Ditch Red wool jac_adopt Red Fleece Jacket

[belayer_StLouis]

Red wool jackets have been discussed many times and great length on this forum, usually the discussions are where to find them cheaper. I think Nat. Supply should ditch the wool jacket and adopt a red FLEECE jacket. I'm in a council that is heavy into the full uniform but you see very few red wool jackets. Back in my camp staff days, the 60's, many of us had the red wool jackets but I don't see that anymore. I think a fleece jacket would be very acceptable to scouts, cheaper by far and much easier to care for. Fleece vests/jackets are popular at Nat. Camp School and the OA has several versions. The lined nylon jacket just isn't the same or have enough warmth. Yes, my jacket still fits so I'm not interested in discussing where's the best place to get a jacket or how to plot to raise the capital to buy one. Does the forum think we should adopt the fleece jacket and ditch the wool version?

[John-in-KC]

NO!!

[shortridge]

What's wrong with offering both?

 

I'm actually kind of surprised National hasn't offered a fleece version yet.

[Eagle92]

NO, bring back the GREEN Fleece jackets that were available in the 1997-1999 range. looked good AND reely looked awesome with the Exploring/Venturing Uniforms. I was just about to get one when they were discontinued and I was not happy.

 

Not to change the subject, but I am anyway, If national no longer wanted RED in the BSA uniform, then why is BOY SCOUTS OF AMERICA on the CU shirts in red, and they decided to keep the red jackets (remember there was a brief period in 2008/2009 where the red jackets were unavailable for purchase from national and the word was they were going to be recalled from the shops like the ODL uniform items)?

[belayer_StLouis]

Green fleece jackets would be cool, missed the Venturing fleece jacket, never saw it. My main idea is to make an official jacket affordable to the customer - kid's parents. At $100, plus any dry cleaning cost, the red wool jacket is pretty pricy and no wonder we don't see them on kids.

[Eagle92]

Belayer,

As a youth the red jacket's were considered cool b/c usually the only folks who wore them were those who went to Philmont. They were not a must have item, and usually the jacket folks wore were surplus field jackets.

 

The most common scout jackets were either the red windbreaker, or a custom job. The troop I was with for my Canadian expedition had a custom job in purple, with the WC on the front (if I remember correctly) and the trip patch's design on the back. really spiff.

 

I'm the only person I know of with the blue International windbreaker, do they even make those anymore?

[belayer_StLouis]

Eagle92, I guess some generational differences are showing, my camp staff days were in the 60's. Sure can't remember the price then or how what I had for lunch yesterday. In our area red jackets were worn by lots of folks, the Phimont bull and the lodge back patch were and still are prominent but going to Philmont wasn't the reason to wear them. Many Scouters and lots of older kids wore them. Never have seen the purple intl. version. The red windbreaker never seemed to be a big deal here, its either a hot/muggy 90 something or cold so the wool jacket was a great uniform coat. What do you think about a red or green fleece jacket?

[dg98adams]

I have a green/black one the same as this one.

 

(This message has been edited by dg98adams)

[John-in-KC]

E92,

 

I have friends who have commercial green woolens which they've applied the patch to.

 

My next jacket will be from the folks who supply Northern Tier.

 

I've no objection to offering both, but discard wool, the most practical warming material God created, for coke bottles? NWIH.

 

Wool is renewable. Plastic uses petroleum.

 

 

[Eagle92]

Belayer,

Don't think it was a generational thing, more than likely a geographical thing as it does not get that cold in SE Louisiana. An the reason why I think folks who went to Philmont tended to have them was for the Bull.

 

Looks like I have a collector's item as i can no longer find any reference to the international jacket on Scoutstuff.org, Scouting.org, or nay other website including Black Eagle's. And that purple jacket I talked about was a custom job that the troop did, the official BSA jacket was blue with the BSA international logo directly embroidered on the front. and INTERNATIONAL underneath it.

 

As for the green jacket national put out a few years back, it was a pullover with 1/4 zip. and no FDL, had to buy it separate if memory serves. Same color as the Exploring/Venturing shirt.(This message has been edited by eagle92)

[Twocubdad]

I go with offering both.

 

My guess is supply division did the math and figured out there are enough traditionalists out there to make the red wool jackets profitable enough to keep in the product line. Eradicating bright colors may have seem like a good idea, but hey, there's money in them thar' red woolies!

 

Here's my idea for new jackets: go to Columbia or North Face and have them produce a whole system of uniform outerwear, i.e. parks and pants or bibs with zip-out fleece liners and tech shells. (I'm thinking like the Columbia Bugaboo parka and liner I just got my son for Christmas, if you want to look for an example on line). Make the shell some combination of khaki and green, but don't go overboard with the BSA insignia. I'll concede that if a kid has one good winter coat that fits, he may not want it to be an overtly Scout uniform part. If the insignia stays subtle, it could be a kid's one and only winter coat.

 

The fleece liners could be bright red and would substitute for the wool jac-shirts. I'd like to see something like that become the standard BSA winter uniform. Sell them with the shells or separately. A kid could even sew all the patches on the liner, and they would be hidden when it's zipped into the shell.

 

I realize a good Columbia or North Face system like this, jackets and pants, can start around $250, and there may be a limited market for the full monte. Not every family is going to be able to drop that kind of money on a rain suit for a fast-growing boy. But there are plenty who do. But by going to a little extra trouble to make it suitable for non-scouting wear, I think they could sell a decent number. Selling the shells and liners separately would allow folks to buy only what the want/need.

 

My goal is to come up with an affordable winter uniform jacket. I hate seeing our guys show up in the winter with full uniforms hidden under a mish-mash of outerwear.

[SMT224]

I like the idea of both.

 

I love my red wool jacket! It sheds rain and snow and keeps me warm in all kinds of conditions. But I'm the only one in our Troop that has one. My wife gave it to me for my b-day the year I became Scoutmaster, about 10 years ago, and it's held up great.

 

But I do like fleece, and highly recommend to Scouts for winter camping. It's cheap and keeps you warm in all kinds of conditions. It would be great to have an official fleece that was both warm and affordable.

 

Right now, the "Fleece Boy Scout Vest" is available at BSA supply for $15, or you go to some place like "4imprint.com" and get an embroidered fleece jacket for about $25 (need to buy at least 12 of 'em, which is still cheaper than the $100 for the red wool BSA jacket).

 

[Basementdweller]

Those scout vests, what weight is the Fleece?? there is a huge difference. I have been burned by cheap fleece.

 

Far as the red fleece jacket, Buy one put your patches on it and enjoy it. Who cares what the uniform police say.

[FScouter]

What is a "uniform police" and why would anyone care one hoot what someone does with a non-uniform piece of clothing?

[ScoutBox]

I have a wool jack shirt, but I got my son a Red Fleece jacket, and I then put a BSA Jacket Patch on the left chest of it.. works and looks great.. He's the only boy in the troop completely uniformed.. anyway, I would prefer a range of colors for winter wear.. I like the Cabelas Jack shirts, they are fleece lined, and warm.. also not expensive. I would like to find myself a Forest Green one and put a BSA patch on the pocket and wear it in fact. I don't have any boys really interested in uniforming out in BSA wear. But if a practical winter uniform was developed then I'd be interested in getting it for my son, and myself.. I often wear civi clothes on Camp outs. I worked in an Outdoor Supply Store for 10 years here. M personal kit is ten times better then all of the troops kit. I'm the new Adult QM for the troop now. Anyway, I wear a New Zealand forest Green shirt on camp outs with Falljerken trousers.. these are European brands.. and they are expensive, but they are made for the outdoors. In fact I also wear Norrona Forest Green Gortex Hunting trousers on all winter outings. They have a layer of material on them that doesn't make any noise.. Well.. I would like to see a color change to the Jack Shirt.. They got rid of the Red on the Uniforms, so why not.. On the last TAC Klondyke.. many of the adults were wearing Jeans in the show.. or military kit.. I think that it's about time the BSA got with it, and updated it's winter kit..

 

Mike