Shoulder Loops COR?

[GMitch]

I am a registered Chartered Organization Representative with a Pack, Troop, Team, and Crew. I am also a participating member of the District Committee. As an active District volunteer, I wear the silver shoulder loops.

 

However, what color would you suggest a COR wear if he or she was not participating in the District or Council? Keep in mind all CORs are voting members of the District and Council by the very nature of their role. If a COR only has a Pack and Troop, what color should they wear Blue or the new Green? I say they should still wear silver shoulder loops since their position is both a District and Council role, and not specific to any one program.

 

What are your opinions? Better yet, who can point to something official?(This message has been edited by GMitch)

[AlFansome]

I'm a COR for 5 units (2 packs, 2 troops, and a crew), but even if it were just one, I'd still wear silver. Just my preference, though, just becase silver is always an appropriate color regardless of the type or quantity of units you represent. In my perfect, rose-colored-glasses world, all CORs would be uniformed the same...silver loops, no unit numeral, COR patch.

 

Of course, if you're only a COR for a troop, then I see no problem using the new green loops, unit numbers, and the COR patch, too. Or blue loops if for a pack.

 

I've looked and there's nothing "official" that I can find in the Insignia Guide, as I recall....that may have changed.

 

Added edit:

Actually, we have this from the online insignia guide: "Chartered organization representative, No. 00490, council Scouter, left sleeve, position 3." at http://www.scouting.org/media/insigniaguide/10B.aspx. So, if COR is a "council Scouter", it looks like the IG says to go with silver.

(This message has been edited by AlFansome)

[Beavah]

Yah, Silver Loops for CORs. They are council scouters, even if da CO only charters one unit.

 

A COR who is dual-registered as a CC or MC, however, may properly wear the uniform of that role (and the respective unit-level loops) when servin' in that role.

 

Beavah

 

[Bob White]

Because a charter organization only has one CR even if their CO uses multiple scouting programs wearing the silver tabs is perfectly legitimate.

[GMitch]

Thanks guys. Your answers are right in line with what I was thinking, with one exception. AlFansome said the COR should wear no unit numerals. Well, all 4 of my units have the same number, so I feel it is totally appropriate to wear the unit numerals with my COR patch. In your case Al with 5 units and presumably different CO's, I can see that no numerals would work best for you.

 

I even got the aftermarket COR patch for my Venturing uniform since National does not make one, which is silly.

 

http://www.sageventure.com/store/patches.html

[emb021]

COR don't wear unit numbers, but if their units are all the same number, I won't make an issue of it.

 

I would be more annoyed by a COR that wore red/green/blue loops, or some candy*ss combo of that.

 

 

[jmwalston]

"AlFansome said the COR should wear no unit numerals. Well, all 4 of my units have the same number, so I feel it is totally appropriate to wear the unit numerals with my COR patch. In your case Al with 5 units and presumably different CO's, I can see that no numerals would work best for you."

 

I beleive what was actually posted was he FELT there should not be any numbers worn. The tabs should be worn for the position of your primary registration, i.e. the one you are paying registration for.

[Eagle92]

Technically, and this is in the ICG, a Council level scouter, district and council folks, are supposed to wear the Silver loops. Further on their left sleeve they wear a council strip, POR, trained insignia (if earned) and Arrowhead Award ( if a commissioner and earned). Unit number are not to be worn.

 

Now is this followed by all district level folks. NO. Some only wear their unit specific uniform. Others wear their unit numbers with the district uniform, i.e. Dist. Vice chair with troop number.

 

Me personally, as soon as I was offered a district job, I got a new shirt with all the trimmings. Everyone new what unit I was from, but I felt that by wearing the shirt, I was not showing favortism towards my unit.

[AlFansome]

 

Actually, I personally think that (if you can afford it) you get an extra shirt (or 2!) so that you can wear the insignia of the job you're currently performing at a particular event.

 

For instance, I wouldn't come to a Pack Meeting as Cubmaster wearing my COR shirt, nor would I go to an ECOH for one of my Troops wearing my Cub leader uniform.

 

Likewise, if I go to Roundtable and a bunch of the District scouters and commissioners are wearing their unit numerals and unit POR's, it does IMHO make it a bit confusing if you don't know all the scouters already. (And yes, I realize that Commissioners are not supposed to also be Unit scouters...)

 

Now, that's just my preference...nothing wrong in doing it other ways.

 

Likewise, the "right" way to wear a district/council uniform is as Eagle92 describes, but if a COR wants to wear green loops and unit numbers, my Uniform Police sirens wounldn't go off in that case!

 

[GMitch]

Eagle here's another twist on it. A COR's sole purpose is to represent his unit(s) at the District and Council level. Naturally I have favoritism for my units, that is my primary job on the committee as a COR, to represent my unit, though I have secondary responsibilities that I have taken on the training and membership subcommittees. You guys are probably correct in the no numerals for COR thing....... technically speaking. However, if one sees a COR patch and no unit numerals because "we are district and council level Scouters" then one has no idea what CO he or she represents. Unit numerals solve that dilemma. Furthermore, inasmuch as a COR is a district and council Scouter, we are very much still unit Scouters as well, since we are the heads of the Scouting department in our COs. Remember the 3 legged stool image in the COR training?

 

http://www.scouting.org/media/relationships/trainingthecor/~/media/Images/relationships/04-113/art/stool.jpg.ashx

 

For the record, I'm not cheap about buying uniforms. I've got 2 tan shirts, 4 pair of pants(old and new), a drawer full of socks, and a complete Venturing setup too. They all have COR patches and unit numerals too! Seems a little silly to have a seperate uniform for let's say my role as Varsity Scout Team Committee Chairman, or Pack Committee Member when I am also COR for those units. Al if you are holding the CM and CR positions in the same unit, then I would see no issue with wearing the COR uniform to do your CM work. You see, COR is your PRIMARY registered position, and the CM responsibility is an appendage to it, presumably because the unit is understaffed.

 

I do like the different ideas being presented here. You guys are all great Scouters.

[AlFansome]

 

Actually, I'm CM for my son's Pack which is not one of the 5 units that I'm COR for. My primary registered position is as CM for my pack.

 

My COR duties were something I picked up last year after seeing the amount of neglect our CO was exhibiting to our 5 units.

 

3 of the units are in fine shape with good leaders and strong programs. 1 is a troop that needs to "get with the program" as it were and the 5th unit is a Venturing crew that's small and not too active after a bunch of boys went off to college. Right now, I'm dotting the i's and crossing the t's on YP, training, leadership staffing and registrations for all the units, while also starting to focus on the one troop to get it on the right track.

 

[GMitch]

Sounds like you are on the right track Al, and they have the right guy as COR. I just conducted a COR training, and I really emphasize that saying in the training "while it is a position of honor, it is not an honorary position, there is work to do". Too many CORs think all they do is sign paperwork for adult applications. I believe a non participating COR is the one of the first step towards a unit's deterioration, and a good COR is one of the first steps to unit revitalization.

 

I agree with you that if you are not COR for your sons Pack, a different uniform for the CM position is appropriate. I will probably do the same thing in 2 years and 10 months when my son starts Tigers. That Pack is under a different CO, but I am going to try to be the Tiger DL for them too when my son is there.

[AlFansome]

 

GMitch-

Thanks for the kind words...

 

Real functioning CORs are few and far between in our area, apparently. When I asked my pack's UC (whose also the Council registrar) which meetings I should be attending as COR, she was taken aback since no CORs ever attend the Council board meetings (non-voting) or the annual meeting (voting).

My issue (as always) is time. My son's pack is in a different district than my 5 units and there's no way I have enough time for 2 roundtables, a district committee meeting, and unit leader meetings in addition to all my pack stuff and that little thing called a job. At this point, my priority is our Pack's district. He bridges in a little over a year so we'll see which Troop in which district catches his interest. Maybe I'll get lucky!

 

[jdbsa05]

Page 65 of the new Guide to Awards and Insignia (the Insignia Guide) states:

 

"Shoulder Loops, ribbon, on the shoulder epaulets; the color identifies the wearer's primary registered position in Scouting: ... Council and district (including chartered organization representative) - silver."

 

So, CORs wear silver.

 

And with regard to the unit numerals, the COR badge of office (and all Council/District badges of office, for that matter) is listed under the part headed "Universal and Nonunit Insignia," so my reading suggests that these positions don't wear numerals.(This message has been edited by jdbsa05)

[BadenP]

Interesting discussion however in all my years in scouting I have only seen one COR who even wore a uniform. Most of them consider themselves to be more of a outside observer than an active part of any unit.