canoeing tips, trips and 'lessons learned'

[red feather]

Seems to a lot on info out there about canoeing, thus this thread.

 

Lake canoeing is to me harder than stream canoeing. Harder physically and proper gear seems to be more important. Lake treks gear weight needs to be lower due to the paddling needed and the portages required ( if more than one lake is being traversed). With the increased portages good footgear is one of the things I learned is needed. Good strong soles and shoes with the ability to dry quickly. Also cotton socks are not the best to wear, nylon or polyester socks worked the best for me, dried quickly. Nylon pants and shirts work well also with a good hat, 'boonie style' worked well if they had some sort of chin strap to keep them on in the wind or during a tip over.

 

Stream floats... we have always started the float by tipping each canoe with riders in them to get them over the fear of flipping and to teach and show them how to recover from a tipped canoe.

 

Duluth style packs work well, especially if they come with a tump line. Assign each member of your crew specific duties to accomplish during each portage and be willing to modify them as the trek continues.

 

Good maps in map cases make life easier also. Each person should have a whistle and compass. The whistle is to be used ONLY in emergencies.

Padding for the canoe bench will also improve the enjoyment of the trip.

 

Hopefully others will add to this and if anyone has specific questions please post them here and surely someone will have an answer.

 

yis

[Matthew43]

Hi my name is Matthew reed ASM Troop 21 Gouverneur, NY. Our Scoutmaster Paul Lamson has been hosting canoe trips now for over 7 years!! Its a lot of fun!!

 

One thing I may add for saftey equipment is a cell phone and 2 way walkie talkie radios!! Ones that are FRS.GMRS type!!

 

We have never had any problems on the river before but you just never know. We have held canoe trips now for 7 years plus!! I have attended everyone!! We have had over 200 scouts attend our canoe trips!!

 

2 years ago we were feeding over 300 poeple including scouts and there famlies!! We have people come in a make big a HUGE BBQ dinner for everyone. So while we are canoeing we dont have to worry about returning to camp tired and having to worry about supper as its ready for us when we return to the campsite.

 

We have always have a had great success on canoe trips.

 

Just make sure you give your boys a little experience before before planning a bigger event!!

 

Also prerunning a section of river before a bigger event could also save a lot of problems also!! HAVE FUN!!

 

 

[SagerScout]

OK, y'all with experience: how do we go about the planning for an overnighter with a small troop (9) with a wide range of abilities. All have passed BSA swimmer, but a couple of them were "barely." My experience tracks redfeathers - a little current goes a long way toward improving a canoe day! But of course I want to be absolutely confident of making it to my site with all the boys I started out with.

 

Here in central Texas, we have some very pleasant rivers - none are raging like in the mountains, we just don't have that much water anywhere - but all of them have some hazards on them, either little rapids or (more frightening to me) strainers. I haven't gone downstream myself in about 20 years.

 

If we have to go find additional resources we will. Money is a big problem for us, though, so any advice "on the cheap" is appreciated.

[Matthew43]

Well planning a trip is easy... Basically you need to find a river, I would pre-run it then you will know where the problem area's are, and can set up saftey teams using experienced canoers if so needed.

 

THIS IS FOR GOING GROUP style like we do every year. We ALWAYS pre-run the river 1 WEEK ahead of time to find the mean areas!! Then setup saftey teams at each area were we think a problem might occur. Everything from little rapids to portages. Everthing is well thought and plaaned!!

 

Also we try to put in our group 1 hour ahead of the rest so the most experienced will be in the troble areas WAY BEFORE the main group!!

 

We do this for a special reason. They make a GOOD saftey team is the main reason!! Most of our guys have been doing the canoe trip runs now for all 7 years. Our scoutmaster knows all our ablities, so is not very worried about us on the river. He has trained us over the years for any possible situation, and how to get around them!! We also have leaders with our guys anyways so everyone is pretty safe!!

 

AS for equipment and money for equipment, I cannot help you out in those catergories.

 

Try your local scout camp and local counsil to see if you can borrow camp equipment. Its what we do.

 

 

[ASM4005]

Our Troop is considering a *Reward Trip* on the Mississippi River for our Eagle Scouts and Den Chiefs. Cape Girardeau, Mo. to Cairo, Ill. 50 river miles, 3 nights (no dams). Adults will cook all meals (Scouts select menu). Troop Camping Trailer will precede canoeists to set up camp for the Scouts at access points. Planning on early fall, 2004 (low water levels for safety). Will have a 20 ft. river johnboat with emergency gear(marine radio,GPS, cell phones, 1st-aid kit,lights,etc to accompany canoes. We expect to have 14 Eagle Scouts and 4 Den Chiefs paticipating. SM, Dads and ASMs will also be invited. Good swimmers, canoe MB, PFDs will be mandatory requirements.

 

Will this work ? Comments/recommendations ?

 

Thanks

ASM 4005

[le Voyageur]

I agree with RF, paddling the still waters of a lake, or a large body of water can get tuff. More so if you're dealing with winds, I would rather run whitewater in a rain that wipes out the V's than to deal with wind.

 

One of the easiest ways to reduce the fatigue, and the wear and tear on shoulder joints in flatwater is in paddle selections. For swift water a wide blade works great, but works against you in flat water. A better blade wood be either a narrow otter, or beaver tail blade. And one of the best traditional blades out there is the Nashwaak, a narrow blade otter tail using an old Maliseet design where the the center section has been thinned out. This allows the blade to flex on the draw thus acting like a shock absorber (I've no experience with the bents, so can't really comment on them, other than the fact that they don't work worth a hoot in swift water).

 

The downside for most flatwater blades is the grip which are of the clam shell type. I've always found the T grips much better and more useful. With a T you can reach out to pull a boat toward you, hook it under the strap of a PFD, or as a step to help someone back into the boat.

 

Another way to help reduce fatique is by switching postions every and now then between the bow and the stern. The safest way for folks to switch out is to have a buddy boat brace alongside.

 

Now one of my chief complaints is with those cheap orange horsecollar PFD's that summer camps like to buy and use. My feelings is, that If your life is worth only 8 or 10 bucks, then fine, use them. However, the 3's and 5's are a much better choice. To serve their purpose proper fit is a must, and ride up must always be considered. For the wee folks it may be necessary to have a crotch strap to eliminate any ride up. As for life span of a PFD, I toss them after 3 years, but I tend to be out more than most, so maybe 5 years would be more reasonable if they are kept clean, and stored out of sunlight. However, if I was running a lot of salt water, then it would be no more than 2 years.....

 

 

 

 

 

[Matthew43]

Yes wind on a lake can be very dangerous. AS my Scoutmaster WILL NOT put any kid in our troop or any other troop on a lake that is windy!! No matter what there expereince is!!

 

The difference between river canoeing and lake canoeing can be like night and day!!

 

Plus yes I do belive PFD's should be MANDATORY EQUIPMENT!!

 

Yes both leaders and boys should be REQUIRED to wear them NO MATTER THERE EXPERIENCE!! YES leaders should wear them because its sets a GOOD EXAMPLE for the boys. Thats one of the jobs of leaders, to set a GOOD EXAMPLE for the boys!!

 

PFD's DO SAVE LIVES!! I have heard so many cases of drownings up here in the North Country. One thing that was in common with ALL of them was that was the person(s) that drowned WERE NOT wearing a PFD!! In most of the cases a PFD would have saved there lives!!

 

I STRONGLY BELIEVE that a PFD should REQUIRED on trips involving water activities (canoeing, kayaking, row boating, whitewater, etc...)!! Except for in school pool swimming or activities where there are PLENTY lifeguards available at ALL times!!

 

Which is 1 lifeguard for every 5 to 8 people!!

 

 

[eisely]

G2SS is very clear that PFD's are required for all scout float trips. I have been in a situation where a PFD saved my life, and that of a scout, so I am a believer. I agree with LV about the cheapo PFD's. As LV says, they also deteriorate with age. I have had one of the rental orange babies come apart in my hands. My wife and I have our own PFDs.