New insignia guide updates

[click23]

I cannot seem to find my old guide, so this I am sure that there are more changes. But here is what I have found that is new so far.

 

The centennial uniform.

Camp Staff, new council level POR patch.

Chairman is now Chair on troop, team, crew, pack, and district committee patches.

Female venturers may wear the Girl Scout Gold Award medal on their uniform(not sure if this was in the old guide or not)

Only boy scout troops and varsity teams wear the tan and green unit numbers.(I know that there is other material that contradicts this, including the color pictures in the insignia guide.)

Arrowhead honor is worn between the commissioners POR patch and the council strip on the centennial uniform.

 

If anyone finds any new information in the new guide please post it here.

[Eagle92]

See the other thread on the insignia guide, i just got some info.

[emb021]

"Chairman is now Chair on troop, team, crew, pack, and district committee patches."

 

Not sure the reason for this. The terms "chair" and "chairman" are interchangable. Despite what some people thing, the term "chairman" is gender neutral! You never say "chairwoman".

 

"Female venturers may wear the Girl Scout Gold Award medal on their uniform(not sure if this was in the old guide or not)"

 

this is new.

 

"Only boy scout troops and varsity teams wear the tan and green unit numbers.(I know that there is other material that contradicts this, including the color pictures in the insignia guide.)"

 

there is a lot of confusion and arguments about this. It seems logical (and as you note, other items indicate this) that cub scout leaders and webelos wearing the tan uniform would wear the tan & green numbers.

 

"Arrowhead honor is worn between the commissioners POR patch and the council strip on the centennial uniform."

 

this was given in the Commissioner newsletter, so many knew of this change.

 

[click23]

emb' I should have stated that I was listing changes from the old guide to the new one. I wasn't sure on the Gold Award, I double checked it and it says badge, not medal.

 

It also states "Th Boy Scout Scout Trained emblem is green. The Cub Scout and Venturing Trained emblems are red. " Again other sources say/show otherwise.

 

The the knots for the Doctorate of Commissioner Science, Eagle NESA Life Member, Philmont Training Center Master Track Award, and Speakers Bank Award have been added. Also, a Heritage Society pin is listed.

 

National Venturing president and Regional venturing president.

 

Area and Regional commissioners.

 

Kodiak and Kodiak X awards.

 

Missing are the OA POR patches, OA Team Rep, National chief, chapter adviser, ect. The only one shown is the OA Troop Rep.

[Eagle92]

As I said in the other post about the new, new trained strip, the one that looks like the old one but is smaller, not a lot of info has come down from national on it yet. BUT it is believed, and I am stressing believed that the CS reference is for FEMALES in the YELLOW BLOUSE, not leaders in the centennial uniforms. Again this is from a converstaion I had with someone working for national supply.

[emb021]

"National Venturing president and Regional venturing president."

 

We've had the patches almost from day one, but it was only in the previous edition they added them to the insignia guide.

 

"Area and Regional commissioners."

 

These are new positions, hence new patches.

 

"Kodiak and Kodiak X awards."

 

We've had the medals for a few years, but I think they only added them to the insignia guide in the last edition. Overall, the insignia guide has been behind in listing venturing items by se

 

"Missing are the OA POR patches, OA Team Rep, National chief, chapter adviser, ect. The only one shown is the OA Troop Rep."

 

The OA PORs are OA Troop & Team Reps, Section, Lodge, and Chapter advisers, and Lodge & Chapter Associate Adviser (don't recall if there is a section associate adviser). There is no National Chief patch. These have been listed for many years in the insignia guide.

 

 

[BDPT00]

Snooping in the Guide, I can't find reference to the Girl Scout Gold Award. What page is that on?

BDPT00

[click23]

I don't have it in front of me right now, but it is in the front where it mentions awards from other scouting associations.

[emb021]

"Snooping in the Guide, I can't find reference to the Girl Scout Gold Award. What page is that on?"

 

Page 3, in the "Badges of Other Organizations" section. It's at the end. While that section has been in the guide forever (?), the last paragraph speaking about the religious emblems and wearing a knot and about wearing the GS Gold is new. Not sure if it was in the last edition.

 

[emb021]

Got my copy of the new edition. I actually collect Insignia Guides, and while I don't have my previous edition with me, I do see a lot of changes. BUT, I also see a lot of mistakes. Overall, a poor editing job.

 

Others have commented about the confusion about Cub Scout Leader uniforms. Frankly, if you went by the guide (ignoring the color insert), you would be under the impression that Cub Scout Leader & Webelos don't wear the new Centennial Uniform. Sloppy editing, IMO.

 

So, new/different things I've noticed, along with mistakes.

 

Pg 3- Badges of Other Orgs. This section now says that if you earned a religious award while in another program (ie GSUSA, Camp Fire, Sunday School) you may wear the medal and even knot. Something I've always figured was the way to go. Also, female venturers can wear their GS Gold Award on the left pocket.

 

Pg 15- finally they list the Good Turn for America Award and state its worn on the right pocket. However, they don't list this award anywhere else. Sooo, are we to assume only Tiger Cubs, Cub Scouts, and Webelos can earn it??? Same for the BSA Physical Fitness Award on this page.

 

Pg 16- Whittling Chip is listed as a patch. Interesting. But no info on where its to be worn or by who. Big mistake.

 

Pg 18- Varsity strip. Since this is only worn by Varsity Scout, how about removing it from the Boy Scout section? Also, it says its orange on tan, while in the Varsity section is says its red on tan. Which is correct? (have only every seen red on tan).

 

Pg 27- The NYLT and NAYLE patches are shown, but no numbers, and more importantly, no info as to who wears them and where.

 

Varsity Letter. As this item, AFAIK, is only earned and worn by Varsity Scouts, how about removing this from the Boy Scout section?

 

Also, now we have a Firem'n Chit patch, but no Totin' Chip patch. And no info on where its worn.

 

Pg 28- Varsity Scout Activity pins. Again, as these AFAIK are only earned by Varsity Scouts, how about moving this out of the Boy Scout section and putting in with the Varsity Scout stuff.

 

Pg 32- Properly, its "OA Team Representative". How about showing the patch?

 

Pg 33- ok, this may be stupid on my part, but is there any reason why the sleeve drawings here DON'T show the American Flag, a CSP, and a unit number like all the others do??

 

Pg 34- the Ranger bar is not training. Move it to advancement with the Ranger Award.

 

Pg 35- ok, they included the Kodiak, Kodiak Staff, and Kodiak X patches (with no info on location). But left out the Kodiak X staff patches. For the Kodiak bear claw, they show the kodiak logo. Mistake. Also, its it ok to wear the Kodiak medals from the left pocket??

 

Pg 36- the list of other items that Venturers can received is missing a few- BSA Physical Fitness, BSA Emergency Prepardness, Good Turn for America.

 

Typo here with the Trained strip. Says "Elected Venturers who have completed the crew officers' seminar may wear the Trained Leader emblem abover their badge of office on the left pocket flap". Uh, we don't wear office patches on the left pocket. And our left sleeves don't have a pocket. And I've never understood if Venturers can wear both the Trained strip and the VLSC strip together.

 

Pg 42

 

First off, we have the Emergency Preparedness Award which, according to this can be earned by Tiger Cubs, Cub Scouts, Webelos Scouts, and Boy Scouts. Uh, what about Varsity Scouts, Venturers, and adult leaders???

 

I also noticed some problems with the sleeve diagrams.

 

1) For illustration purposes, they show the office patch on the old uniform higher then usual. They indicate the top of the patch should be 4 inches below the seam, as always, but the drawing shows it very close to the CSP. Am sure a lot of people are going to ignore it and wear it too close (same problem with the World Crest where people go by the illustration and not the written discription).

 

Also, because of the left sleeve pocket, the location positions have changed. Please note this:

 

Old sleeve

*Position 1- CSP

*Position 2- unit numbers

*Position 3- office patch (4 inches below seam)

*Position 4- trained strip

 

Centennial sleeve

*Position 1- CSP

*Position 2- unit numbers (or commissioner arrowhead)

*Position 3- left sleeve pocket flap- trained strip

*Position 4- left sleeve pocket- office patch

 

Soooo, depending on the uniform, the office patches will be in position 3 or position 4. However, for the the rest of this section, all office patches are listed as position 3.

 

Next, I noticed the colors given for the shoulder loops. Boy scout loops are given as "Boy Scout green (forest)" and Venturing are given as "Venturing green" (early on they were called spruce green). Personally, I felt that forest and spruce green were one and the same, and referred to the new BS green as 'olive green'. Oh, well.

 

Lastly, the position of the commissioner arrowhead has changed. Most know that on the new uniform, its worn above the left pocket, where the unit numbers usually go. Welll, on the old uniform, you now wear the arrowhead ABOVE the trained strip (but below the office patch). Lovely.

 

Pg 43. Left out the position of Area Venturing Committee.

 

Pg 44. Left out the positions of Council Venturing Chair and Council Venturing Committee.

 

Pg 50. Jamborees. I don't think I've ever seen them show two National Jamboree emblems. They usually only shown the most recent (usually past) World and National Jamborees.

 

Pg 51. Knots. They put back the Exploring Achievement knot. They speak of "First Silver" and "Second Silver". Properly, they should speak of the Explorer Silver Award. The medals were in 2 versions, but that doesn't matter.

 

As noted, new knots are listed here and on the back, including the NESA Eagle knot, Philmont knots, speakers bureau knot, and Doctorate of Commissioner Science.

 

Pg 53. There are patches for Associate Lodge and Chapter advisers. These should be listed.

 

I see they note the OA sash is never worn on the belt or with the merit badge sash. Always been so, but don't recall seeing it said in the Insignia Guide.

[FScouter]

Re sashes:

The merit badge sash is never worn on the belt.

Temporary patches may be worn on the back of the MB sash.

The OA sash is not worn with the MB sash.

2007 edition, page 4 "Excess Insignia", and page 53.

2002-2004 edition page 4, and page 46.

[emb021]

"The merit badge sash is never worn on the belt."

 

Always been the policy, but not sure when they started to state this. Of course, you still see scouts doing this (just check the pictures in BL & S).

 

"Temporary patches may be worn on the back of the MB sash."

 

This was a change in policy a few years back. Not sure off the top of my head when this was added. Used to be you couldn't do this, then they changed it. However, some kids don't get it that awards (50 miler, scuba, mile swim, etc along with rank) aren't temporary patches...

 

"The OA sash is not worn with the MB sash."

 

Always policy, but not sure when they added it in.

 

I also saw a note in the Venturing area that Venturers can wear the merit badge sash. Don't recall that in the last version.

 

 

I also forgot some other position patches they left out: Area, Council, and District Venturing President patches. We've had these for 2-3 years, and they still don't list them (but then, they only included the National & Regional Venturing Presidents in the last edition).

 

 

[emb021]

In re-reading the Insignia Guide, I've noticed several little points where they point out bad uniforming. Kind of a step in the right direction, but sometimes they are hidden in the wrong place.

 

Pg 4. Excess Insignia. In addition to the point about temporary patches (but not rank, and they really need to also point out not other awards) being worn on the back of the merit badge sash, we are told the merit badge sash is *never* (emphasis in the guide) worn on the belt. Nice, but really need this note with the info on merit badge sashes in the BS section.

 

Temporary Insignia- Good explanation of temporary insignia. But buried in it is the note that totin chip patches are also temporary insignia. Uh, again nice, but since they give Whittlin Chip and Firem'n chip patches later on (but no totin chip patches), they need to give that info there. It will be overlooked here.

 

Pg 11- Cub Scout Advancement. There is a little note that Cub Scout advancement must be attached directly to the uniform. I guess this is a prohibition on using plastic patch holders and the like. However, the CS Immediate recognition emblem and Webelos compass point emblem hang from the button. Isn't that a violation of that note?

 

Pg 20- World Crest. I love the added info here. "Nothing to earn. Wear on all uniforms. Just purchase and wear."

 

Pg 25- Eagle Palms. More info on wearing Palms for those who don't understand that you don't wear every single one you get.

 

Pg 31. A note that the WB patrol medallion is only worn during the WB course. Something that a lot of adults need to understand.

 

Pg 42- Shoulder loops, specifies that chartered org reps wear silver. A lot don't understand this that COR are council-level people.

 

Pg 45- Unit Commissioner. States that you don't wear unit numbers. Assigned to more then one unit.

 

Pg 52- knots. Good note about the devices worn on the youth religious knot that many don't understand.

 

Pg 53- OA. Notes on the sash about it not being worn on the belt, not worn with merit badge sashes, and NO sashbacks to be worn.

 

Pg 54- Regional insignia. Note here for awhile on who gets to wear regional patches. But many don't bother to read it.

 

Pg 55- Flags. A note here about saluting. I don't recall seeing this in past editions. States that the hand-to-forehead salute is appropriate when wearing any BSA uniform, including the blue blazer dress uniform.