Age for Northern Tier

[resqman]

I had the opportunity to attend 2 years ago. The lads in my crew were 14. Two of the lads weighed about 100lbs. 85lb pack/canoe and 100lb boy. The guide required that every crew member carry a canoe at least once during the trek. The two smaller lads did not have the upper body strength, will or fortitude to get the canoe onto their shoulders unassisted. Once a canoe was set on their shoulders, they were able to carry the canoe the portage. They preferred carrying the gear packs.

 

My son carried the canoe almost every portage. One time he carried a pack and a canoe at the same time. He weighed about 175 at the time. Stocky kid with lots of natural strength. He wanted to test himself to see if he could manage.

 

Can smaller scouts manage? Sure. Will they enjoy the trip as much if they are continously pushed to their limits round the clock for a week? Probably not as much.

 

Adult scouters are volunteers. You are spending your money and your vacation time to chaprone the scouts of your troop on a cross country trip and participate in a phsycally challenging outdoor trek through wilderness. Regardless of what National or the Base sets as miniums, you have to feel comfortable in your assetments of the people who you will have to rely on or carry/drag along the journey. If the scout is not physically or metally able to complete the daily task, who is going to end up picking up the slack? I can tell you it is not likley going to be the guide. It is going to fall upon the adult to either cover or motivate the rest of the crew.

 

I like the idea of taking the scouts and the parents to the school track and letting them take a couple laps carrying a pack and then a canoe. Particuarly the parents pushing for their younger son. Let Dad take a few laps carrying the load. Then ask them to carry the canoe or pack up and down the bleachers a few times. A better simulation of the terrain.

 

You are not saying they can never go on an a high adventure trip. You are saying YOU are unwilling to take them THIS TIME. Waiting one more year is not going to kill them. They will be better outdoorsman and more physically capable to handle the rigours. Set a limit and stand your ground. You will earn a lot of respect by being realistic with the scouts and parents.

[eagle90]

Amen! Well said, Resqman

[Eagle92]

When the heck did the age requirements change and whose stupid idea was it?!?!?!!?!?!

 

Ok I'm a bit hot under the collar about this because based upon my expereince, again this is my personal experience, the two times I knew of 12yos doing stuff that normally would be for 13+, they turned was a major FUBAR expereinces.

 

First time was the BA22 course. There was an age requirement and rank requirements same as the HA bases, FC and 13 by Jan. 1 of the year attending. They let a scout in that was going to be 13 after the BA22 course b/c he was SPL of his new troop. Long story short, he deliberately infected the blisters he got so that one of them was the size of a golfball, and he couldn't do the backpacking portion of the course, letting the rest of the patrol have to pick up his slack. NOT A HAPPY CAMPER ABOUT THAT ONE!

 

Second time was the 64 mile canoe trip in Canada. Again at the time HA bases has the FC and 13 requirement. We had two on that trip: one celebrated 13 on the trip (my canoe partner)and one who turned 13 afterwards, but dad was ASM. Long story short, ASM's kid caused so many problems that dad intervened (he was in another patrol and I heard about it). My partner couldn't pull his fair share of the work, and when things hit the fan, froze in fear. I admit he did his best to pull his fair share, but freezing with fear resulted in me getting hypothermia.

 

And that was with us practicing for 12-18 months getting ready for the trip.

 

As you can see I have some MAJOR reservations with a 12yo going on a HA trip.

[boomerscout]

the age requirement does seem arbitrary. An upper body strength requirement is what is really needed.

Hopefully, the ability or lack of to portage through a carry will be addressed at the local practice canoe trips.

Be careful having the boys carry a canoe around the school track. When they drop the canoe, and the end of it gouges the expensive running track, you may be required to repair the damage

I suppose if you choose a route with smooth, fairly level portages, you could lash everything to a golf cart and pull that along behind you.

[resqman]

"I suppose if you choose a route with smooth, fairly level portages, you could lash everything to a golf cart and pull that along behind you."

 

Not sure if you understand BWCA. BWCA is just a series of lakes or ponds seperated by hills. If there are no hills, the lakes and ponds would run together into one giant lake/river. EVERY portage is up and over a hill. There is no such thing as a smooth, level portage. Where are you going to store this golf cart in a canoe between portages?

 

If you are concrned about damaging the track, carry it on the football field. Most portages are between 10 and 100 yards, not miles. It is not that any one portage is that bad, it is that they are frequent and overtop hills. One morning we had 10 portages between breakfast and lunch. It was not uncommon to have more than 10 portages in a single day.

 

A day is constant switching between paddling and portaging. We paddled lakes/ponds that were 100 yards long with a 30 yard portage and then do it again 3 more times. We had days where we paddled for 1/2 hr and then a portage of 40 feet. By midweek you learn to approach, dismount, load the packs on to scouts, lift canoes, and strike out to the next water. The canoes are placed back in the water, the packs stowed and you are off paddling again. It is constant activity all day long.

 

Before I went the idea of portaging did not sound like fun. Once there it was nice to break up the paddling with portages. Of course there were a few portages that taxed the entire crew due to length and elevation change.

 

My personal opinion is that 12 yr olds are too young. Mostly it is a physical limitation but I also don't think many 12 yr olds have the mental toughness to keep up with the constant physical work and stay happy.

[Eagle92]

Lots of portages eh? HHHHMMMM maybe LaDomaine, Quebec was a better place, 3 or 4 portages over the week. BUT that 1.25 mile portage we did one day was a bear.

[Basementdweller]

Gouges on a track???????

 

What in the world are you talking about??? ours are cinder you could bring a shovel or rake and fix it????

 

If the track has some sort of special surface than go to a local park and map a route... I suggested the track just because the 1/4 mile loops were easy to judge distance with......

 

 

I bet most 12 year olds would give up after the first lap.

[boomerscout]

"Not sure if you understand BWCA. BWCA is just a series of lakes or ponds seperated by hills. If there are no hills, the lakes and ponds would run together into one giant lake/river. EVERY portage is up and over a hill. There is no such thing as a smooth, level portage. Where are you going to store this golf cart in a canoe between portages? "

 

I was not clear. Picture a trail that is smooth and level side to side, and not one consisting of boulders, stepping stones or cliffs. Then, a golf cart could be used over hill & dale

I've been to the Boundary Waters many times. Was trying to inject a little humor; failed as usual