, so we thought we might as well get a slice of the pie for our young men too.

 

We were informed by the treasurer of the church that they don't have a tax-exempt number, and that we can't even use their tax i.d. number because they'd have to pay taxes on everything we raise.

 

Has anybody here ever heard of a church not being tax-exempt? It's a Methodist Church.

 

 

[Vicki]

I would suggest that there is some confusion here on the part of you, the treasurer of the Methodist church, or both (as in noise in the communication).

 

It is probable that the Methodist church is able to accept charitable contributions under the denominational 501©(3) exemption. Most of the older denominations operate this way rather than each church applying for its own 501©(3) exemption (I know Presbyterian (USA), Missouri Synod Lutherans and the UCC do - I've served in all three). The Methodists may have a rule concerning sponsored groups not using the denominational exemption to accept contributions directly, rather than having them given to the church and directed to the sponsored group (in this case, the troop). It wouldn't surprise me at all to find out that this is the case, given how structured the Methodist organization is. It also wouldn't surprise me to find that a given church treasurer wouldn't know this, but responded with something that sounds reasonable to him/her.

 

This really does get more complicated than a forum like this is prepared to handle.

 

Vicki

[va-scouter]

We have an "interesting" situation. Our C.O. is a church.

 

Due to an organization in the area giving away money to non-profit groups, we decided to request the church's tax-exempt number in order to take advantage of the opportunity. Other troops and packs in the area are taking part in the give-away, so we thought we might as well get a slice of the pie for our young men too.

 

We were informed by the treasurer of the church that they don't have a tax-exempt number, and that we can't even use their tax i.d. number because they'd have to pay taxes on everything we raise.

 

Has anybody here ever heard of a church not being tax-exempt? It's a Methodist Church.