Once an Official Uniform... Always?

[Liz]

Hi, folks!

 

I am just curious about how other councils do this. In my council (I am told), the staff at the summer camps are required to have not only a complete summer uniform but also the *most recent* summer uniform.

 

Since my older son is talking about volunteering at a summer camp this year, this has become of particular interest to me.

 

Even though I'm somewhat dismayed by the thought of having to fork out the $$ for a Centennial uniform because of some of the quality concerns addressed in a previous thread, I in no way question the right of my council camps to make this a requirement. I'll do it, and I won't make a fuss about it. I am just curious to know how other council camps do things in this regard. Are there other situations in which it is required for scouts to have the LATEST uniform in order to participate?

 

On the plus side, for reasons I can't quite explain, I really like sewing patches on uniforms (I do it not only for my boys -- I know, they should learn themselves but I can't help myself -- but I do it for my friends' boys, too). It will be fun to put them on the new uni. ;-)

 

-Liz

[Eagle92]

Since I've only had to deal with the ODL uniform, I don't have much experience with having the most up to date uniform. My camps provided 2 staff tshirts,1 staff hat, at least 1 staff patch (when one camp lost a long time staffer, 17 years, they issued a memorial patch in his honor as well). If we wanted additional stuff, we paid out of pocket. One camp did make available a staff polo, which almost all bought.

 

Now since most summer camp staff are also venturing crews, basically for those either in college or unaffiliated with a year round unit like cook crew and nurses but every staffer is a member none the less, You could go for the most current venturing uniform. Also the camps I worked at discounted the uniform pieces for staff since they were employees.

[Liz]

Yes, our camps also offer a 20% discount in the Council shop for required items like new uniform pieces.

 

I don't think choosing a Venturing uniform is an option. I know when there were females on staff at the cub scout camps (who were parts of venturing or sea scout or other co-ed Boy Scout programs), they all wore the regular Khakitan Boy Scout uniforms.

 

-Liz

[Bob White]

A basic concept of a "uniform" is that every in a specific group dresses alike. The reason the BSa keeps all uniform pieces official is to allow them to maintain control over the use of the image s of scouting.

 

It's logical in the case of a Boy Scout activity staff that using the "current" uniform as the dress standard makes more sense than choosing a historic uniform.

 

Granted the timing of the recent transition would make the selection of the last uniform a possible choice, it's alwasy better to move forward then backward.

 

I would imagine most camps staffs as well as training staffs such as Wood Badge will be requireing the current "centennial" uniform.

 

 

[Be_Prepared]

The Scout Camp that I am associated with only requires an official uniform - so we get a mix: current traditional Boy Scout, Venture, Sea Scouts, Foreign Scouts. We've even had some Explorers. A few staffers have older shorts, with red topped knee socks, some even have old knee socks/garters. The 17 and under females wear Venture uniforms. The 18 and older females can wear Venture, or Boy Scout. We just ask that there is no mixing/matching of uniforms - such as dark green Venture shirt with dark green Boy Scout pants - things like that.

[RememberSchiff]

Our council camps have no such requirements.

 

We have been through uniform transitions before, I can't remember a camp or scout activity requiring the "latest" uniform. Some of us wore uniform shirts with collars, some had V-necks, and we all looked scout.

 

So this seems a change in thinking or values, more marketing-sense driven than classic scout-sense driven. A scout is (or was) thrifty.

 

 

[Buffalo Skipper]

As a scout in 1981 I attended the National Jamboree, the year it made a brief stop at Ft. AP Hill. Our contingent troop was "required" to purchase at least one complete ODL uniform, which had just been made available. It was always my assumption that this was a national requirement, not a council policy. These uniforms were used for specific activities on certain days. Owning several older green shirts, we resisited the idea of the ODL shirts with a vengence, but we never mixed shirts and pants. (You think todays crowd is in an uproar over the new uniforms? This is NOTHING compared to the cries of outrage over the ODL unifrom--and we didn't have the interenet over which we could broadcast our objections!)

 

I had one standard green uniform, and several older green uniforms (60s/early 70s?). I liked the older shirts much better. They had pleated pockets and a stitched button front (I don't know the term for that). It wore better and looked sharper (100% cotton, of course). I still own all 4 of these uniform shirts (2 old green, one later green, and the original ODL). I would likely wear these uniforms still, if I was 60 lbs lighter. Interstingly, the original ODL shirt had that stitched button front like the 60s/e70s style green shirt, which wears better than the loose one on today's shirts.

 

But back to Liz's original inquiry/comment. The requirement to puchase a new uniform for a council level "contingent" unit is not unpressendented. I believe it is intended to give a measure of "validity" to the new uniform and encourage others to want to wear it. On the other hand, I was on camp staff that year prior to the jamboree and we had no requirement to have the new shirt.

 

Our troop will "change" to the new epaulettes and numbers after the new year. This way when the Webelos crossover (and have to buy the OD epaulettes) we will all look uniform; the difference in the sleeve pocket or material will hardly be noticable. I have 5 of the pre-centennial shirts. It will be some time before I feel the need to replace any of them, but it might be nice to have one of these for summer camp.

[Eagle92]

Liz,

The reason why the venturing uniform is worn by alot of the staffers, and OK for new staffers to wear if registed with a troop, is that the summer camp staff are a registered venturing crew, so mopst staffer are dual registered. In fact the council issues each staffer with 1 special council strip and crew number combination patch to be worn in the venturing uniform if the venturer wants to. That patch has the standard CSP insignia design on it, with teh words "Camp Bonner Staff" and the number 1117 directly underneath it. I believe that it's one issued per camp season.

 

Another incentive for the venturign uniform at the current camp is that they are allowed to wear the silver loops since they are council employees. I personally prefer thsi to the old "tradition" of the staff creating their own loop colors. Doesn't set a good uniform example. If you ask me.

 

Also every staff member is issued a special POR patch for wear at camp, usually on the venturing uniform.

 

Ok my $.02.

 

Now another camp uniform question: how many use dominoes to recognize staff? I know my old camp did, and at PDL-1 I met two other folks whose camps did. Any others?

[shortridge]

I worked on a BSA camp staff for five years, and we were required to wear the then-current uniform. We got discounts.

 

There were a few older Scouters who were volunteers (didn't do the whole summer, but a week or so at a time), and some of them wore the old green uniform. No one complained. I doubt anyone will complain if your son is volunteering, either.

[jmwalston]

When I worked at Camp Bonner, we were issued with two staff t-shirts, which were identical to the regular camp t-shirt sold in the camp store except that they had red edging on the neck collar and sleeves, and the regular camp t-shirt had a green edging. There were practically no other staff except for an occassional Explorer.

[local1400]

Liz, why should you fork over the cash when your Scout should earn the money himself, purchase the uniform himself, and do his own sewing? The first two could go hand-in-hand with the earning of the Eagle required Personal Management merit badge. We don't teach our children when we do for them all the time.

[Liz]

Well, I haven't promised to buy the new uniform for him, but I intend to because it was my idea for him to volunteer instead of getting a summer job that pays -- what he really wanted to do. He already has to pay for his own gear, summer camp, activities, Scout dues, uniforms (usually), not to mention the upkeep and maintenance of his trumpet, band uniform, track & field fees and equipment, etc. etc. etc.. He really wanted a regular job this summer, but I pointed out to him that he could gain a lot of great experience at summer camp, and he can put off getting a paying job until NEXT summer -- and if he likes the camp experience, he can get a paying job doing that. So, I thought I would get him the gear he needs for camp (if he gets chosen) as a gift; kind of a way to show him that I am supportive of him rather than place an undue burden on him (you can't earn money this summer, now fork over $150 for the privilege of volunteering).

 

As for sewing on the patches, I'm afraid that's just a hobby of mine. I like doing it. It's like an addiction. I keep inspecting the kids' uniforms in the hopes that they've outgrown them or worn them out so I can do it again. I will teach the boys to do it (I know, I should have done that already -- my younger son has actually asked me to teach him to sew) but once they learn how I'll probably still keep doing it myself.

 

Now you all know a little about my own neurotic compulsions.

(Liz hangs her head in shame)

 

-Liz

[shortridge]

To clarify... I've never heard of a camp that required its staff in "Class A" during the day. They should issue some sort of a staff shirt - polo or T - and shorts (generally khaki-ish) for daily use.

 

We used to only use full uniform twice a week - on check-in and check-out days, when we had full retreat ceremonies. Now, they're get a lot more wear - at daily retreat and often afterwards in the evening.

[Hal_Crawford]

At Goshen Scout Reservation's Camp Bowman staff wears class A's for flags every night (so do the scouts and scouters). There is generally a variety of Boy Scout and Venture uniforms. Staff wears scout shorts/switchbacks and camp tee-shirts (different color each day) for programs. I believe the other camps at Goshen follow the same practice.

[gwd-scouter]

A quick point - silver shoulder loops are for District positions, gold loops are worn by Council staff.

 

The staff at our Council camp all wear the Venturing Uniform. In the past, they've worn the green shirt with the green Boy Scout shorts, but a couple of years ago they changed that to requiring the staff to wear the gray Venturing shorts. The staff are considered part of Venturing Crew 1.