LNT and Frontcountry

[BartHumphries]

One person said that Leave No Trace (LNT) doesn't apply to the frontcountry. LNT was created with the frountcountry in mind, because the frontcountry is where the vast majority of people are. I don't remember the exact figure, but somewhere between 80% and 90$ of the visits to our National Parks are to the frontcountry, it's day trippers. People that pull up and say, "I'm passing by, I have a few hours, what's neat that I should go see?" The ranger tells them about a nice look out point, they go and see it, take some pictures, have a picnic, then head back out of the park and off into the sunset.

 

True, one of the main impetus for LNT was the campsite problem, that people just kept creating more campsites, looking for a better view, a little farther away from everyone else, more ready firewood growing nearby, etc. It turns out that most ground vegetation is killed off (maybe not turned into dirt, but impacted enough that it's going to die) after only a few nights spent camping, while it might take 5-10 years or more (depending on elevation) for that campsite to return to a truly wild and natural appearance. Still, most of the problems occurred in what today we'd call the frontcountry.

[Stosh]

What's wrong with a scout practicing LNT in an urban area? It's an attitude one has for wherever they are.

 

Stosh

[BartHumphries]

Yes, LNT also applies to urban areas. It's just that one person said that LNT should be scrapped since it doesn't apply to frontcountry, then get something like a tougher IOLS (but not more training, since people wouldn't be too happy about that). I said I'd respond in a new thread after Thanksgiving dinner (which was delicious), but I guess I could have just replied in that original thread.

[JMHawkins]

Bart, I'm talking about skills and approaches to being outdoors. If you want to teach the same things for dump camping with kybos and trash cans as you do for three days into a wilderness area, then you're not doing much more than reminding folks to apply two or three parts of the Scout Law and to use the Scout Motto. Good enough as far as it goes, but it doesn't appear to go far enough in practice, if the horror stories we're reading are true.

 

Sure, we can say "dispose of trash appropriately" and that applies to Happy Creek Campground and RV Park just the same as Alpine Lakes Wilderness Area, or the corner of Fifth and Elm Streets, but...

 

If you'll recall, the thread this was spun from had a comment making the contention we have a lot of mediocre frontcountry campers who aren't very good in the backcountry. Perhaps teaching the same cirriculum for our frontcountry and backcountry citizenship is part of the reason.

 

 

 

[qwazse]

I really like the broader concept of "Outdoor Ethics."

It gives folks the perspective that LNT is part of a bigger picture of collective responsibility.

It also should cover the concept that not everyone understands "the rules", so part of our responsibility is education.

[Stosh]

qwazse,

 

Does it have to be just Outdoor Ethics? A Scout is Clean. Okay, maybe that applies to keeping their rooms clean, too. Maybe leaving the bathroom nice for the next guy, helping mom with household chores, keeping your tent organized so you know where your necker is, leaving the scout meeting room organized and cleaned up, etc.

 

Maybe we ought to title it: "Leaving an area, indoor as well as outdoor, as nice as one found it" Ethic (LAAIAWAOANAOFI). After we instill the concept in the boys, then we'll shorten it up to LNT.

 

Stosh

[skeptic]

So, what IS NOT covered by the Outdoor Code? Why do we need to continue to add more verbal approaches to things with which we already have dealt? Here it is, in case some have forgotten.

LNT is nothing more than an expansion of part of this.

 

 

The Outdoor Code:

As an American, I will do my best to

Be clean in my outdoor manners

Be careful with fire

Be considerate in the outdoors

Be conservation-minded

 

 

Be clean in my outdoor manners

I will treat the outdoors as a heritage. I will take care of it for myself and others. I will keep my trash and garbage out of lakes, streams, fields, woods, and roadways.

Be careful with fire

I will prevent wildfire. I will build my fires only when and where they are appropriate. When I have finished using a fire, I will make sure it is cold out. I will leave a clean fire ring, or remove all evidence of my fire.

Be considerate in the outdoors

I will treat public and private property with respect. I will follow the principles of Leave No Trace for all outdoor activities.

Be conservation-minded

I will learn about and practice good conservation of soil, waters, forests, minerals, grasslands, wildlife, and energy. I will urge others to do the same.

[BartHumphries]

Because double dipping is great -- we want to teach and train our kids in things that are recognized outside Scouting. We should be leaders in conservation and other "tree-hugging stuff". (emphasis humorously mine)

 

So a Scout has the Outdoor Code memorized. That's great, but it really doesn't mean jack to someone completely outside the Scouting organization. Leave No Trace (for most things) and Tread Lightly (for vehicular use, mainly) mean a lot to people outside the Scouting organization -- in fact, although the BSA can train Trainers and Masters, the programs themselves are administered from entities outside of Scouting. Thus, when we train and teach our kids properly, those achievements are recognized outside of Scouting and we (hopefully) get good press about how knowledgeable our boys are.

 

It's somewhat like First Aid (or at least it's becoming that way as fast as National committees can agree on how exactly changes should be implemented). We teach basic first aid all the time, repetitively in merit badges and early ranks, but when it comes to things like the Emergency Preparedness pin we require that boys go seek certification in a manner which is recognized outside Scouting.

 

"Discuss with your counselor what sort of hazards might be encountered while working on this merit badge and how to prevent them. (Heat exhaustion/stroke, insect stings/bites, etc.)" You see something like that in almost every merit badge. Someday you'll see something like, "Discuss with your counselor how you can practice Leave No Trace while working on this merit badge."

[Beavah]

Yah, da BSA has a strong contingent of LNT'ers that have been helping develop materials to guide and teach LNT Frontcountry ethics and practices. It's one of da BSA's bigger contributions to the LNT development, along with da BSA-specific materials now offered by LNT.

 

http://www.lnt.org/programs/frontcountry.php

http://www.lnt.org/training/educationaltraining.php

 

 

[Basementdweller]

Front or Back country it doesn't matter...........

 

You hold a camporee and 10 troops participate and 90% are fantastic outdoor citizens. so what about the single troop that thru trash in the kybo, dug a new fire pit, dumped their gray water without filtering it in the bushes..... left trash every where they went. Who gets remembered????

 

this going on at a scout camp is one thing, but what if it is at a state or national park or forest.

 

 

 

Leave no trace is not for the tree huggers and if WE are going to be continued to be welcome in these places we need to do a better job of being good neighbors while we are useing them.