Is this a 1940s BSA uniform?

[arthistorian]

I am hoping that you scouting experts can help me identify the uniform in this photograph by Dorothea Lange: http://content.cdlib.org/ark:/13030/ft8b69p1g1&brand=oac/

 

The photograph is from 1942 and is of a young Japanese American boy in some type of military-inspired uniform. He is about to be interned along with his family, so a white identification tag is also hanging from his jacket. The photograph has been described in some historical literature as being of a "Boy Scout," but I do not see any obvious BSA insignias.

 

Does this appear to be a BSA uniform to you? Any ideas may be helpful to me!

 

Thank you.

[Gold Winger]

Doesn't look like any BSA uniform that I've ever seen. Could be the uniform of either a military school or an organization like "Sons of Nippon Drill Team."

[skeptic]

From what is viewable, I would have to say this is NOT a scouting uniform from that era, or even an earlier era. Frankly, it looks more like the Japanese military uniforms seen in many WWII photos if anything. Realistically, it is likely an outfit put together from what was available at the time under stressful circumstances. JMHO.

[emb021]

That's not a 1940s era BSA uniform.

 

Mitch Reis has a great work on dating BSA uniforms.

 

Scouts never wore that kind of coat. Scouters DID, but in the earlier years, and this style had gone by the waysideb by the 1940s.

 

Also, the kid looks very younger. Boy Scouts started at age 12. He looks to be about Cub Scout age, which never had that kind of uniform.

 

 

[emb021]

Also, as noted, there are no BSA insignia.

 

Buttons look more like generic military style. There should say "BSA" I believe, and there should be BSA collar insignia, community strip and unit number.

 

The insignia above the left pocket is definetly NOT BSA. Uncertain about the ribbons at the bottom of the sleeves.

 

 

[arthistorian]

Thank you all for your help in confirming my hunch that this is NOT a Boy Scout uniform. This is very useful and points my research in another direction.

[Gold Winger]

It occurred to me that back in those days, boys would often wear sailor suits and other military styled clothing as dress clothes. The wings and the rank stripes on the sleeves (like the navy) made me think that it might just be a little boy's dress outfit.

[RememberSchiff]

From the lapels, sleeves,and pocket flaps, it looks like a replica of a WW2 US Army Officer jacket though not the Ike jacket. Zoom the image and you'll see the buttons have an Eagle on them. My guess anyway.

[scoutldr]

Definitely NOT BSA. Looks homemade.

[John-in-KC]

It looks like a cross between:

 

Naval Aviator working grays from the early 1940s (especially the coat).

 

Army Cavalry jodphurs from the 1930s.

 

 

[Gold Winger]

John,

 

Naval Aviators wore green back then, actually they can apparently still wear green now but rarely do. The service dress grey uniform was adopted during WW II was primarily worn in the north atlantic and had shoulder boards like the service dress khaki not sleeve stripes like the aviation greens and dress blues. Also the old naval aviator uniform included breeches which is what the boy is wearing (Jodhpurs are much roomier in the hips).

 

I am unsure if the Naval Aviator uniform included a Sam Browne belt and I can't check it out because my reference materials are buried in my basement.

[John-in-KC]

Got it. You're right.

 

Come to think of it, there's another uniform blouse it looks like: RAF.

 

Think about it.

[Gold Winger]

Could be but I don't think that the RAF would have iggles on their buttons. Luftwaffe perhaps?

 

 

[jmwalston]

"Could be but I don't think that the RAF would have iggles on their buttons. Luftwaffe perhaps?"

 

Nope, German military buttons had a "pebbley" appearance. These look like U.S. military style buttons. And it appears he is wearing puttees, not jodphurs. The flight "wings" are reminisent of Japanese style wings, but on the wrong side. Also, the Sam Browne belt generally hooks over the right shoulder. This could be a picture where the negative was facing the wrong way when the positive was developed.

[Gold Winger]

Sorry but it isn't reversed. Reverse the image and then look at the writing on the tag.

 

BTW, the puttees are the leggings not the pants, those are breeches.