Cost of Uniforms

[Stosh]

Hmmm, let's look at it another way.

 

1) Hand saluting the flag while in uniform respects both the flag and the uniform.

 

2) Heart saluting the flag while not in uniform respects the flag and there is no uniform to honor.

 

3) Hand saluting the flag while not in uniform as a veteran respects the flag and honors the veteran for his service.

 

So, where's the respect due anyone or anything while in half-uniform?

 

Maybe in this day and age doing things half-way is good enough. It wasn't in my day, but that's the bane of those of us who were taught that in spite of everyone not stroking our self-esteem, there just are somethings that might be wrong.

 

Sorry to burst one's bubble, but a half-uniform doesn't cut it as a full-uniform. For those who find this difficult to experience, just send me your name and self-addressed stamped envelop (if you don't know what that is, I'll understand) and I'll send you a star for your, "That's the way life is... adjust!" chart. I might even have a few old charts of my own I could send you. I've collected up a ton over the years.

 

Stosh

[OldGreyEagle]

Just thinking a bit

 

Seems a few people think its ok to bend the Uniform Guide, others on other threads think its ok to bend rules and policies as long as it benefits the kids

 

Ever think there is a relationship to the overall "second class" status some perceive scouting to be when compared to band, sports, etc because the adults running the program don't respect the program as much as sports coaches or music teachers respect theirs and allow albeit minor, variations?

[BadenP]

Stosh

 

Don't sweat the small stuff, if Mazzuca gets his way the uniform of today will be replaced with a scout t-shirt and scout jeans, and it will probably cost more than the uniform does anyway. The CSE feels that the uniform is outdated and an obstacle keeping more kids from joining scouts anyway, so if he thinks it will bring in a lot more kids poof there goes the uniform.

[RememberSchiff]

Yeah, I have heard others also speculate that a scout t-shirt and jeans would be the next uniform.

 

So I asked what about all those badges, where would they go?

 

'Badges? They would probably get just cards (personalized Pokemon cards?). Parents want less work - no sewing or gluing.'

 

Took 2 aspirin with that thought,

[Eagle92]

Not speculation, but an experiment going on right now in Maryland right now.

 

http://www.baltimorebsa.org/openrosters/ViewOrgPageLink.asp?LinkKey=35982&orgkey=749

 

Apparently the UnderArmour T-shirts incorporate the rank in them, so each rank would be about $13.10 to $16.10 per rank. But the full trial is not out yet, other items are comign out in may.

 

If you do a search on alternate uniforms, there is a thread onthis topic from within the past year.

 

 

EDITED: Forgot to add, if memory serves from doing a comparison from a link that I cannot find now on what the proposed alternate uniform would be AND what retail prices for the items form a sporting goods store, I beleive Cabella's, the alternate uniform is actually more expensive.

 

 

(This message has been edited by eagle92)

[Eagle92]

here's the link.

 

http://www.scouter.com/forums/viewThread.asp?threadID=246471&p=1

[BartHumphries]

My mom and one of my sisters own a sewing machine, but most people these days don't own a sewing machine. Darning a sock is pretty much impossible with the way socks are made now and is consequently swiftly becoming a lost art. Hardly anyone sews their own lace for the same reason that men stopped wearing it centuries ago -- it's so easy to get machine-made lace for practically no money that it's no longer a status symbol.

 

A uniform can cost more than a month of groceries for a family.

[Stosh]

I was rather put out by Mr. Mazzuca's little story at Jambo this past summer. It would seem that he had to travel in his uniform for some reason and was surprised by how many people recognized it and commented and opened up a conversation about it, etc. etc.

 

Huh? Why did our chief scout not know this? Why didn't he wear the uniform all the time? If it's a such a great thing, why is it in the suitcase and not worn?

 

At Jambo I wore the 1910 uniform, but also the 1960's uniform at various times. I was surprised at the number of YOUTH that would like to see the '60's uniform come back!!!!!

 

A scout uniform is an icon of the program. Stop and think about it. When you see the Stars and Stripes you think of the United States. You think of a maple leaf...? yep, Canada. You see a uniform? Well it could be police, fire, military, etc. but if you put a neckerchief with it.... Yep, BSA, no question about it. Show me a kid in blue jeans and t-shirt and I'll show you the average kid out there and that's about it.

 

Stosh

[Eagle92]

What happened to the CSE is a normal occurance whenever I go to the store before or after a meeting. This is the result of being a suit for way to long and not being in the field.

 

On a related note, I think some of the uniforming problem may stem indirectly from Exploring and the Distintive Identity Dress. I'm willing to bet that some leaders thought, "well if one program can create their own uniform, why not us?"

[BadenP]

A tshirt with the rank on it, no more patches, what an absolutely stupid idea, we all know how long the average t shirt lasts in scouting, this is nothing more than another get rich scheme by National Supply. My question is what will the boy have left to show his kids about his days in scouting, a bunch of torn and mangled, dirty tshirts, kinda makes you wonder.

 

Stosh, when I was a DE and Mazzuca was my SE he almost never wore his field uniform to any council events, ECOH's, even council camporees as he felt it wasn't professional enough and it just didn't look good on him. I remember him coming to a Eagle court in my district and the young man asking him why he was not in uniform,since he was going to give the Eagle Pledge, he was wearing a suit, he looked at the boy and said, this is my uniform son. That is why I firmly believe that during his tenure as CSE we will see the uniform radically change or disappear alltogether.

[Eagle92]

BP,

We can only hope that teh experience of folks coming up to him while in uniform and talking about their expereinces in scouting will change his mind.

 

I know I had a conversation with a former GS leader who is upset that the GS uniform is virtually non existant to the point that she can only recognize Girl Scouts when they sell the cookies,a nd that's b/c of the cookies, not the vests.

[shortridge]

As a side note, one interesting thing my local Girl Scout council is doing is offering "starter kits" - you can order the appropriate vest, sash, beanie, flag patch, council strip, pins and books all in one bundle. Very convenient for new parents utterly confused by the array of stuff.

 

I don't know if this is new or not, but it caught my attention. Buying a Boy Scout uniform now is kind of the same thing. You need the shirt, pants, belt, hat, council patch, troop numerals, patrol emblem, world crest, shoulder loops, necker, slide ... it's all more than a bit bewildering to newbies. Why not have the Scout Shop staff put it all together for a small convenience fee and make it easy?

[Eagle92]

Supply Division actually did something like that at one time during the round up season. They offered a package deal on the shirt and pants, saving anywhere between about $15- $25, depending upon the combo and size ( short sleeve shirt and shorts was $15, Youth XL L/S shirt and Husky pants $25, you get the idea)

 

This was approx. 2000-2002. If memory serves, local councils and other distributors got upset because they wouldn't do this and they lost sales. I think a few distributors threatened to stop selling merchandise.

[lone77wulf]

shortridge said: Why not have the Scout Shop staff put it all together for a small convenience fee and make it easy?

 

I'm scratching my head on this one. When I worked for a Supply Group Scout Shop, it was a given we would help with this. We distributed sheets to the units to have them fill in the scout's unit/patrol and check of the optional items for troops like hats and neckerchief choices. We would bring in extra staff in the fall so we could walk around with the customer and get them everything they needed, while helping with size choices (buy big, etc). We also kept a few "often missed" items like slides, books and the like so we could add it in if they realized they forgot it at the register.

 

We also offered a "pull" service for $2 (went up to 3 a few years in) that was based on the NDC's handling fee. We'd pull and item to hold it for 24 hours for free if it was the last one, or we'd also take credit card info and do it as a phone order and keep it forever.

 

I guess there's a huge difference in what stores will do, especially between National stores and distributors, but to us, it was just part of the job. Made the customers happy, and as we told many of them "We'd love to see you stop back, but not because we forgot something you needed"

[Eagle92]

Lone,

WELCOME TO THE FORUMS!

 

Everyone,

Lone is correct in that the national stores do provide info on what is needed. We provide checklists, will work with small groups at a time, keep a list of what units meet where, etc. Service is something that is instilled in training, and we are expected to be knowledgeable and customer friendly. And if we don't know something, we at least knew where to look for the information.