Whittlin' Chip Requirements?

[NativeTexan]

A question came up at our council Pow Wow this past weekend that couldn't be immediately answered. A comment was made that someone had read that Tiger and Wolf cubs could earn their Whittlin' Chip card. Is this so? I find this very hard to believe. There are Bears in my den that I have "pocket knife concerns" about! Hopefully this person was mistaken.

[Pack38Scouter]

If my memory serves me correctly, only Bears can earn the "whittling chip" (http://www.geocities.com/~pack215/whittlin-chip.html). It's Achievement 19 (http://www.geocities.com/~pack215/bear.html). I do believe that Webelos 1 & 2 can earn the "whittling chip" card if he follows the same requirements as Achievement 19 in the Bear Book. It is not written anywhere in the Webelos handbook.

 

Tigers and Wolves handbooks do not have the option for the boys to earn this Card; however, it doesn't state anywhere that Tigers and Wolves cannot earn it. On the flip-side, some Tigers and Wolves are not mature enough to handle the responsibilities of a pocket knife (especially Tigers) IMHO. Of course the same can be said about some Bears, Webelos and Scouts!

 

Bob White and others will correct me if I am wrong on this subject.

 

My Cubs can only bring their pocket knives to a Pack or Den functions that will require the use of the pocket knife. At which time, strict observation of the "blood circle" is enforced with adult supervision. They will also have to have their whittlin' chip card with them. Sometimes at camp, we set up an equivalent of "axe yard" or "whittling circle" with it being roped off from the general public. In our Pack only Bears and above can earn the whittling chip and its rules are strictly enforced.

 

YIS

[TXscouter]

Yep, I can't quote chapter and verse, but in the new Cubleader Handbook it says that Tiger and Wolf age boys can indeed earn the whittling chip card. Now I am not going around spreading the "good news" to the boys, and I'm not going to encourage it should any of our packs den leaders start reading their handbooks, but it is allowed.

[NJCubScouter]

Bad idea, if it's true. I'll have to check the Cub Scout Leader Book and see for myself. Some of the Tigers are not even 6 years old when they join! Now, I realize it could be left up to the parents of each boy to determine when he is ready to learn to use a knife, but a reasonable "age" limit does make sense in this case. And Bear seems reasonable to me.

 

Pack38Scouter, do you really call it the "blood circle"??? I have never heard that before. We call it the "safety circle." I understand that your version is named after what you are trying to avoid, I guess ours is named after what we are trying to achieve.

[Pack38Scouter]

NJCubScouter ... yep ... for some reasons that term "blood circle" and its explanation seems to stick to the boys head better then the conventional "safety circle!" From time to time ... I can hear one Webelos said to another ... "can you please stay outside of my blood circle!" I guess that it's "cool" to refer to the safety circle as the blood circle. In the Pack, we use which ever that allows the boys to remember the clearance space required to use their pocket knife safely. Some of my Leaders use the safety circle and some use the blood circle ... we have three Bear Dens and six Webelos Patrols.

 

NativeTexan, if you know where it is referenced, please let me know. Thanks.

 

YIS

[NJCubScouter]

Well, "blood circle" does drive the point home. (Not literally, one hopes. Yuk yuk.)

 

Now, as it happened, I had the Cub Scout Leader Book in my car, and now I have it in front of me. On page 29-5 it says:

 

"Tiger Cubs, Cub Scouts, and Webelos Scouts may earn the right to carry a pocketknife to designated Scouting functions by completing requirements for the Whittling Chip card."

 

Now, I can tell you, this comes as a surprise to me. Our pack has always told the parents and boys that only Bears and Webelos could earn the Whittlin Chip. (I thought it was spelled without a "g", for "effect", but the book has dispelled that notion as well.) Where that came from, I can't say. Maybe that was true in an older version of the book. Maybe it was an assumption that grew from the fact that the requirements for the Whittlin Chip are only in the Bear book. But I have heard it on numerous occasions, and not just in our pack. Our district Cub Family Camporees almost always have a "Whittlin Chip" tent where the boys can go to hear a knife safety talk, carve a bar of soap and thereby earn part of their Whittlin Chip requirements, the rest to be signed off by the den leader later. The sign on the tent always says "Bears and Webelos only," or at least I am pretty sure it does. So, either the rules have changed, or the longstanding popular conception of the rule is incorrect. Plus, I just looked in the Guide to Safe Scouting and there is one short paragraph about knife safety that does not mention the Whittlin Chip or age limits for knife use. It does refer to both the Wolf and Bear books (plus the Scout Handbook and Fieldbook), but without any specific page references. I would be interested to see what the Wolf book says about knives.

 

This makes me wonder, what if my pack decides that we still do not want Tigers and Wolves handling knives when we go camping? Are we "adding to the requirements" for the Whittlin Chip? Or can we just say, apart from the Whittlin Chip, that our pack has decided to adopt a safety rule that you have to be at least in Bear year to handle a knife at our campouts. I know of no rule that a pack cannot adopt safety rules that are MORE stringent than those of the BSA -- I suppose the exception would be if you were interfering with the boys completing an advancement requirement, but that is not the case here.

 

And by the way, the page I refer to above does mention "safety circle" -- but not "blood circle."

[NativeTexan]

Thanks for the replies folks. It seams it is as I feared. NJCubScouter & I appear to share the same ideas around a Pack implementing a "pack safety rule" covering the use of pocket knives. As long as it has the boys safety in mind and doesn't interfere with his ability to advance I personally see nothing wrong in doing so. Looks like there will be a new topic for discussion at our next committee meeting!

[sctmom]

NJ,

My Cub Scout Leader book that I bought a few months ago (copyright 2001) says only Cub Scout and Webelos. No mention of Tigers on that same page.

 

Yikes, not sure if I want some of the parents with a knife much less the kids!

 

 

[LauraMO]

Yikes!! I don't like this news at all! Where were the author's heads of they updated the leaders' manual & A-OK'd Tigers & Wolfs to use knives? Ironically, I recently presented to my Wolf Den that they had to be Bear Cubs to earn the Whittlin' Chip card & thus were not allowed to use knives at our family camp out or at our Pack Pumpkin Decorating event.

 

There isn't any mention of knife safety (or use) in the current Wolf Handbook. Maybe an update is in the works.

[Twocubdad]

Two years ago my Wolf den earned their Whittlin Chip. By Christmas, most of the boys had Scout knives. I polled the parents and most felt that since the boys had knives, it was better they learn to use them safely.