Official Boy Scout Uniform

[Lynda J]

If this scout was wanting to wear his OA dance regalia would you be complaining. It isn't "Official BSA Uniform"

Our last Eagle wore an Eskimo American costume. He used elk antlers to hold candles, and an elk hide draped the table. It was beautiful. He spend most of his Scouting life living in Alaska and the entire outfit was given to him by a gentleman when he had worked on a service project there. Saw some pictures once from Hawaii where the young man work native attire.

Let the lad wear his kilt. But he can not mix any part of his BSA uniform with it. Including Badge Sash, OA sash. It has to be a complete Kilt attire. Remember it is him Court of Honor to plan. IMHO if the Scout sharing the COH with him has no problem with him wearing a kilt I don't think anyone else should.

 

(This message has been edited by Lynda J)

[Eamonn]

The official BSA Scout uniform is just that.

If you read the Rules and Regulations. Clause 4.Prohibition of Alteration or Imitation this is spelled out very clearly: (a) No alteration of or additions to, the official uniforms, as described in the official publications, or the rules and regulations covering the wearing of the uniform and the proper combinations therefore on official occasions may be authorized by any Scouting official or local council or any local executive board or committee, except the Executive Board of the Boy Scouts of America after consideration by the Program Group Committee.

I think that wearing a kilt, Native American dress or anything that isn't the official uniform would be seen as an alteration.

While a PLC can say when the uniform will be worn, they can not say what the uniform is. A Troop Committee can not change the official uniform.

Like it or not we only have the official uniforms and altering them is breaking the rules and regulations of the BSA.

Rita, you might want to show the Lad a copy of the BSA rules and regulations or you could show him the rule as it is written in the Insignia Guide.

What the Lad does after that is his choice. But you will have done your part.

While I would not go as far as refusing to present the award, I would really do my best to explain what Uniform means? I also would be a little concerned about opening a can of worms, when it comes to allowing ethnic dress to be come part of Boy Scout ceremonies.

I don't see an Eagle Scout COH as an OA ceremony, I see it as an official Boy Scout ceremony a very important ceremony. Hopefully the local press will cover the event and we as a uniformed organization would want to look like the Boy Scouts of America.

Eamonn.

[SueM]

Let me preface this by saying that I think that they uniform is an important part of Scouting and I do "highly encourage" wearing an Official Uniform at all special functions.

 

That being said..for discussion purposes...if we start talking about BSA uniform policy...BSA also states that a boy does NOT have to wear a uniform to be a good scout. We can not FORCE them to wear one either. We are continually being told from the district & council level that the uniform will be gone in 5 years! Some of the other parts of Scouting have a "distinctive dress" policy which allows the members to choose their own style of uniform (or lack there of). Boys also now have the option now of attending an Eagle BoR in a suit and tie if they wish..which while I don't like it, it's certainly better than them showing up in blue jeans!! My own boys continually complain about having to wear them and I ask them if they participate in sports (Yes) and if they are expected to wear a uniform as part of the team in that sport (yes again) and point out to them that this is -no different-...they are part of a team and I expect them to dress as such!

 

Eagle CoH's are not a necessity..there is no rule that the boys HAVE to have them and when they do, there are no formal rules as to how they have to be..it is up to the family's wishes and discretion. We have actually had simple "surprise" presentations for boys who did not want big formal ones...with the family's permission and help..we just felt it was a shame to not have SOME form of recognition. Again I do want to see the boys in uniform, but I'm not sure that it they really wanted to do their Eagle CoH in an informal way, that that would be a big issue either.

[OldGreyEagle]

"We are continually being told from the district & council level that the uniform will be gone in 5 years!"

 

WOW! Where do you live? I hadnt heard that before, anybody else?

[SueM]

OGE,

 

I have heard this rumor from several different people in our district & council..whether it's just that (rumor) or "you didn't hear it from me but..." truth I don't know. Certainly, people (including myself) have been talking and are upset about it and not in agreement with it. Many old timers have said they will quit if it comes to be! I think that it may be a response to asking boys what keeps them from joining scouts (they don't want to wear the uniform anymore) but who knows...I'm only reporting what I have heard...Our Troop had elected to go without neckerchiefs or ties of any kind years ago and we HAVE had boys specifically join the unit because we didn't require them! (sad..but true!) I'm not sure how they could just do away with them, especially with the uniform being one of the 8 aims and methods of scouting but who knows...

 

sue m.

 

 

[Eamonn]

Hi Sue,

Uniform is not a requirement for membership in the BSA. But the rules and regulations state that if you do wear it you comply with the rule.

As for the rumor?

A while back there was a rumor that there would be a new uniform for the last Jamboree. It didn't happen.

There is a rumor that there is going to be a new uniform in 2010?

I have not heard or seen this from anyone other than volunteers. So I really don't know.

Yes the Canadians have changed the way they look at uniforms and several other countries (The UK and Australia I know for sure) have changed. Most of the comments about the new uniforms in these places have mentioned Fast Food!!

Sales of uniforms do bring in a lot of money and without wanting to start a fire!! - I really do not see the BSA wanting to lose that income. I know that we in our little Council do count on Uniform Sales to bring in money for the Council.

Last year I sat at a B&G Banquet. The CM was getting his Wood Badge beads. The pack was /is a large pack from a well to do area (The banquet was in a classy Italian restaurant) Not one Cub Scout had on the official Cub Scout pants. On one side, sitting next to me was our Area President who had been the course quartermaster and on the other side was our SE who was in the same Patrol as the CM. We all noticed the pants and we all agreed that maybe it was time for a rethink, but in the next breath said it wasn't going to happen.

Eamonn

[SueM]

 

>Sales of uniforms do bring in a lot of money and ????without wanting to start a fire!! - I really do not see the BSA wanting to lose that income

 

 

Eamonn,

 

Exactly!! This was my first immediate thought when I first heard the rumor...NO WAY that BSA is going to give up all the money for Uniform sales! Wearing uniforms is an issue with many other groups these days too...even Church choirs are having issues with members who don't want to wear robes, etc. anymore!

 

We are somewhat liberal with our uniform policy as far as -meetings- go..as long as the pants are close to official olive color as possible they are acceptable. I know that many might not agree with this though..We recognize that uniforms ARE expensive items to replace. However we DO expect every boy to have official pants too and they are to be worn at all other occasions and functions. We have a uniform closet to recycle uniforms when they get outgrown, or to provide them to boys who might not be able to afford them. We have several adults who do yard sales and garage sales and sometimes pick these items up cheaply there too.

 

sue m.

[schleining]

While the Boy Scout Uniform is not "Required". There is an "Official way to wear the uniform.

If the uniform is being worn than it needs to be worn properly as outlined in the handbook and other documents from the BSA.

 

If your Scout wants to wear a kilt... Great... just not with a BSA Shirt.

The kilt is not a BSA uniform and should not be worn as part of the uniform.

 

This is an old agrument and the answer will not change.

Those of you that are anti uniform or anti BSA policy need to give it a rest.

 

Jerry

Scoutmaster who wears the uniform properly.

[emb021]

"Some of the other parts of Scouting have a "distinctive dress" policy which allows the members to choose their own style of uniform (or lack there of). "

 

I guess you are speaking of Venturing. While this is true, the Venturing green uniform shirt is still fairly popular. Also, within Sea Scouting the use of the traditional naval-style uniform is still popular (and actually required for regional and national events).

[SueM]

emb021,

 

I'm trying now to remember all the ones who fall under the Distinctive Dress policy....my Wood Badge patrol project was on the history of Uniforms in Scouting and I can't for the life of me find the files now that I had saved in doing the research for it..what I'm think I remember though are not only Venturing and Sea Scouts, but Varsity and especially the Learning for Life programs. Since the later is more career oriented, it allows them to adopt something suitable for their own branch.

 

sue m.

[acco40]

With two teenage boys, I think the BSA should adopt a new "uniform" look. The new uniform should be made mandatory and consist of jeans worn, as a minimum, at least six inches below the navel, boxer shorts, worn as a minimum, two inches above the navel, sneakers with the requirement that the laces are kept untied and a T-shirt with no politically correct words which must no be tucked in but must be at least one size too big.

 

My reasoning you may ask? If the BSA makes the above the official uniform I can rest assured that my sons and the boys in our troop would rarely, if ever wear the complete uniform again.

[SueM]

acco40

 

I just spent the whole weekend at our local combined District Fall Camporee and all I did all weekend was yell "tuck those shirts in!!" "Pull those pants up!" until I was blue in the face!!

 

sue m

[Hunt]

"I just spent the whole weekend at our local combined District Fall Camporee and all I did all weekend was yell "tuck those shirts in!!" "Pull those pants up!" until I was blue in the face!!"

 

SueM is an unusual handle for a Senior Patrol Leader....

 

Seriously, I would suggest that this is not the way to address uniforming issues. An adult leader in scouting is really not like a sports coach (who may well spend a lot of time yelling for the players to tuck their shirts in). Let the youth leaders turn blue in the face.

[SueM]

I mean this as a general comment as I'm not an argumentative person, but sometimes I do get really irritated with instant judgements that happen here, when people have no idea of what the dynamics of each individual troop are! What works for some troops does not work for others and some of us also "inherit" situations that take time to change and we are doing the best that we can with what we have to work with!! It doesn't help us sometimes, being constantly reminded of what we're doing "wrong", or having someone who doesn't know us jumping on a misspoken (or badly chosen) word!! Troops, like people, are in a constant state of evolution and I think that we all need to remember that! I have yet to see that "perfect" troop that they show you on the training videos!!

 

I enjoy this forum very much and like the exchange of ideas but sometimes it does get a little discouraging at times. Most of us are already well aware of where improvements are needed in our individual troop and are working towards them as best as we can. I don't expect overnight miracles!! I'll get down off of my soapbox now!!

 

sue m.

[Hunt]

SueM, sorry if I offended you. Tone is hard to convey in a message like this, and mine came off as too critical. When I read your message, I pictured a situation that may not be what you are experiencing (although it is one I have seen).