Knot Device Priorities

[Porteiro]

Any thoughts as to why there seem to be so many more knot device patches available for scouters that work with cub scouts than those that work with boy scouts, varsity scouts, and ventures? Do you think this was done intentionally by national, or did it just accidentally happen?

[emb021]

It was done intentionally, because the positions are very different, requiring different training.

 

In boy scouting, varsity scouting, venturing, and sea scouts, you basically have just 2 types of unit leaders: the key leader and the assistants.

 

In cub scouts, you have the cubmaster, but then you have the tiger cub leaders, den leaders and webelos den leaders, who are almost unit leaders in their own right, because the dens met on their own. Hence the need for their own training and training awards. then you have the den leader coach/cub scout trainers, again who need their own training and award. For the assistants, there is another award.

 

Its due to the difference in the programs.

[qwazse]

Never counted. But, really, I think cub leaders endure so much more than the rest of us!

Bless the lot o' yinz. And if knots keep you in the game, let's make you a few more.

[UCEagle72]

This happened back in 1990 (may have been late 80s, I was a CM then, and insisted that I was completing my CM Key) - and at the time, the basic awards were similar to what we have had - Den Leaders Training Award, Den Leaders Coach Training Award, Cubmaster's Key.

 

But many awards required 3 years of service, and many Cub Leaders were not in the program that long. So they came up with the new awards to recognize those leaders that did the work, and completed the training.

 

Of course, now that training is becoming "required" (we are one of the pilot Councils -- coming soon to the rest of the country) - I wonder if the requirements for these awards will change?

 

[nolesrule]

Got confused by the subject. A knot device is the little program area pin that attaches to a knot in instances where the same award/knot can be earned in multiple program areas. Some such knots are the youth religious knot and the Scouter's Key knot. There are devices for Cub Scouting, Webelos Scouting, Boy Scouts, Venturing, Varsity, Sea Scouts, Commissioners and District Committee.

 

I guess if they wanted to cut back on knots, they could combine the different Cub program Den Leader awards into a single knot, and create a Tiger Cub device, so that the single knot could then be used with Tiger, Cub and Webelos devices.

 

But I don't really have a problem with the separate awards for Cub Leaders, as the 3 den programs are different in how they are rolled out. They do a lot of work for the boys and should be recognized.

[SeattlePioneer]

Personally I'm campaigning for the idea that Tiger Cubs is THE most critical program in Cub Scouts. I see too many packs begin to fail when a poor job is done of recruiting Tiger Cubs or the Tiger Cub den fails to form or have a good program.

 

Around here, I'm offering Tiger Cub Den Leader training before our June Roundtable, and combining that as a program with our Tiger Twilight camp. The idea is that parents NEW to Scouting will get training on how to run a quality Tiger Cub program and then SEE and FEEL what a quality Tiger Cub program is like at the Tiger Twilight Camp.

 

That's the package I'm selling to Pack leaders, asking them to sell to new Tiger Cub parents. And as Tiger Cub applications come into the council office, we will be mailing out solicitations for the training and Tiger Twilight Camp directly to Tiger Cub partners as well.

 

Having the Tiger Cub Den Leader knot to sell as motivation plays a small role in this effort as well.

[Tampa Turtle]

I am an ASM now but did 3 dens of Tigers. When I got the Tiger Leader know I felt I EARNED it. The boys were enthusiastic but very wild; a meeting could go south in a minute. Man I sweated out the planning for those meetings...

 

I think the recognition helps a little bit.

[jr56]

Definately, if the recognition encourages some leaders to stay involved, great. But even more important to me, if you look at the requirements for the awards, any leader fulfilling those requirements will be doing a pretty good job of running his or her aspect of the program. It provides a good road map, so to speak.

[Porteiro]

I've worked as and received training for most Cub Scout positions, and I honestly don't see the different Cub Scouting programs being more different from each other than Boy Scouts vs. Varsity Scouts vs. Sea Scouts vs. Ventures.

[BluejacketScouter]

I did two rounds as Tiger leader and felt I should have earned two knots. The TDL could be the biggest parent recruiter in the pack.

 

The first den that I "inherited" had been meeting for about 3 months and the CM had allowed it to be a baby-sitting drop off...by the time we hit the end of the school year I had 3 parents on PC and 1 as ADL for the next Tiger/Wolf transition. Felt pretty good about that. There were still a few who sat sullenly in the back, participated only when their son didn't have the dexterity for whatever craft they were working on, and generally looked like they couldn't believe they had to be there.

 

Might only be 1 hour per week per boy, more like 2 hours for the parents.