BSA and Backcountry Ethics

[BartHumphries]

I think boys are too unaware of their own mortality to be scared by something like a warning of possible hantavirus infection in mice. (This message has been edited by BartHumphries)

[JoeBob]

Hey BasementDweller,

 

Timber Rattlers and Copperheads are known to enjoy an occasional mouse. Was either native to that section of trail? (Never saw copperheads up on the ridges where most shelters seem to be.)

 

Sorry those anal orifices made you feel unwelcome.

(You know the rule about 'no firearms' is just for lawyers, right?)

[OldGreyEagle]

Who mentioned anything about taking 40 boys into backcountry? I must have missed that

 

[Basementdweller]

I passed a troop of 40 on the trail. they were taking a break completely blocking the trail on a fairly narrow uphill.

[Basementdweller]

or the troop of 17 that completely depleted a water source

[Basementdweller]

or the troop of 6 that washed there plates in the water source.

[beardad]

I can tell you here in the PNW the hiking community doesn't have a favorable view of the Scouts. go to nwhikers.net and search for boy scouts. it isn't pretty, and a lot of it is just what basement is talking about. if you register to post, I wouldn't admit that you are affiliated.

 

A good portion of our back country has small limits of the number of people allowed in a group. 8 to 12 depending.

[OldGreyEagle]

Ouch there BD, all bad things, all against the Oath and Law and even the Outdoor Code. I know its popular to say that 3/4's of Scouting is outing, but outing without being scoutlike is what gets us in trouble, Maybe the phrase should be 3/4's of scouting is outing and your a scout 100% of the time? Naw, too clumsy I am sure we have some wits who are much more clever than I

[Eagle732]

The ATC recommends groups of 10 or less, a recommendation, not a rule.

 

Basementdweller, I spent the last 6 months on the AT (March - September) and have hiked over 3,000 miles of AT total. Everything that you say Scouts did, I have seen non-Scout groups doing too. Doesn't make it right, just an observation. I've also seen a lot worse by non-scout groups and individuals. On the other hand all the Scout groups I saw were mostly well behaved. Maybe a little loud late into the evening but hey they're exited about being outdoors. Many of the thru-hikers I met this year were Scouts in their youth or adult leaders. I met many Eagle Scouts and Eagle dads.

 

[Scoutfish]

I had a thought today, about what you could do:

 

Send it in to SCOUTING magazine as one of those "What would you do" questions>

 

No, it sure won't fix what happened, but it would bring up a bunch of interesting responces and maybe, the leaders of this unit ( that were not at the park) will get to wondering and possibly make the connection opf what their boys did on that day>

 

Maybe it could be an eye opener.

 

But at the very least, the next Basement will have an idea of what he could say or do...according to a national of scouters via Scouting magazine!

 

[packsaddle]

Basement, I've seen the dishwashing and the trail blocking plus cutting live trees to unblock a view, throwing garbage off the trail, crapping in streams, etc. But while the trail blocking was by a troop, I've observed that with other groups as well and I don't mind stumbling over a few feet and hands as I pass through. The perps for the really dirty stuff have almost always involved non-scouts, often on 4-wheelers or some other kind of off-road vehicle. I have filled a 4WD Suburban with garbage on more times than I care to count. The thought process that leads people to leave dirty diapers lying around campsites is one of the reasons I know my efforts to clean these places is in vain. So I step over the rest of humanity and pick up what I can....and try not to think about it too much.

[Basementdweller]

yeah, pack that is really depressing. I did not encounter 4wd or atv folks, I am sure there are good and bad in that group as well.

 

the human highlight of my trip oddly enough, was spent thursday night at a shelter site with a husband, wife with their 4 year old daughter. She had a hello kitty backpack and was quite the trooper. She asked if I could help her dad make a fire so she could have some marshmellows.

 

Well irregardless.....I enjoyed my trip and I hope to get away again soon. I will make sure I adjust my attitude to don't give a hoot and enjoy my trip.

 

 

 

[Scoutfish]

I guess it sometimes depends on your mindset going into things.

 

Being on the coast, I have spent my fair share of boat ramp experiences. Sadly enough..the more people who come to the coast..the less access and available ramps there are - people buying up property and the whole NIMBY (not in my back yard) syndrome when it comes to boat ramps.

 

Funny thing is, I watch people line up at the public boat ramp and complain about everybody in front of them taking too long. Basically, they are standing there waiting up to 30 to 40 minutes for their own turn to launch a boat.

 

So what do they do during that time?

 

That talk, they look around, they stare at other people waiting, and they complain about the wait.

 

Then when they finally get their turn, they back their boats down and stop just shy of the water, then load the cooler from the truck, get their lifejackets from the truck, get their fishing poles from the truck, get extra jackets, snacks, food, etc...from the truck.

 

Then they decide it's a good time to see if the damn boat will even crank up!

 

All that time they stood waiting around and they did nothing but complain about all the other slow pokes in front of them wasting time!

 

There have been days that I took a small coler to the boat ramp and a chair too. I just park in the non trailer parking area, pull out my chair, sit and drink a pepsi and eat a sandwhich while just watching these clueless people get bent out of shape at each other.

 

So, with the right mindset, it can be fun.

 

Oh, you know how much damage you can do to a rubber pump impeller if you crank your outboard moter while it's out of the water? I watch people not only crank them, but rev those motors up and down while bone dry!

[Eagle732]

Submitting the idea to Scouting Magazine is a great idea. I just did a class on AT trip planning and trail etiquette last weekend at an ILOS course. I'm offering to do the same for our next University of Scouting. Education is the key. Almost every Scout leader I spoke with on the trail didn't know there was a rule regarding groups using shelters.

[Eagle732]

Submitting the idea to Scouting Magazine is a great idea. I just did a class on AT trip planning and trail etiquette last weekend at an ILOS course. I'm offering to do the same for our next University of Scouting. Education is the key. Almost every Scout leader I spoke with on the trail didn't know there was a rule regarding groups using shelters.