Parents at Summer Camp

[OldGreyEagle]

I took this here because of a comment made in a thread in the open program section discussing an over energetic mother and the swimming requirements. I dont want to hijack that thread as the person who statrted the thread has a few serious issues he needs help with.

 

My question is, what are your attitudes about parents at summercamp?

 

I have commented before I come from a large troop (78 scouts), and that we have a Pediatrician as our Committee chair. She is very committed to the Troop. Both of her sons made Eagle, and her youngest just graduated from College. She sees Boy Scouts as an excellent program for many of her patients. As such we have perhaps some unusual circumstances in our troop that perhaps dont occur in others. She arrives at summercamp with two footlockers, one with her stuff, and one with the troops meds, both are the same size. Her DEA license is on file at the Health Lodge so she can dispense medication on grounds. This years Staff seemed predisposed to strep throat so the local Wal-Mart Pharmacy was inundated with anti-biotic prescriptions from her, but I digress.

 

The last two years we have lost first year kids to home sickness. We didnt want to let them go, tried what we could, but in the end I cant think of a more contagious condition that home sickness, one kid starts to well up, a bunch do and then its tough to control. We've had older, and even intermediate scouts talk to the home sickies and sometimes it works and some times it dont.

 

The Doctor commented on the two who left this year that they may have made it if they knew a parent was comming at the mid point, or if the parent would have stayed all week. Having parents walk kids around from session to session is not at all unusual in this troop, I thought that was common, but given some replies I am not sure. What about parents at summercamp? We never turn anybody away and always have a good time (as adults) what have others experienced?

 

 

[mk9750]

OGE,

 

We are like you in that we allow any parent to come to any event. Heck, we usually need the car space!

 

But seriously, we experience good and bad by doing so. You are certainly right that well - intentioned parents are an assest to the trip. But misguided parents can and are detriments to the event, the Troop, and their sons at times. When that is the case, we have to very carefully explain to the parent what level of participation is appropriate. Most have gotten the message after a friendly conversation. Others take a bit more direct (almost rude) approach. But in the end, every parent who contnues to want to go with us has been valuable to the program once they understand how to support it.

 

You bring up another issue that may again be the fodder of a different thread. You talked about homesickness. This is a phenomenon that I just can't seem to figure out. In my 8 years in Boy Scouts, our Troop has experienced exactly one case of homesickness serious enough to be evident to the adults. I just have never seen to occurances of homesickness that others seem to see.

 

Th one boy who talked about being homesick kept asking the SPL how he could call home. The SPL ran interference for as long as he could, but eventually referred him the the SM. The Scoutmaster had conversation upon converstation with the boy, trying to convince him that there was no value to be homesick, that mom and dad were doing fine without him, etc. None of this worked. Finally, the SM gave in and was going to let the boy call home from his cell phone. As far north in Ontario as we were, the cell phone wouldn't work. No one ever understood why, but the boy was OK from then through the rest of the week.

 

That was our first and only instance of homesickness.

 

We cedit some of our luck to attending summer camp many hours away from home,which gives the boys the understanding that mom and dad aren't just goin to drop everything they are doing to come pick Johny up. But other than that, we've got no explaination for our fortune.

 

Mark

[Bob White]

I have never been in a scout unit that restricted parents from camping,m whether over a weekend or a week.

 

It's important to make sure before they go that they understand their role. They are there as guests. They do not help the patrols with chores. They do not interfere in adult or youth leadership unless it is to prevent serious injury. They sit, read, eat drink, observe and enjoy, just as any guest in my home.

 

Bob White

[Bob White]

MK9750, We are waiting for your post in "Working with Kids" on the 4 Styles.

 

Bob(This message has been edited by Bob White)

[Sparkie]

I had a situation this year at summercamp in which a parent came up mid-week. No homesickness or anything. However, the father would pull his child away from all the other boys whenever it was time to go somewhere. I tried to stop it right at the beginning. I was sitting on a picnic table when he was pulling him away from a game of 4-square (we were due at a volleyball tournament). I politely said "Hey, why don't you come over here and have a seat next to me", he said "but..." i said "come on, have a seat". I then proceeded to gently inform him that he was here as an observer, not a parent. I shared with him (although i'm not proud of it) that i did overhear some boys tease another boy last year after his mother left camp. This older scout was pretty popular and could handle it, but i'm sure it still hurt. I tried to show the dad how he was pulling his son away from the other boys, and excluding him from everyone else. Unfortunately the next day it was still happening, although i'm not sure he realized he was doing it. And, I didn't push the point because i was a stand in scoutmaster for the week.

 

Don't get me wrong, it is very hard NOT to be a parent at summercamp (been there, done that). I just think it's important to remind them that they are there to observe, not to parent. This was my 4th year at summercamp, and i always take off that parent cap when i go, it helps me keep my sanity too

 

Sparkie

 

[sst3rd]

Something along these lines, but decisions I'll have to make next year as SM. First time in 16 trips, a Scout went home. He said he was sick, we took him to the Health Lodge. No problems. We went through the whole routine, and finally called his parents Monday night. The Scout long since had made up his mind to go home, sick or not. Parents upset, but also very surprised. Dad came up Tuesday afternoon (5 hours away) and took him home. The Troop had a great week. However, at the following Monday night meeting, the Scout showed up, but no parents. To make matters worse, this Scout was to take over as the Patrol Leader (we have elections at the end of the year and just before summer camp). We asked to talk to Mom at the end of the meeting. We were looking for further explanations why the Scout got homesick. Other than the parents being very surprised and upset at spending over $300.00 for the camp, they couldn't figure anything more out. I want to note that this Scout attended summer camp for the first time the prior year, and did very well for a first timer. The Mom said that next year Dad will have to attend. That's the comment I want addressed here. Should I require the Dad to join and be trained as a leader by next summer (I doubt that he will, we've tried to get both parents involved, they're too busy), or simply let him accompany us to baby sit his son (he will not interfere with the program, but observe). Also, the Scouts in the Patrol aren't to keen about this Scout taking over as the new Patrol Leader. They think that by his leaving summer camp, he was quitting the team (their words, not mine). Opinions please????? Mom didn't understand why I was concerned about their son becoming the PL. To her, this event was just "one" thing. What's the big deal. And if I wouldn't allow him to become the PL, she would move him. I countered with my concern of her son walking out of any Scout event at anytime, just because he wanted to, and by becoming the PL, why would that make any difference.

 

sst3rd

[Bob White]

Having the parent at camp is no guarantee that the scout won't get homesick. Homesickness at camp is really campsickness. The scout is either scared, unhappy or uncomfortable and he wants the security of his home. We once had a scout whose parents were going through a divorce and he wanted to be home because he was scared about his family breaking up. My point is you can only control what you can control.

 

While at camp make sure the scout is fed, rested, involved and accepted. Those are things you can have an effect on. If a parent comes and takes a scout home that is their families business and not ours as scout leaders. If the patrol wants to elect a new Patrol Leader that is their business. It is their patrol and not ours.

 

Hope this helps

Bob White

[Fat Old Guy]

Is it really your place to put him in or not let him serve as PL? He was elected and you approved the election results. On the other hand, there is nothing to prevent his patrol from having a new election and replacing him. If they've lost confidence in him already, might it not cause more damage by allowing him to try to lead when other won't follow.

 

If his mom pulls him, is that so bad? Sure, you may not want to lose a Scout but what does it say about the Scout that he would let his mom pull him. Sounds like mom is the driving force here. In any case, is it not better to lose him than to lose the entire patrol?

 

Then again, maybe you can save the situation. Maybe a conference with the patrol, the newly elected PL, and the SPL would help mend the fences.

[Twocubdad]

I've just come home from four days and Webelos resident camp (I've completed several of the "S's" but not all) and this topic is right on time. I was composing this post in my head on the drive home.

 

My question is this: as a leader, how much do you intervene between and Scout and a parent?

 

We had 18 boys, four registered leaders and six parents attending camp. One of the Scouts, a 10-year-old Webelos II, is the most disrespectful, ill-mannered, undisciplined child I have ever worked with. Unfortunately, he is the son of one of the other leaders. The boy's basic problem is that he has never failed to have his own way. He will not follow any instruction. I called his name and/or corrected him more this week than the other 17 boys combined. (Keep in mind we are talking Cubs here.) The boy is basically out of control and the father does nothing to discipline him, except when another leader steps in and embarrases him into action.

 

This morning, while packing up, his father called the boy and asked him to come over. The boy screamed "WHAT?!?!" in a very hateful tone. The dad asked him to pick up a duffle and carry it to the car. The boy started stomping the ground and arguing about how he wasn't going to do it. At that point I stepped between the two of them and told the boy that I didn't care what he did at home, but he is in Scout camp and that he would not speak in that manner to any Scout leader. Feeling a bit self-conscious about breaking in between the father and son, I left it at that (I had much longer and more detailed conversations with the boy about his behavior earlier in the week, when the father wasn't right there). As I walked away and the dad took over, the last I saw, the kid was dumping the duffel out and kicking the contents.

 

Had the kid's dad not been there (and had it not been two hours before check out) I would have sent the boy home. But how far should a leader go when the parent is right there? Do you send both the boy and the father home? The guy had a younger son with him (who is usually the worst behaved of the two, but the little one had a pretty good week this time.)

 

An interesting dynamic: We are trying to introduce the boys to the patrol method by picking one Scout to lead the others in simple tasks (policing the campsite, sweeping the bathrooms, collecting firewood, etc.) This kid won't follow instruction from any of the boys, either and usually ends up being a detriment to the completion of the task. By the end of camp, all the other boys in the patrol were sick of him and his attitude and didn't mind telling him so. It will be interesting to see how that peer pressure works on him.

 

[Sparkie]

Twocubdad...

 

I learned long ago that i cannot take into consideration how i am going to act based upon whether a parent is there or not. I am always telling kids what is inappropriate while a parent is standing there (hopefully they would get a clue too ). However, i always back up my correction with a reason such as you did, i.e. we don't use that kind-of language in scouting, we follow the leave-no-trace rule, etc.

 

You have no reason to feel self-conscious about what you did. I think you handled the situation fine. I have always said, when i became Cubmaster i never dreamed i would have to be teaching the adults how to act!

 

As far as sending them home (all of them), i would need to assess how it is affecting the whole Pack or Troop, in addition to my time. IMO, if they don't straighten up, the whole camp shouldn't suffer. Therefore, i would talk to the dad and explain to him how the disruptive behavior affects the whole camp. I'm sure he doesn't look at the situation thru your eyes, and he may need a little enlightenment.

 

Sounds like he's in for an eye-opener in Boy Scouts!

 

Sparkie

 

[sst3rd]

Bob White and Fat Old Guy,

 

Thanks for your input and suggestions. The PL is at church camp this week in Philidelphia (Mom, Dad, and Sis are in attendance), so we'll see what shacks out when he gets back. His ASPL will do fine in the meantime. We have a camping trip in less than three weeks. That will tell the tale.

 

sst3rd