What Happens if a boy is held back a grade

[jteamnmj]

Hi,

I'm new here but I have a question. If it has been addressed before please forgive me and point me in the right direction. My son is currently in the first grade and is 6. I have a feeling that the teacher is going to recomend that we hold him back. He has already earned his Tider Badge and will earn his bobcat by June. He has already completed all the requirements they are just holding it for the crossover campout. If he is held back in first grade will he be allowed to move up to Wolf since he has already completed all the requirements or will he have to do Tigers all over again. My husband says that he will still advance but I can't find anything about this. Thanks for your help

Julie

[jteamnmj]

Ok I was just reading in the Leader Book that a boy can't become a Webelos till he has completed 3rd grade or is 10. So does that mean that my son can still advance but he can't become a Webelos till he starts 4th grade? I hope thats the case cause I know my son will be heartbroken if he can't move up to Wolf with his friends. I doubt that it would bother him that much if he was told that he had to finish 3rd grade before he could move up to Webelos. We currently live in England right now and will be transfering back to the states in a year so he will be starting a new pack anyway. He absolutely loves being in Cub Scouts. Thanks for all your help.

Julie

[Cubmaster-Fred]

The decision to hold the boy back a year in scouting is ultimately the parents decision. The down sides are:

1. He cannot earn his rank a second time, but also cannot work on the next rank.

2. Somewhere down the road he will lose a year of scouting if you hold him back (ie - if you hold him back he will only have one year of Webelos before he is to old for Cub Scouting)

 

In my Pack we ran across this scenario several times and found the benifits of letting the boy move on out weigh the down sides of holding him back.

 

Hope this helps

 

CMF

[jteamnmj]

CubMaster Fred,

Thanks so much for your reply. It eases my mind. My son lives, sleeps, and breaths scouts (and yes this is only his first year - must be in his genes)and I know if he couldn't advance with his friends he would be really upset. I had a feeling that my husband (who also lives, sleeps, and breaths scouts) was right but I wanted to make sure. Scouts are a very important part of our life. Not a day goes by that my son doesn't ask me if tonight is scouts (that or is it swimming or horse back riding today). We have a campout coming up in April to Normandy France and the first thing out of his mouth in the morning is how many days till we go to Normandy. I have had to start a countdown clock for him. I hope his enthusiasm continues cause it's a great organization to belong to.

Thanks again

Julie

[acco40]

Cub Scouts is both age based and grade based. Recent rule changes have made it slightly more age based, especially for Webelos/AOL, but IT WAS NEVER REQUIREMENTS based (ala Boy Scouts). The Tiger Cub program is for first-grade (or age 7) boys. The Wolf program is for boys who have completed first grade (or are age 8). The Bear rank is for boys who have completed second grade (or are age 9). The Webelos program is for boys who have completed third grade (or are age 10). So, if your 6 year old son is not yet 8 and has not completed the first grade, he is not supposed to be in the "Wolf" program regardless if he he earned his Tiger rank or not. Now, one may argue if he retakes 1st grade a second time if he has completed it or not - I don't know the answer to that.

 

 

[Cubmaster-Fred]

Julie

 

Glad to hear your mind is at ease. Even more glad to hear that he likes scouting so much.

 

YIS

 

CMF

[Torveaux]

One other thing to consider:

 

those 'friends' will be in a different class. The scouting experience may be a good way for him to get to know the 'new' friends in the new grade.

 

Part of the decision may rest upon when he becomes 8.

 

On the inside cover of the new Wolf book it states "You should use this book if you are a boy who has completed the first grade or are 8 years old."

 

There are many things your boy could do to help the new Tigers with learning about Scouting while completing new badges, belt loops and such as a Tiger.

 

 

[jteamnmj]

Just wanted to thank everyone for there information. We had a meeting with my sons teacher today and we were informed that he definitely going to go to the second grade. She just had some concerns about his reading and has given us some steps to help him with it. I guess as a mom I worry to much and look for it to be worse than what it really is. Thanks again

Julie

[Locust Fork Leader]

I have lived the same problem you are having. I let my son move up. I thought that the fact that he'd have to be held back was enough. He excels in Scouting and for me to mess that up for him would have killed him, not to mention that his self esteem would have been squashed. Let him move up. These are the friends that he will have for a long time. My son is now a 1st year Webelos and the group has 4 "original" boys from Tiger year. When they are together they are as thick as theives. I am so proud of them because they look out for one another and they have learned to work together great. We are about to move into the 2nd year of Webelos and this group is well on it's way to earning their AOL and crossing over together. Good luck! I'm jealous that you're going to Normandy! I'm here in the states and the best trip the boys took last year was an overnighter on the USS Alabama Battleship!

 

Tracy

Pack 159

[SWScouter]

I posted about this topic in a previous thread: http://www.scouter.com/forums/viewThread.asp?threadID=72429#id_72535

 

To recap, I had a boy in my den that is repeating third grade this year. The boy wanted to continue in Cub Scouts but the parents wanted him to associate with the boys in his current class and felt remaining in the same den would be tough on him. At the time, the boy did not want to repeat the Bear program.

 

By November, the boy decided he wanted to get involved with Cub Scouts again and has joined the Bear den. He seems to be doing just fine now and I'm glad to see him at the Pack meetings and other activities.

 

I guess jteamnmj, your not so worried about this now that you're sure your boy will be moving on to 2nd grade next year. The bottom line, is that whether a boy repeats a grade or not, whether the boy repeats a Cub Scout year or continues on is a decision to be made by the Boy and his family.

 

SWScouter

[gungho4scouts]

For those of you who live by the hard and fast rules, consider this. The guidelines for when a Boy enters the Scouts is simple. A Boy may enter the Scouts at anytime. If they were the age/grade for Bear, they don't start as Tigers. The only required rank/badge they must earn is the Bobcat which they can earn while still being a Bear Cub.

 

The age/grade is a guideline of what rank the Boy will be when they decide to join the Scouts.

[acco40]

I don't want to sound anal but read my previous post - partially repeated below. They are not "guidelines" they are the rules. Granted, exceptions may be made in extreme cases but for most, the rules apply.

 

IT WAS NEVER REQUIREMENTS based (ala Boy Scouts). The Tiger Cub program is for first-grade (or age 7) boys. The Wolf program is for boys who have completed first grade (or are age 8). The Bear rank is for boys who have completed second grade (or are age 9). The Webelos program is for boys who have completed third grade (or are age 10).

[GopherJudy]

Hi jteamnmj!

 

That is a tough question & I don't know the answer but I'm glad as I read other posts that your son will be promoted to the 2nd grade. I'm glad that your son is so enthusiastic about Scouts & that you & your husband are too!

 

I have a question for the other forum members regarding the age/grade thing. Now most school districts here on Long Island the cut-off date for entering kindergarten is December 1st. My son was born September 1994 & started kindergarten September 1999, about 5 days after he turned 5. So all of the children born from January 1st to December 1st 1994 were able to start kindergarten in September 1999. Also those born December 2, 1993 to December 31, 1993 started kindergarten in September 1999. Now my son will be whatever age is starts school as til he finishes that school year, which ends around the 3rd week in June, so he was 5 the whole kindergarten year & turned 6 right before he started 1st grade. Now obviously some of the kids in his class were born in the beginning of the year so they finished kindergarten when they were 6, then finishes 1st grade when they were 7, 2nd grade when they were 8, etc.

 

Does the BSA have the grades/ages & have the age requirment as most of the kids would have had a birthday after January & finish 1st grade whey they are 7? Did they ever consider that some kids are the same age the whole school year? My son will graduate high school when he's 17 & he'll turn 18 almost 3 months later! The same with my daughter, her birthday is October 28, 1996 & started kindergarten in September 2001 & was 5 almost 2 months later! She'll also graduate from high school when she's 17 & turn 18 4 month later! She's in Brownies & in the 3rd grade & is 8!

 

Does anyone understand what I'm talking about? There are some boys in Mark's Webelos II den that are already 11, the one boy's birthday was the middle of February. They are all in the 5th grade & there are 2 other boys in the den who were born in September & will still be 10 when they finish 5th grade! I hope that I've made sense here! Thanks if anyone has an answer to my question if it needs one!

 

Judy

 

 

[Torveaux]

I studied this in depth due to my son's issues. (his b-day is in October with a Sept 1 cutoff after Kindergarten they skipped him over 1st grade making him unable to be a Tiger cub.)

 

The rules are in place with both grade or age requirements in part so that boys who are held back in school or who start school later than average can still move ahead to Boy Scouts when they reach age 11.

 

We have 2 boys in our Den (Bears) that are already 10 due to being held back. Next Spring as Webelos Is, they would be eligible to join Boy Scouts even if they don't complete any Webelos requirements (not to mention the AOL.) Conversely, my boy will not turn 10 until October of his Web II year. We have another boy who is young (just made the cutoff) too.

 

I think the temptation is always to keep the boy with his friends. Initially, I tried to argue to let my son stay with his old friends as a Tiger. Reality sets in later when the other boys move up to a different school (or vice versa) and your boy is suddenly isolated from his friends. Once Jr. High, hormones, and girls become a factor, it is will not be cool to hang out with a kid in a lower grade, even if he is the same 'age'.

 

 

 

 

[gungho4scouts]

The Rule is what Rank the Boy will be. The Guideline is age or grade. The Rule is; if you are 5 and in Kindergarten, you need to wait until you are either 7 years old OR in 1st grade. Which ever comes first. 6 years old and in 1st grade, you can join (as a Tiger.)

 

If you are 8 years old and held back a year, in accordance with the guidelines, the rule is pretty clear. 8 years old OR in 2nd grade, you're rank can be Wolf. Both criteria don't have to be meet, just one. Conversely, he could be a Tiger, but the decision is, and as it should be, up to the Parents to make.