Putting your scouts Backpack on a diet

[Horizon]

We do a presentation every year on backpacking for the new Scouts, and it is a skit of sorts.

 

The Scout Leader has his bag, with the heaviest version of everything attached.

The Venturer has HIS bag.

 

Scout leader pulls out his heavy sleeping bag, Venturer pulls his out and compares. Scout Leader talks about, "but it is only a 1 pound difference!"

 

You can see where this goes.

 

Great experience, lots of fun when the 100 pound Scouts try to put on the Leader's backpack too.

 

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As to what the Scouts carry - the rule is that after your first backpack trip you can carry whatever you want to. I have had a Scout bring a 6 pack of soda that he cooled in the leftover snow. His choice, younger Scouts thought he was cool, it was all fine. This is the same Scout who, on a training hike, carried a watermelon to share as his snack.

[Tampa Turtle]

In Florida I have tarped in winter when the bugs were down just to make a point but usually use a hammock. A few older scouts have gone to hammock to save on backpack weight but if two many do you can run out of trees!

 

I love it when our old SM does the "pack shake out" before a long hike with the new boys. I am amazed at what some boys think they "have to have" just in case.

[Eagledad]

>>I love it when our old SM does the "pack shake out" before a long hike with the new boys. I am amazed at what some boys think they "have to have" just in case.

[Tampa Turtle]

Our former bear of a SM did a practice Hike with a HUGE dutch-oven in his backpack (partially for Philmont training) so he could pull it out at the first stop and say he should try to bring a backpacking stove next time.

 

I saw a (otherwise excellent)scout try to take on a one pocket survival overnighter:

 

2 tents -a 2 man and a 1 man for his gear.

12 x 18 Blue Tarp

Sleeping Bag

4 pairs of clothes

camp stool

camp stove

 

Was pretty funny when the MBC went through all his stuff and handed him what he could take that fit in a ziplock bag.

 

[Cambridgeskip]

As well as weight being an issue it's also worth thinking about the rucksack itself. Men and women are different shapes and it is important that the boys have a man's rucksack and girls a woman's so that the weight distribution between shoulders and hips is correct. You can have the lightest rucksack in your patrol but if all the weight goes on your shoulders is going to get uncomfortable!

[Buffalo Skipper]

I have been working hard over the last year to bring my personal weight down. My winter base weight (all gear minus consumables: food, water, fuel) is just below around 14 lbs. So, for a weekend trek, I average 18 or 19 lbs, less if water is plentiful on the route.

 

Lately, however, I have been working on how to lighten loads with scouts. I am learning a lot from Doug Prosser, who regularly posts on the Backpackinglight Forum. Read a very good article here, and look for more. http://www.backpackinglight.com/cgi-bin/backpackinglight/boy_scout_gear_list.html

 

Our troop provides basic tents, which when divided weigh about 3 lbs per scout. We have a session with parents including basic gear lists and "shopping lists" showing good outfitters and recomended gear. My target for scouts if for a "Big 3" (pack, sleeping bag and tent) of 10 lbs. As we proivde tents, we focus on the Sleeping bag and pack.

 

First the sleeping bag. We look for bargins, and we encourage smaller bags for smaller scouts. Bulk is just as important here. There are several 20-30 bags out there weighting under 3 lbs for roughly $100 or less. If the parents can aquire a good bag which is not too bulky, then a smaller pack is possible, and a smaller pack means lighter weight.

 

Second are backpacks. There are lots of ultralight packs out there, but we only encourage the high end models for experienced scouts. Not for cost, but for practical loading. For cost, we have found the Alps Mountaineering Orizaba 3300. It weighs in at 3 lbs 9 oz, but with a light sleeping bag and our tents, 10 lbs total here is still possible. And with a scout cost of $71.50 it is a bargin!

 

Finally, there is gear. We work to limit patrol gear, promote layers of clothing, and most importantly, keep the quantity of personal gear to a bare bones minimum. The true focus we promote with our troop's lighweight backpacking is skill and confidence. With this approach it is not necessary to carry the kitchen sink on campouts. We also work to make meals simple, nutritious, lightweight, and easy to cook with very little gear or mess (Freezer Bag Cooking!).

 

This approach is new to us, and we are still working out the kinks, but I take the attitude: "Would you rather carry a 40 lb pack, or a 20 lb pack?" And then we let them (the parents and scouts) carry around each weighted backpack. It makes their decision easy for everyone.

[Eagledad]

Well done Buffalo Skipper. Our troop also worked to teach light weight back packing to all the scouts. You seem to have taken it to an even high level, but I can say that technology has improved a lot even in the last 10 years.

 

Our troop is a backpacking troop and except for the tents, the scouts use the same light weight backpacking equipment on our mounthly campouts as they do on their high adventure trips.

 

One of the struggles for a new scouts is the investment in the equipment. Many families cant come up with the money for good backpacking equipment. So we spent a lot of time researching and watching for sales. Non cotton moisture repelling clothing is pretty common now even at Walmart. But 20 years ago that was expensive and hard to find. So when Campmor and REI had big sales we jumped on them. And we even found discounts stores now and then. Our crews looked pretty rag tagged on treks. But the big challenge was the sleeping bags and backpacks. Its nice to hear that a 20 degree bag can be had for $70 today, even if it isnt the best quality. That same back was $120.

 

But the big thing was backpacks. Since we were a backpacking troop, our new scouts had to learn quickly how to use them. That sounds easy, but in reality learning to properly pack a pack takes practice. Plus the added problem of growth spirts most scout go through between age 12 and 14 also limits the investment of packs. So we develop the routine of suggesting new scouts get either the Jansport or Kelty entry level packs that cost us around $70. We found that packed properly, a scout could carry up 4500 ci of gear at pretty heavy weights. Those packs were external frame packs with lots of pockets, hooks and loops, which made it easier for a entry level person to pack their gear all over it. We had many of those packs make it through Philmont. About the time the scout added 30lbs and 6 inches in height, they had the experience to jump over to internal frame packs which require good packing skills. And, it was typical for a used starter pack to be on display at a Troop meeting with a for sale sign. I watched my first son's Jansport go on three Philmont treks on three different scouts.

 

What Buffalo Skipper knows is that his scouts are at a different level of Backpacking than most of the Troops and crews they meet. Our crews are always amazed with crews taking off the first morning for the Philmont trails in their brand new look a like gear and 50lb plus packs. They just shake their heads and WHY?

 

There is a lot of personal skills that will develop from camping out of a pack. Boys have to learn how to plan a head, organize and work as a team to get their personal pack light as possible. Its hard to be a slob and pack for a 7 day packpacking trip in the wilderness. Just understanding and knowing how to dress requires a scout to make smart decisions.

 

Scouting for me as an adult is all about developing character and I found that living out of a backpack is a very positive and intense character developing approach.

 

I love this scouting stuff.

 

Barry

 

[Buffalo Skipper]

Thanks for the kind words. In reality, we only backpack 2x a year, but it is very well planned. Webelos cross in February, and we educate them and give them a 9 months of experience. In December, we ususally try to do a warm up hike for the scouts. We leave on Friday evening and come out midday on Sunday. We keep the milage short enough that anyone can make it. Then in January, we try to schedule a longer, 3 night trek. For this, we usually go further afield, and divide the scouts into 2 ability groups. The younger guys will usually keep it under 15 miles while the older ones may do as much as 25. Scouts choose their routes and plan.

 

First, three good bags out there now are:

1) Campmor/Kelty Cosmic 20 (550 f down), 40 oz on sale for $89.98 (Campmor offers a scout discount!).

2) REI Downtime 20(600 f down), 46 oz on sale for $109.93 (more than the Cosmic 20 but a high quality product)

3) Eureka Silver City 30, 34 oz at Eureka for $59.99 (this is a synthetic kids bag, so it is for the smaller ones)

 

Second, we encourage scouts to buy smaller packs. If you have a 4500 c.i., a scout will will fill it. Personally I just downsized from a 4800 c.i. pack to one which is closer to 3200, and I am finding that I do not fill it. The Orizaba is 3300 c.i. and is excellent for small guys, as you can strap a pad on the outside (everything else goes in!). Larger than that is not needed.

 

For adults, I highly recomend an inflatable pad; look at the Pacific Equipment Company Peak Elite AC. If you take the 2/3 length, it weighs only 11 oz (use a cut down 20"x20" foam pad for your feet adding only 1.4 oz). This pad is 2.5" thick and at $60 is a real luxury. Scouts do fine with foam pads, but I encourage them to cut it down to their personal size. For an average 13 year old, this will drop a 14 oz pad down to 9-10 oz. Everything counts.

 

Ask the scouts to scrutinize every piece of their gear--every little item. Challenge them to come up with lightweight and cheap alternatives. One liter Gatoraid bottles are great for water. Use Aquamira drops or Polar Pure tablets. Compared to a filter which weighs 16 oz, drops weigh 2-3 oz and the tablets less than 1 oz.

 

Make challenges. The patrol with the lightest average weight gets a xxx prize. Make it fun. Scouts like to have fun and be challenged. Get all the adults in the troop to buy in. This makes a great difference.

 

Redefine "Be Prepared" as not bringing everything along with you, but practicing your skills so you don't need the extra gear. A lighter pack greatly reduces the risk of an injury!

[Buffalo Skipper]

Oops, double post. (This message has been edited by Buffalo Skipper)

[Basementdweller]

I think our biggest obsticle to a lighter pack is dollars. We are going backpacking this weekend. It is supposed to be below freezing. with extra blankets and the zero degree bags the boys can afford their packs with bags and backpacks start out an 10 + pounds before you add food or water.