Should I become the uniform police?

[click23]

I was at our roundtable last night, and saw an ASM that was a couple of years behind me in school. I have been back active in scouts for a little over a year now, and this is only the second time I saw him, the first was a couple of weeks back at the camporee. This was the first time that I saw him in uniform, and there on his shirt were at least three rows of knots. I was looking at them as he walked by, thinking he has been busy and I'm glad his troop has him. This was a large troop when I was a kid and now is down to 4 or 5 boys. He had his youth awards, Eagle,AOL, religious, and even Explorer Gold award, which struck me as odd, but I guess they formed a post after I left. He also had a Scouter's Training Award and Scouter's Key knots.

 

Then something jumped out at me, the knot for the George Meany Award and then I saw something that made me do a double take, a red and white knot on a tan back, I was pretty sure I knew what that was, but decided to look in my insignia guide when I got home. Sure enough, it is what I thought it was, the Silver Buffalo. I started thinking, I'm only 28 so he is 25 or so, that is very strange, and guess what, his name is not on the Silver Buffalo list.

 

I have never said anything to a scout or scouter about their uniform that was not in one of my assigned units, I am a unit commissioner. And then it is something like, "Mike, next time you sew a patch on your shirt, you might want to turn this knot around while you are at it, the over lope goes to the wearers right." This isn't something like a patch in the wrong place or something like that, this is the highest adult award(and the George Meany Award is no small fry either), but he is not in one of my assigned units, so is it really any of my business?

 

Robert

[ScoutDadof5]

On the Meany award, no telling. I have no idea what the qualifications are there. That could totally be bonafide.

 

In regards to the Silver Buffalo, i am guessing he may have mistaken that for something else. If I saw it on an individuall I knew or were aquanted with, I might say ..."Is that the Silver Buffalo knot?" My guess is that he might think it is something else. If they were 25 and said yes, I would likely say, I haven't seen that in the council news. Can you give me some details so we can get it into the Council newsletter?

 

I am sure you can see where that might go on it own =)

 

Peace!

[FScouter]

Don't feel intimidated. People put stuff on their uniform for others to look at. If you want to know how he earned the silver buffalo, ask him.

 

"Uniform police" exists only in the mind of the uniform scofflaw.

[Beavah]

Yah, I'm not real fond of a commish offerin' unsolicited uniform "advice" even in units he's a commissioner for. Be a friend, offer advice where asked. Uniform stuff is often "cheap" advice that often says more about your ego (wantin' to show off by pointing out errors) than where they really need guidance, eh?

 

For this young scouter, there is a "helpful" issue in that it can be kind not to let him continue to make a fool of himself at district events. But I'd say yeh let it go unless you know him well or have a chance for an informal chat over coffee or around a campfire. Let someone who is closer to him be the one to inquire. Someone will.

 

Beavah

 

[epalmer84]

I agree with ScoutDadof5 just ask. It is possible he got the knot mixed up with something else. There are a group of us working to expand the Wikipedia material, so it would be nice to get any information if he really does have a Silver Buffalo.

 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Silver_Buffalo_Award

 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Recipients_of_the_Silver_Buffalo_Award

 

Ed

[eolesen]

I'm curious how he even got the knot in the first place... it's not available via Scoutstuff, and those are supposed to be "over the counter" at the Scout Store.

[Cubmaster Randy]

I ran into a former cub leader, who was a new ASM in a neighboring troop. I knew pretty well from from some of our district activities We were at our annual district dinner a couple of years ago when I saw him wearing the Scoutmasters Award of Merit. I asked him what knot that was.(I knew)

He said, it was the Cubmaster Award. i was wearing my CM award so I told him that was the award.I said I thought he was wearing the scoutmasters award of merit. Turns out He had just been given the wrong knot. He laughed, we spoke about when he was going to become SM. He laughed some more. Later that night, two SM's from our district were awarded them. He later got the right knot

[click23]

After the conversation that we had at the camporee, it was evident that he is big into patch trading. Just based on the kid I knew in school, it would not surprise me if he was just showing off the patches he had traded for.

 

Our scout shop will not sell any award without proper credentials, and I doubt that a scout shop would even carry that knot. They even keep them in those plastic fishing lure tray with the dividers, with everything labeled.(This message has been edited by click23)

[frank10]

Could it have been his dads shirt?

[Eamonn]

"Should I become the uniform police?"

NO!!

Take plenty of no notice!!

If his uniform is not right?

Maybe there is a reason?

Having said that!

I have a few "Odd ball" knots on a couple of my uniform shirts. Knots that not everyone recognizes and there are times when people will ask "What's that knot?"

This gives me the opportunity to puff out my 38" chest and bore the pants off them!!

Eamonn.

(My chances of ever receiving a Buffalo? -It's never going to happen.)

 

[Gold Winger]

Maybe we need the uniform police.

 

I know a Scouter who wore all sorts of training knots and I know for a fact that he never did the work. I made a comment once like "Wow, you sure did a lot of training." His response was "Huh?" so I continued "

Your knots they say that you completed your training." "Nah, I just figured that everyone else had them so I'd wear them." I explained that they represented awards that were earned and he said, "Don't care."

 

As for other functions of the uniform police I don't understand why people don't take five minutes to learn where things go on their uniform. Every patch or pin on my shirt is within 1/8" of where it is supposed to be.

 

Give me a badge and a book of citations.

[scoutldr]

I would suggest to the RT Commish that a session on "Knots" and adult awards would be appropriate...without mentioning any names. Then let the natural course of things proceed.

[kraut-60]

I am presently the Boy Scout Roundtable commissioner for the Southern Lakes district of Glaciers Edge council. Part of the roundtable session is what I call "knot of the month" and no, its not knots that are used in scoutcraft. I spotlight one of the knot insignia, what it looks like, which way the colors go, and what is required to earn and wear it.

 

This last wednesday was our RT for this month, and Novembers Knot of the month is the Silver Beaver. I will probably do a Cub Scouter knot for December.

 

Perhaps the RT commish at click23s' roundtable might have such a feature also?

 

On a personal note, I find it beneath contempt to wear ANY knot or award that is not actually earned or awarded.

[HiLo]

If this person feels the need to display more awards than he has actually earned, the real issue isn't a particular knot on his shirt, but why he's really in Scouting.

[ScouterLew]

Wearing the scout uniform is somewhere between Halloween and the military. For Halloween you can wear anything you want. In the military wearing anything you want can land you in confinement.

 

The wearing of the scout uniform is a privilege and the awards that we put on it are earned. If we are leading our youth and would not accept this behaviour from our youth then why would we accept it from each other?

 

We should have the courage and tact to address this one on one with the 'offender.'

 

If that doesn't work then we work it up the chain of command.

 

If the problem is unit wide or may involve just a few...then a uniform inspection at a RT or other event would be good.

 

Either way, protecting the integrity of the uniform and what each of the awards are for is important. If it isn't important to the 'offender' then they may be part of the wrong outfit for the wrong reasons.