solved a problem, found a problem

[cajuncody]

Hi again. I have formed a functioning committee and had them approved by the CO and COR so now I am stepping back to the right side of the line that I crossed. Now that I am back within my realm of power I have a new and interesting question. How does a pack go about getting a new and more involved COR. Over the past few weeks I have found our COR to be difficult to contact and to busy to get anything done for the pack. On top of that he has a son who is a bear who never comes to the meetings and only shows up for parties and pinewood derby. AT pinewood derby they brought a questionable car but insisted on racing it anyway much to the chargrin of other parents who felt cheated. Then in the middle of the race the CORs family insited that another families cars be reweighed because they were running just as fast as theirs and they didn't think that should be possible. They expect special treatment and for their son to advance but he never comes to the meetings or outings. The only time I see him is at school on the mornings that he helps raise the flag. There is another member of the church who would be willing to be cor. What is the proper proceedure for switching?

Kristi

sill forming

[SemperParatus]

Speak with the institutional head.

 

Cajun, a couple of days ago you wanted ideas for kicking the old CM out of your pack. Now, you are looking for ways to can your COR. You are scaring me. Sometimes, you just have to work with people you don't like or respect. That is especially true as CM. BTW, it is not within your "realm of power" to replace the COR. In fact, it is 'within their realm" to replace you. Please tread carefully.(This message has been edited by SemperParatus)

[Laurie]

You are the CM, right? I never thought of the CM as having power, but rather as having the privilege of awarding the boys their advancements and helping in planning the pack meeting. Part of that was encouraging the den leaders too. Though I was the one who secured a CR for the unit I used to be in (at the request of the DE), and though I recruited people to leadership positions (but directed them to the CR and CC for an app and approval), there were some things I had to learn to let go. Regardless of whether the CR is CR or not, there could be the expectation of special treatment. There are families that are just like that. One thing that I found helped in the expectation of advancement, even when not earned, was to talk with the CC, ask for permission to share a problem I was having, and with permission, did this: I used the Cub Scout Leader Handbook as a reference, keeping it handy for anyone who wanted to look at it, and I told the committee (which always included DLs) that I found myself focusing too much on the award and not enough on the process, and that the following items helped me to regain focus. That led to a brief discussion, some print-outs of resources that brought the purpose of Cub Scouting to everyone's attention again, and then the DLs began to adjust some of what they were doing and to encourage parents as well. As CM, I felt this was the best thing I could do to help stop this problem. It was brought up at a pack meeting too, briefly, but in a positive way: I congratulated the boys on their hard work and thanked the parents for allowing me and the leadership team to work with them as they helped their sons reach their goals in Cubs. There will always be problems, some units having more than others, but how they are resolved makes a big difference. Hang in there, and try to have some fun. CM is a fun position--or can be

 

And... For those leaders (like the CR who may not attend all meetings), I asked the CC if someone would mail out materials shared during the committee meeting. I was asked if I would do so. This way everyone gets the same info. What they do with it is up to them, but there are resources to use that should help unify the leaders in keeping focus.(This message has been edited by Laurie)

[fotoscout]

Here is another thought, why would you want a more involved COR. The CORs responsibly is to interface between the unit and Chartering Organization. He/She should be mainly involved with issues relating to the Charter agreement. Items like Leader selection, meeting location, equipment storage, and maybe the coordination of some program activities that are associated with your CO. Having said that, most COs and CORs dont want anything to do with Leader selection.

 

It is the Leaders job to make the program, not the COR. If youre looking for the COR to be more involved in the way a Leader is, then youre really looking for another Leader and not the COR.

 

So what is it that you expect from the COR.

 

And by the way, SP makes a good point about whom can replace whom!

(This message has been edited by fotoscout)

[cajuncody]

I need a COR that I can get boys registration signed to turn in. I have 4 boys who have been meeting with us since the begining of the year and they are not on the Charter because the COR hasn't found the time to sign the registration forms. So I guess I need to tell these boys to come back next year when this man has more time? Or maybe I should check with another interested party who has more time and is more acessable and is in the same position with the CO? I actually like the COR as a person but need some boys registered. I also need someone who doesn't expect special treatment.

Yes, we do need alot of people replaced. The pack is in a death spiral. If we can't shake things up and get some people who want to do the job they volunteered for then it can't be saved.

Kristi

[Laurie]

Kristi, I don't have an app handy, but isn't only the CM signature required for a youth to join? The adult apps need a CC and CR or IH signature, but I thought the youth didn't need that. When I was CM, the CR was not at meetings, I knew he'd be at a troop meeting once a week, and we could meet for a few minutes to get his signature when necessary. He also would sign anything sent to him via postal mail, but that ended up not being necessary. Would these be options for you?

[cajuncody]

Laurie,

You have just given me a valuable lesson. Never take someones word for it, always check to be sure. Outgoing CM told me they needed the COR to sign them and I just accepted that as fact. I do still need the COR to sign our money earning permit though and he just doesn't have time. I also have 4 new committee members registrations to be signed.

I am running out of time on the Money earning app though and I have sent 4 copies home with his wife from the school and they have never come back.

It is frustrating to be trying to rebuild something and have a couple of people who just won't cooperate. I have other people who are willing and able waiting for second string to be called into action.

Thanks for the headsup on the boys registration, am taking them to council as soon as they open in the am. One down . . .

Kristi

[Cubmaster-Fred]

Cajun,

 

I have to agree with Laurie about the power issue. I have always felt priviledged to teach the boys valuable lessons and am grateful to the parents for giving me and the other leaders the opportunity to do so.

 

The application question has already been answered.

 

As for the COR's boy wanting to advance, remember that as long as the parent signs off on the proper requirements the boy cannot be denied his Bear badge. This will change next year in Webelos, but that is another discussion.

 

As far as the COR is concerned, I hardly ever even see him. He does his job, I do mine. As one Cubmaster to another just forget about the COR. Run your program and let the boys get the program they deserve. When the boys are having fun, more boys will come. Then everyone will begin to realize that they have a job to do too, and hopefully your world will become rosie.

 

I started out in kind of the same boat, in that there was no one who would help. Once they saw the fun and benifits that the BSA, one of the worlds greatest youth organizations, had for the boys, I have plenty of help.

 

Remember, the committee is there to get you what you need to run the program. You plan and make the program happen. So get to it and give the boys what they deserve. I know you can do it cause you sound like your heart is in the right place.

 

A wise old owl once told me, you will get to your grave earlier if you always worry about things you have no power to change. Change what you can and let the rest happen. Good things come from good things.

 

CMF

 

[Torveaux]

Our COR is the Principal of the school that charters us. He has no kids even near Scouting age, so we don't have your issue. He also keeps a very low profile. He will sign off and is helpful if asked, but he takes a decidedly hands-off approach (which I think is appropriate).

 

Maybe you could go (way) out of your way and drive over to the COR's house documents (and pen) in hand for him to sign.

 

Good luck.

[cubbingcarol]

Kristi, why don't you just take the adult applications and permit to the COR yourself and stand there telling him that you will not leave until he signs them. I'll bet that he would, esp. since it will only take him about 1 minute to do it. Trust me, as the wife of a cubmaster, people ask me to tell or ask my husband this or that. But when you work all day and come home to 4 kids, try to get supper ready, homework done, baths given, my own den meeting planned, sometimes I forget to ask or tell him anything other than love you and goodnight. If you want something done bad enough do it yourself, don't rely on the wife, she may be in the same boat as me (it's pretty full in here but if I see her I'll tell her to get her husband to sign those papers for you )

 

Carol

[fotoscout]

The COR has no signature responsibility to the unit!

The IH - Institutional Head - must sign Adult applications and the Charter.

Special treatment is always a difficult situation. Maybe he doesn't understand what he's doing. I suggest that you discuss this with your CC or CM (whichever you are not) and perhaps another knowledgeable leader. If you all agree, then go talk to the COR, but not alone. If  you can't agree then you might need to spend some time in quiet reflection.

[SemperParatus]

foto,

 

Adult Apps can be signed by either the COR or the CO head. Here is the application -

 

http://www.scouting.org/forms/28-501.pdf

 

[fotoscout]

SP, you are of course correct. I never read the fine print. We are always instructed to have the IH sign the applications and charter.

 

I guess it's one way of insuring that the someone contacts the IH at least once a year.

[anarchist]

Cajuncody,

 

glad to see ya got a committee...

With the COR...call for signnatures you need then head to the IH of the CO when you do not get your timely needs met...and say 'I need signatures.'.. after several times of this you can then enlist the CC to sit down with the IH and help him on the selection path to a new COR if needed.

 

A really good COR can be cool...This person has a vote at COUNCIL and DISTRICT committee meetings and can make good contacts to help your pack, if that is the kind of person you 'get' for a COR.

 

there are more than one way to skin a cat...trick is figuring if the cat will be still while ya do it....