winter campout clothing

[tmonahan]

I found these links to be vey helpful in planning for winter campouts and what to wear.

http://www.bsatroop98.com/wintercamping.htm

http://www.macscouter.com/KeepWarm/index.html

http://www.backpacking.net/wintertips.html

 

I am sure there are others.

 

[acco40]

Why no cotton?

The human body generates heat. The outside air in winter is cold. Needed, good insulation. Avoid conductors. Water, also generated by humans, is a good conductor. Cotton, absorbs water. If it then comes in contact with human, i.e skin, the human gets cold. Science project: Why does a ten degree tree feel so much warmer than a ten degree metal flag pole?

 

Boots? Thinsulate? Felt liners? A combo?

Thinsulate. Felt is cotton.

 

Coat? Down? Fiberfill? Hooded?

Down - expensive. Fiberfill - cheaper. Both good insulators. The brain needs lots of energy which it gets from blood. Because of this, human lose much body heat via their head so keep it covered. I tell our Scouts if their fingers are cold - put on a hat. If their toes are cold - put on a hat.

 

Mittens? Gloves? Mittens are warmer. Gloves are more functional. I have a pair of rag-wool gloves with a slip over "mitten thingy." I wear over glove liners.

 

Long underwear and shirt? YES!

 

Ski pants? necessary? Water / wind barrier needed (especially if snow is present).

 

Enough science. One thing I tell the Scouts is the dorkier it looks, the better chance it has for keeping one warm!(This message has been edited by acco40)

[AwHeck]

These posts make me very thankful for our troop's long-standing requirement that ANY scout new to the troop attend our troop-led "Winter Camp Training" prior to tent camping during the months of November - April. We live in the Colorado foothills - most of our scouts live at elevations between 7000 and 9000 ft. Our winter camp training - which is taught by our older scouts - provides clear guidance on how to stay warm both in clothing and in sleeping systems. Parents are welcome to come and listen to the information presented but we also try to make most of the information available on handouts which go home with the scouts.

 

We keep track of who has attended the training and check it prior to allowing them to sign up for a "winter" campout. We do have a few campouts during those months where they sleep indoors rather than in tents so the rule is relaxed for those campouts. We've had scouts involved in winter sports who just haven't been able to make it to the training over several years ... it's usually scheduled for the first Saturday in November and they just have to miss a few campouts each year. We've also had scouts transfer in at various ages - all must go through our troop's training so that we know what they've been taught.

[msnowman]

Thank you for the help with my winter shopping list for Nephew. Now that I have some direction, his shopping just became much easier...if I can convince him to wear wool socks...he has only ever worn cotton (wool being too itchy). Layers, layers, layers....good for cakes, parfaits and winter wear.

 

Thanks again

Michelle

[anarchist]

msnowman,

 

modern processed wool is not "scratchy". I have wool hunting shirts that feel better than cotton and wool hunting / winter camp socks that are thick and luxurious. Aided by thermal "wicking' sock liners (again - layers)your feet stay dry and comfortable.

 

The Night-Time advantage-for camping on really cold nights...

 

A wool or thinsulate lined cap or hat is great but remember to have a second one in the "sleep-clothes" bag for the night...a second one-one that is dry is important for a good nights sleep in cold weather. lots of body heat escapes from the head...traping it "in" is important.

 

And fresh, clean, dry socks and fresh, clean, dry sleep wear (thermals are nice), not the clothes he played in and sweated in all day...(a mistake many scouts and scouters alike make).

 

Boys being boys...when it is sack time, they are usually warm from moving around all evening or sitting by the fire and many are reluctant to shuck out of their warm clothes..."electing" to stay warm and sleep in their "warm" clothes...Big Mistake...as the night goes on the lack of body activity combined with the rapidly cooling sweaty clothing means the boys get cold...and miserable.

On a multi-day winter camp a goods night rest is very important. Hope it helps.

 

anarchist

[Kudu]

modern processed wool is not "scratchy".

 

That depends on your sensitivity to wool. I have tried different brands of "smart wool"/acrylic blend socks, and even with sock liners it is like slipping my foot into a bee hive.

 

Always let your Scouts know that heavy duty 100% acrylic socks are available in good outdoor stores.

 

Kudu

[OldGreyEagle]

What do you do with parents who complain all these "new" clothes are too expensive and cant be borne by the family budget?

[msnowman]

While I can't speak for all parents about the cost of "new clothes", I can say that for us, the only cost I'm choking on is socks. Wow good, non-cotton socks are expensive. I knew I'd be spending upwards to $90.00 each for boots and coat, that's what happens when your almost 12 year old wears a mens 11 1/2 boot and men's medium coat...not more kids deals.

 

For me personally, this has been one of the most helpful threads I've read here in a while....thank goodness for you folks.

 

YiS

Michelle

[Gags]

Michelle,

 

If you're spending $90 on boots, you're spending too much. Is he still growing? Don't waste money on high-end boots that will last one season.

 

I bought insulated boots from Sports Authority that were actually "Totes" brand, like the umbrellas. I think I paid $30-35. Even with one pair of (gasp!)regular cotton socks, I was comfortable in 25 deg weather. I'd even say downright toasty.

 

As for $90 on a jacket, that seems high as well. A 12 yr old doesn't need any of those breathable fabrics in a winter coat. I think LL Bean has a down winter jacket for only $70 (not water proof, though, but just something to use as a guide). If he has a big lightweight rain coat, then the Bean jacket may not be a bad idea (that layering thing again). Here's some other ideas from Campmor.com: http://www.campmor.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/CategoryDisplay?catalogId=40000000226&storeId=226&categoryId=33331467&langId=-1&parent_category_rn=61294.

And of course, try Marshalls or Burlington Coat Factory.

 

For boots, there's 2 that look warm. http://www.campmor.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/CategoryDisplay?catalogId=40000000226&storeId=226&categoryId=69720&langId=-1&parent_category_rn=69710

The Ranger Kenai for $29 and the Kamik Nation for $49. Since it's Maine, I don't know what kind of snow depth you'll be in. If snow getting in boots is a problem, then a slightly higher boot like the Kamiks or Sorel Blizzard II ($65) may be needed. Gaiters can solve this problem as well.

 

I guess that's about it for my rant. Sorry for the long URL's. Why is it that I get much more excited about these posts than whether to use "virtual" patrols on a campout? :-)

 

--Gags

[anarchist]

OGE,

 

yard sales and flea markets, thrift shops and my favorite -real army surplus stores (OD wool socks $2.00 pair (new) liners $4.00, "Bear jackets" (actually the liners in the cold weather outfit for $30-35.00. good gloves $3.00-$8.00!

 

for outer-wear depending on your neck of the woods there are usually several "ski/snow board swaps" every spring/fall and outer wear in good shape is well priced...

 

and most important as I have "said" before in these forums ...the leadership (adults) in our troop have a standing committment that money will not stand in a deserving scout's way....We are blessed with a group of leaders who are willing and able to reach into their own pockets to see that scouting is available...starting with the uniform...

 

So,We would take the lad off to the 'sales' and outfit him (one way or the other, and make sure he had a plan to "work to earn his way)...just like summer camp... "taking care of our own" means something to the gal and guy Scouters in our troop (like I am sure it does in most troops out there.

 

(so you know we are not running for sainthood here)...if the family's reason for not being able to support their scout is the cost would stop them from sending him to sports camp next summer or they just bought him a new entertainment center...we would be real 'heavy' on the requirement for the lad really earning his own way...no free lunches...but money should not deter a boy either.

anarchist(This message has been edited by anarchist)

[Kudu]

What do you do with parents who complain all these "new" clothes are too expensive and cant be borne by the family budget?

 

Try a "New Scout Patrol Thrift Store Caravan." Spend a Saturday afternoon driving the new Scouts from thrift store to thrift store looking for $3-5 boots, jackets, fleece sweatshirts, non-cotton pants, etc.

 

In our area, thrift stores do not feature seasonal differences in clothing, so the selection of winter clothing is much better in the warmer seasons.

 

I like my expensive high-tech stuff, but for demonstration purposes I have a complete wardrobe of thrift store camping clothing with large "clown-size" price tags so that the price I paid is visible to the audience as I explain how to shop for a $40 winter wardrobe.

 

Kudu

[Gags]

Kudu,

 

Thanks for the idea. I think I know have a presentation to offer up for the next Roundtable.

 

Gags

[Lynda J]

My first layer is silks. The type you get to wear under ski suites. Then a layer of insulated. then my pants. But the most important thing is layering. I have had parents send their kids with one set of heavy cloths. We give our boys a list of recommended camp gear. One for summer one for winter. We then have our new boys bring their gear a week before our caming trips. We also recommend that they get the 2-3 gallon zip lock freezer bags to put their cloths in. We go over how they packed and what they packed. What they don't need and what they might need to add.

[LongHaul]

One thing to remember is that One size does not fit all by that I mean what keeps you warm may cause me to perspire like it was full Summer. I bought a pair of Thinsulate boots and within the first hour my feet were soaked. Wore them twice (tried liners in minus 10 degrees and still felt like I poured a cup of water into my boot. The suggestions posted are right on the money but one should test their equipment before relying in it. Being too warm is as dangerous as being too cold if you dont ventilate quickly enough. Try to stay comfortably cool rather than comfortably warm. Stay Dry!

LongHaul