The pack is going down, it is not a slow death . . .

[cajuncody]

I need help. I need tons of help. I need all of you to catch the next flight to town and come in like the EPA to a major spill.

So, now I am officially CM of the pack ( was announced at B&G) but the former CM still plans on running the PW Derby, Family Camp, and Day camp this year. He didn't give me the keys to the church and said "See ya at the next meeting". We have no money in the bank and 90% of our parents think he took it. One parent was with him when he bought a new BBQ grill, several tents, and sleeping bags with pack money "for pack equipment" but that was 2 years ago and we haven't seen them yet. Our CO is angry because he doesn't respect them and the pastor had to get up at 2 am to lock up the church after it was left open. Former CM starts out every "meeting" with talking for 30-45 min then "allows" us to split for dens. We can't follow the program with him and it seems that he just isn't going to leave.

I spoke with the CO and they didn't know they had any power at all. Now that they do they don't want to get involved in asking him to leave as they know nothing about us and I fear they would rather pull the charter if we can't solve this ourselves.

 

I need help. We can't save the pack with this guy "still in charge".

Kristi

[Torveaux]

So where is the rest of the Committee? Is there at least a CC?

 

I would expect that the CC would try to explain to the old CM that he needs to let go.

 

If the guy took money, I would let the civil authorities know and they can investigate. (even though that could get messy)

 

Change the meeting place/dates and communicate directly with your team. If you can get the locks changed, all the better.

[SemperParatus]

Where is your CC in this? Is there a treasurer that can produce the cancelled check for equipment reimbursement and the submitted receipt by the CM? Is the CO willing to demand that he return their keys to them? Are you willing to tell him 'thanks but no thanks' on his future plans?

[fotoscout]

Sounds like there is a lot of work to be done!

 

First the money thing is out of control. Where is the treasurer, and the check book? Where are the receipts? If there was enough money to buy a BBQ, several tents and sleeping bag, then why are you mining the internet for neckerchiefs and uniform shirts? Aside from that, CS Packs dont normally purchase and own the type of equipment that you mentioned. Especially not sleeping bags, they are personal equipment.

 

The CM starts the meetings and then we split into dens??? VERY wrong! Den meetings happen without the CM present (almost exclusively). So what are you having: joint Den/Pack meetings?

 

 

Let the CO pull the charter, and start over!

Or go start your own Pack.

 

[cajuncody]

Ok, some clarification,

Four years ago was when the grill and tents were bought. I joined last year and we had about $300 in the bank according to Him. We went from 70 boys doing fund raising 4 years ago to 12 this year. Our Tdl was with the pack 4 years ago and said I should make sure the tents, grill, prep table, and sleeping bags are returned and I was amazed. I didnt know about them. The money (4 years ago) came from an older gentlemen as a one time donation. We have been a poor community for more than 4 years and that money could still be doing the pack good if it were still in the bank. TDL started requesting the bank books then and as of now no one but he has seen them. We have no committee, no treasure and he is the only one who can sign the checks. The pastor is new to the church and new to scouts and doesnt want a conflict.

Would starting over really be the answer? Is there no other way to get rid of him? Cant we form a committee since I am the CM of record and the CM on our charter? Could a committee or a group of parents ask him to turn over the keys, equipment, and bank books and never come back?

I have boys who quit the pack because of the way it was run who are willing to come back when he is gone and we are back on the program.

It keeps getting worse and worse.

Kristi

[johndaigler]

Kristi,

 

There's no way you can do this by yourself! Find the appropriate District/Council pros and the COH/COR and have a sit down and make a plan. If the COH and COR won't step up to the plate and do their job, I suggest getting the COH to find another COR or the Pros to begin looking for a new CO. Perhaps there are some screws the Professional Scouters can tighten on this old CM?

 

Missing money is definitely another areas for Pros, but Theft is handled by a different set of professionals. It might not be pretty, but if the people involved can't find the correct path, then the Police, etc. become necessary.

 

It amazes me how service/youth organizations like Scouting and PTOs become these tiny little despotic monarchies. There's no reason (back in the history of your Pack) for all the control to have fallen into the hands of one person. I guess people just get comfortable letting someone else carry the ball - and before long, you can't see/control which way the ball carrier is running.

 

It's tough to try to keep a coup bloodless. I think you might have to decide if it's worth it to you to win this fight. The boys are worth it - that's easy to say, but they'll be oblivious till it's all over and the program starts improving. You and a couple of others will have to wade through all the muck. Seems like there are sleepless nights ahead . . .

 

Chip away at it as if it's a series of little problems. First step - getting help from the Professional Scouters to help you (re)establish the Committee with an appropriately informed and active CO and COR.

 

Good Luck !

Keep us informed as you move through this - you aren't the only Scouter who will benefit from your choices and experiences.

 

jd

 

 

[SemperParatus]

You're the new Cubmaster - that has been announced to all and I assume the paperwork is reflecting that. Now you need to go about creating a pack committee. I am saying you need to do this, because so far I have heard nothing about a Committee Chair or a committee. If there is a CC, meet with him/her and have a nice long chat about the transition issues - get him/her on your side. If there is not, then recruit one (since your CO is not involved) and get him/her on your side. The CC will need to recruit at a minimum a Treasurer and Advancement Chair. The CC should then call a committee meeting asap that would include the CC, you, DLs, other volunteers, etc. The old CM should be invited too and told to bring the keys and the checkbook and past bank statements with him. At that meeting, the CC should ask him to turn the keys over to you and the checkbook and statements over to the Treasurer. If he doesn't bring this stuff and refuses, then the CC should indicate to him that the CO will be contacting him about the keys and the District Executive will be contacting him about the banking information (really it is the CO's money but it sounds like they don't want to get too involved) as well any equipment that had been purchased with pack funds that are currently unaccounted for. Further, in the case of his not cooperating, the CC should indicate that while his services over the past few years have been appreciated, he is dismissed from this meeting. After he leaves, the CC would look to you to share your plans for the upcoming pack events. After the meeting, the CC can then call the COR and District Exec to explain the problems and seek their assistance - in other words follow-through on getting the stuff. Now, if the CM is cooperative and brings all of this to the meeting and happily turns it over, then it is a non-event. The CC will thank the CM for his services and everyone is looking forward to a smooth transition to cajuncody and thank him for his support of your efforts. Then the CC basically turns it over to you to lead the discussion about the upcoming pack events. You choose to involve him as you see fit. If he offers suggestions, listen (he might actually have some experience to share) and consider them.

 

Note. All of this is done in the open, with plenty of witnesses and with a concerted group of people that are after the same thing - a smooth transition that will benefit the health of the pack. Doing this without help and in private will not work. My best advice is to get a CC that is 'tough as nails', on your side and dedicated to working on creating a strong pack program. Best of luck.

[scoutldr]

If I were asked to be the new treasurer, I would insist on an independent audit, preferably conducted by members of the CO who are not involved in the Pack as parents or registered leaders. Inventorying the "pack equipment" should be part of the audit. The new treasurer deserves to be able to start with a clean slate, and not be asked to straighten out the mess. You probably won't find that written in the BSA rule book, but it's the right way to do business.

 

The previous advice to get the DE talking to the COR is right on...don't try to fix this yourself. It's not the CM's job alone to recruit and train the CC and committee.(This message has been edited by scoutldr)

[Torveaux]

Another avenue of help to add to the DE is on the church end of things.

 

Is there a church council or some authority above the pastor. Not to usurp his/her power, but to augment it? Sometimes when a new pastor is hesitant to act, an established church council will have no problem reigning in someone using their facilities. (of course that could involve tricky church politics.)

 

Good luck. Remember that technically the CC is in charge and they should be helping. If you don't have one, I suppose the COR could find you a CC as an ally.

 

[anarchist]

Cajuncody,

If the CO has signed your application you are it. Ask for the keys in front of the CO/CC and others...

Bank account, you know which bank? Ask for a change of signature card. Usually most Banks accept a change of officers affidavit (usually their form) and the account is done...(hear the swoosh) with out old treasurer. The ask for the last five years account history (expect to have to pay for this) look at the check register and ask the old CM for the gear or 100% repayment...say in 48 hours or you call the local law enforcement folks...a petty theft investigation can really screw up his life...I'll bet he tumbles....

Like it was said above sometimes coups are not bloodless...

good luck...

Tell me how many door to the church and I'll raise the money to change the locks....

YIS

Anarchist

[Vicki]

Kristi, Anarchist is on the right track with this one. If you do anything to confront him before he is off of the bank account, he might just clean it out for spite. This is life at the down and dirty (been there, done that). Don't tell the bank the whole story, just ask what you need to do to change the signers to the account.

 

You can probably get a duplicate set of keys from the church.

 

Then proceed with the rest of the coup.

 

Vicki

[cajuncody]

Ok, Here is where we stand. The coup has not started yet. The pressure is growing though and I have taken some steps.

First, since our committe only existed on paper and our COR didn't know he had the job, here is what I have done. I have asked a set of parents to be our temp fundraising chairs as we are horribly broke (not even $2.00), they are thinking it over. I asked my assistant to be a temp advancement chair as she is always catching me on a technicallity, I have asked a school teacher mom to be our temp tres. as she is well known and trusted, and I have asked a very out going parent to be our recruitment chair and she agreed to fill in for now to see if she could do it. I know this really isn't my job but desperate times . . .

Second, I have researched our CO and found a teacher at the elementary school who is a sunday school teacher there. I am going to approach her to be a temp liason with the church and try to set up another meeting with the pastor. If she agrees maybe she can become our COR (I have worked with her before and she would be great).

Now that I have tossed together the people I think would be best for the job, we are going to approach the outgoing CM for the keys, bank info, and records. I am going to ask him to put the tres. on the bank account so that she "may become adjusted to the position" and can start giving financial reports.

And Finally if all goes well we are going to try to get the boys to do something "special" for the CO to bolster relations.

The only thing that leaves is finalizing a committee and getting a CC which hopefully the CO would like to appoint one.

Any more suggestions?

Kristi

Anarchist, thanks for the offer but hopefully it won't come to changing all the locks

[Vicki]

Kristi, it sounds like you have a plan - but you say you're going to ask the old CM to put the new treasurer on the account. Please don't tell me you would actually put new money into that account as long as the old CM is still a signer on it....

 

Vicki

[cajuncody]

No, I wouldn't. We plan to open a new account at a different bank. I just want her on it so that we can easily get back records. I may be southern but I not stoopid

(gentle southern jab aimed at only myself, no offense intended).

I also need to see his reaction to being asked to put someone else on the account. We will see if he thinks he has something to hide.

Kristi