Uniforms required for travel?

[Eagledad]

>>Anyone else notice the contradiction in this?

[Pint]

We have the same situation in the UK, its the person who is insured as a member of the Scout group, and not the uniform, all our 'rules' say is that a person should wear suitable clothing for the activity that's taking place.

However When in uniform the scouts easy to spot, especially when taking a group of Scouts through a busy railway stations, Airport, or any where else with large amounts of people around.

Also when arriving on camps etc it makes it easy to spot them, and for any one else on camp to know who they are and where they should be when arriving/departing.

 

[Frank17]

This is also a good way to catch a lawsuit.

 

If you get into an accident while traveling, a lot of people (and insurance companies) tend not to sue if they think the person only has insurance coverage and no other real assets. But if they find out you are traveling / representing the BSA, there are suddenly some deeper pockets (your Troop assets, your chartered organization assets) that they can seek out. Not nice, but I have seen it happen, at least on the business travel side.

[Stosh]

Hmmm, so it's the scout's fault that dishonest people will nail BSA insurance/assets because the boy's wearing a uniform while traveling? Sorry, but I'm not going to blame the scouts because of others' dishonesty.

 

Stosh

[Frank17]

I don't blame the scouts either (or leaders or BSA). I blame out litigious happy society and their responses.

[Greaves]

I'm a WDL, and we had a campout at a county park. I arrived first in uniform, and was the third or fourth person in line to checkin.

 

The folks working the desk opened a second register for *me.* It's nice when the community recognizes we're a community organization.

[Stosh]

I have stated this story previously on the forum, but every meeting night I go out for dinner because I'm always running late.

 

Twice in the past couple of years someone has picked up my dinner tab. The first time I thought it was because my uniform looked military. I went over to explain to them that I wasn't military and the elderly man at the table said, yes, he knew that, he said you're a scoutmaster and that's just as important. The other couple that picked up the tab and also the tab of the person with me was a young couple with two small children, one in a high chair. I assumed the same thing as before and when I talked to them, they assured me they knew I was a scoutmaster and thanked me for all I did for the boys of the community.

 

I always thought it was the older people in our society that appreciated what the scouts did, but I was corrected that evening.

 

Stosh

[ScoutBox]

I had my boys show up for the trip to Summer Camp in full uniform this year, mainly to make sure that all fo them brought it. I have a few who don't like wearing the uniform, and they will do anything to take the chance not to wear it..

[gcnphkr]

We generally travel in class b. But after arriving at camp and getting ready for inspection and finding that one scout did not have his shirt, we will likely change that. Fortunately the local scout shop had a returned ODL that happened to be the right size.

[VigilEagle04]

While I haven't traveled in a unit in a while, when I was a youth we always traveled in uniform. We weren't a full uniform troop (though I was often in full uniform, as I had it for OA activities) but most wore OD green BDU pants with the "class A" shirt.

 

For longer trips, like when we would go to Canada, we wore the old red polo, or activity shirt, while traveling. It is a bit more comfortable to wear for the amount of hours we would be in a vehicle, and still displayed who we were due to the universal emblem.

[Oak Tree]

I completely agree that the uniform is not required for insurance. I also don't believe that a tour permit is required for insurance.

 

My question would be this. For BSA insurance to cover you, it would have to be a Scouting event. How do you show that something was a Scouting event? Well, in a large well-organized troop you have various points of evidence - annual calendar, emails to troop list, using troop equipment, various planning meetings, and probably a tour permit and traveling in uniform. Also, the fact that the boys don't have any other organization in common so what else could it be?

 

However, what if you are in a troop of 8 boys, no troop equipment, and a very ad hoc planning process? The Scoutmaster, two of his sons, and two other kids (who are friends from Scouts, school, church, and basketball) decide at one troop meeting to go off camping that weekend. Is it a Scouting event? What makes it a Scouting event?

[mpaull]

This very question brought about one of those circular "yes-it-is / no-it-isn't / yes-it-is" kind of conversations. Neither of the participants could cite BSA literature to support their side of the discussion. Is there anything in BSA literature that gives a definitive answer either way? Was there ever a grain of truth at the beginning of this myth?

 

Mike

[Oak Tree]

There are places in BSA literature where it talks about why you should file a tour permit. It lists a number of good reasons, but it does not list insurance.

 

The real place to look would be on the actual insurance policy. The closest I can find on scouting.org is "This coverage provides primary general liability coverage for registered volunteer Scouters with respect to claims arising out of an official Scouting activity" - no mention of "if guidelines are followed" or "if tour permits are filed" or "if uniforms are worn".

 

It points out that something is not an official Scouting activity if it is on the list of unauthorized activities in the G2SS. Other than that, it appears to cover everything except for criminal and intentional acts.

 

It does not, however, indicate how to determine when something is an "official Scouting activity".

[Beavah]

Whether something is a scout outing is a question of fact, eh?

 

It gets decided by presenting evidence to a jury. Not by an insurance contract. Not by a BSA document. By humans who weigh all da relevant evidence and testimony and make a decision.

 

Beavah

 

[mpaull]

So, a good place to start would be Oak Tree's list - "... various points of evidence - annual calendar, emails to troop list, using troop equipment, various planning meetings, and probably a tour permit and traveling in uniform ... the boys don't have any other organization"

 

Have all that in place, don't contravene G2SS, and you should be good?