Tradition and Uniforms

[Eagle92]

I am not trying to be negative, and it I came off that way I apologize. I know GSUSA is active in the community, I have a leader in my pack,but you never "see" them, except when selling cookies. that's a complaint I hear every time I got to Walmart after a pack meeting or RT from an older lady who use to serve as a GS leader when her daughter was at that age.

 

To be honest I can see the point. Both the BSA and GSUSA do a service project on Memorial Day weekend, placing flags out and taking them in. If you look at the picture posted in the paper, it looks like a BSA service project, with sisters helping out.

[ChaiAdventure]

Beavah

 

Great argument for uniforms, but not sure that I agree with your perspective.

 

Uniforms in Scouting are not to distinguish one scout from another, but rather to unite Scouts as Scouts. Uniforms are a common denominator that bind all of BSA......just look at any scene from Jamboree, or a photo from Boy's Life.

 

That is the purpose and defination of a uniform....sameness, equality and shared situations.

[Woapalanne]

ChaiAdventure said: "Uniforms in Scouting are not to distinguish one scout from another, but rather to unite Scouts as Scouts. Uniforms are a common denominator that bind all of BSA......just look at any scene from Jamboree, or a photo from Boy's Life. "

 

EXACTLY!! Bravo. (The scene at Jambo, with thousands of uniformed Scouts coming into the Arena, is one that brings a lump to the throat. That is, if you are serious about the program. Those are moments I'll never forget.)

 

 

[OldGreyEagle]

When I was a kid, wearing blue jeans meant you were just like the older cooler kids in the neighborhood, never thought that it meant you were a commoner

 

My parents taught me to regard people by their behavior, never thought clothes entered into it much

 

Thought if you think enough of an organization to join it, you follow its rules.

[Scoutfish]

OGE: Yeah, when I was a kid, we wore those butt ugly bell bottom courderoy pants with the hughmongous buttons, green, brown, rust colored polyester reversable slacks that had the slide tab instead of snaps or buttons.

 

Blue Jeans? Oh man o man...tyose were wore by the cool guys who wore buckle boots and drove those cool Firebirds and Cuda's!

 

When you finally were wearing a pair of blue jeans...it was like finally getting your "Man-Card" !

[83Eagle]

To be honest I can see the point. Both the BSA and GSUSA do a service project on Memorial Day weekend, placing flags out and taking them in. If you look at the picture posted in the paper, it looks like a BSA service project, with sisters helping out.

 

That's basically my point Eagle92, and why I think that it's "a shame" (literally meaning, "it's unfortunate") that the GSA doesn't have more of a uniform standard.

 

Am I "ashamed" that my daughter is a Girl Scout and involved in community service? That would be absurd, and that's never what I said.

 

The uniform does not define a Scout, but it does clearly identify a Scout, the same way that a uniform defines my son's little league baseball team, etc. That alone is the reason why I do not understand the GSA's failure to adopt a uniform standard for both girls and leaders as the BSA has done. It's a puzzling situation, but certainly not shameful.

[Jeffrey H]

I wear the full uniform as an Adult Leader in Cub Scouts and Boy Scouts for the following reasons:

 

1) To show that I'm a member of a great youth organization that I believe in.

2) To set an example to the Scouts and Scouters for proper wearing of the full uniform.

3) I paid good money for my uniforms and I'm not letting them sit in my closet just because I'm saving them for a more "formal" event.

4) It is a method of the Scouting program.

 

When Adult Leaders are more consistent with our uniforming, then we will see more boys doing the same.

[qwazse]

I was just at a formal suit-and-tie function where medals on your lapel were par for the course (a la Bevah's original definition of "Court-esy"). ... and most of the conversation revolved around how you got your bling. In addition to an award pertaining to the institute hosting the meal, I threw on an Eagle medal and a venturing leadership award.

 

Rather than setting myself "above" or "apart", it gave me an opportunity to talk about scouting and the great programs it offers.

 

However, the most meaningful award was the smallest: my "Eagle dad pin." I hope my youngest son noticed.

[gcnphkr]

When I wear my field uniform in public I am invariably either thanked for what my service and told how much scouting meant to them, or I am asked what their son needs to do to join scouts. Neither has ever occurred when I wear my activity uniform.

[camilam42]

@Jeffrey H,

 

"I wear the full uniform as an Adult Leader in Cub Scouts and Boy Scouts for the following reasons:

 

1) To show that I'm a member of a great youth organization that I believe in.

2) To set an example to the Scouts and Scouters for proper wearing of the full uniform.

3) I paid good money for my uniforms and I'm not letting them sit in my closet just because I'm saving them for a more "formal" event.

4) It is a method of the Scouting program.

 

When Adult Leaders are more consistent with our uniforming, then we will see more boys doing the same."

 

I couldn't agree with you more. The point of adult leader uniforms is to be an example. I realize that many think that the focus should be on the Scouts, but my argument would be that by a leader wearing the uniform, he is focusing on the Scouts in question. He is providing them an example to follow. Thanks, for your post Jeffrey.

 

So, I think that not only should the Scouter wear the uniform, but he should be properly adorned in his patching. Notice that I said properly. He should be wearing what is proper for him as a Scouter and what he is entitled, but I do think that he should be properly adorned. This shouldn't be about anything other than providing an example for Scouts. I know ego plays a part in some of this, but to be honest, Scouters should be proud of their accomplishments because it shows that he's been leading an active and vigorous Pack/Troop.

[acco40]

Beavah - Despite our protestations to the contrary, that's still da purpose of uniforming, eh? To distinguish between people.

 

The BSA states just the opposite. They push uniforms so the Scouts are "uniform" - just like many schools do. They don't want the less materially blessed Scout to feel inadequate for the more materially blessed.

 

(Late apologies to the Chaister. Didn't see your post before I typed mine.)

 

John in KC - Mexican Generals? I don't set my sights that low! Nothing but the Panamanian General look will do for me.

 

Eagles 83 & 92 - Isn't part of the GS of USA mission to teach them to be fashionistas so the "uniform" doesn't help in that regard. (This message has been edited by acco40)

[desertrat77]

Folks have no problem wearing uniforms as long as they are proud of the organization they belong to, the uniform looks good, and is reasonably priced.

[Oak Tree]

that's still da purpose of uniforming, eh? To distinguish between people.

 

I'd say it's definitely part of the point of the uniform to distinguish Scouts from non-Scouts. That's why we get all those stories about how people talk to you when they see you out traveling with the Scouts in uniform.

 

The uniform also serves to distinguish the leadership positions. It serves to show the higher ranks and the lower. It can show who has the most merit badges, or the most knots, or the trained strip, or Wood Badge beads, or the Arrow of Light. For the Scouts, the uniform removes their non-Scouting differences, but it highlights their Scouting differences. A church youth group has no such indications.

 

I do agree that clothing says something about you, depending on the situation. When my dad was a youth, jeans were indeed the uniform of the commoner. Work clothes. Never appropriate for any formal situation - school, church, Scouts, anywhere. He still can't bring himself to wear jeans. My generation, on the other hand, wears jeans everywhere. When I was in high school, 99% of the kids were wearing jeans on any given day.

 

My workplace has lost much of its formality as well. It wasn't that long ago that engineers at Fortune 500 companies wore ties to work fairly regularly. Shorts were never worn. Now it's all jeans and shorts and flip-flops. And the work still all gets done.

 

There does remain some of that uniform, though. If you are in marketing, you dress better. I don't think it's a rule, but if I want to see well-dressed people, that's where I go. As you move up with promotions, dress gets subtly better. It's not overt, but it's definitely there.

 

Teachers generally dress better than the kids. The pastor dresses better than the congregation (on average). The TV newscaster dresses better than the cameraman.

 

Is it because they are "better"? No. But they've earned a certain position - call it your "betters" or call it "positions of authority" or whatever. It's not everyone. It's not all the time. But it's there, for sure.

[fuzzievohs]

I'm almost ready, for adults, to dump everything off the shirt, period. One hang tag ... Name, position & unit, council. That's it. No OA, no Jambo, no Silver Beavers as though they were the Congressional Medal of Honor, no WB beads and necker...

 

I think I am there too. I might leave the SM POR on it (it will be hard to take the Eagle knot off, but I am leaning toward that).

 

Recently, our council merged with another council. A new CSP was born...I took that opportunity to get the CO to buy the new CSP for each scout. I bought one for each adult I had seen in some sort of uniform...and enclosed a letter, summarized as: "Please sew this patch on and wear your full uniform to set an example for the scouts; don't just wear a part of it." I haven't seen a shirt-only scouter since; and most of the scouts are always in full uniform.