Anyone else do no uniforms?

[dan]

FScouter

Within the Scoutmaster Handbook, it is written

to become a scout a uniform is not required.

 

As I have written in this forum many times and have never been disagreed with. The reason the BSA wrote it this way, was so that troops with financially trapped members, could still be scouts.

It is to bad that MOST units take this to mean that the uniform is optional or changeable.

 

[SR540Beaver]

Dan,

 

Good point. Another way to look at it is to say, "to obtain a drivers license, a car is not required". I took my drivers test in my dad's car and was allowed to drive it until I earned enough money to buy my own. Scouting is a uniformed movement and scouts are encouraged to wear a uniform if and when financially able. A scout it thrifty, he earns and pays his own way. Fundraising opportunities should be provided to help a scout obtain a uniform......a piece at a time if needed. But to "JOIN", a uniform is not required.

[FScouter]

No one is saying a uniform is required to join.

 

I am saying that it is not permissable for a unit to codify "we don't do uniforms". That is NOT a unit option.

[evmori]

I am saying that it is not permissable for a unit to codify "we don't do uniforms". That is NOT a unit option.

 

And it says that in what BSA publication on what page?

 

I do love the uniform & I do wear it. I also encourage it be worn. But you can't force someone to wear something that isn't required. Plus, there are more important things in Scouting than clothing.

 

Ed Mori

Troop 1

1 Peter 4:10

[Bob White]

"And it says that in what BSA publication on what page?"

 

I am so glad that you asked that question.

 

 

The Boy Scout Handbook, pages 12-13, and 23. The Scoutmaster Handbook page 9, 37,45,54,62. Scoutmaster Job Specific Training section III "Uniforming", The BSA Insignia Guide page 1 second column first paragraph under the heading personal Committmemnt.

 

Just for starters. (This message has been edited by a staff member.)

[SR540Beaver]

Since it is usually too hot, too cold, too windy and ALWAYS seems to rain on our outings, I'm going to suggest to the PLC that we eliminate campouts from our program. We can just go to our charter and play video games all weekend once a month. I feel sure the boys will go for that. Now if we can just get them to participate in a fundraiser to buy a few more PlayStation units. I'm sure their parents will sell the stuff for them at work. We can have some cool gamer shirts made too.

[evmori]

I am so glad that you asked that question. The Boy Scout Handbook, pages 12-13, and 23.

 

Pages 12-13 address the uniform & what it's parts are and encourage it's wear. Nothing about a Troop deciding not to wear it. Page 23 is about the National Honor Patrol Award. An optional award patrols can earn. It mentions wearing the full uniform correctly but only 75% of the patrol must do this. Nothing about a Troop deciding not to wear it.

 

The Scoutmaster Handbook page 9, 37,45,54,62.

 

Page 9 has a section about the uniform method. Nothing about a Troop deciding not to wear it. Pages 37, 45, 54, 62 are all Troop Meeting Plan Outlines for specific themes and all say "Hold a uniform inspection." Nothing about a Troop deciding not to wear it. If I'm not mistaken, these Troop Meeting Plans are guidelines, not hard & fast rules.

 

I don't have the other publications mentioned handy but I would bet I would find the same thing.

 

Next!

 

Ed Mori

Troop 1

1 Peter 4:10

[SR540Beaver]

Ed,

 

To quote my mom, "geez, you'd argue with a fence post".

[OldGreyEagle]

Nope Beav, just BobWhite

[drockstur]

Wow let me go into detail and see if I can answer some questions.

-First of all Im not looking for support or to cause controversy, Im just curious to see if there is any other troop without class A (defined by me as a typical beige shirt with badges and patches etc.) uniforms.

-I am a senior in high school, soon to be Eagle Scout(waiting for board). I dont know of many other scouts my age. Most have either become an Eagle and have left or they quit several years after joining because of the *scouts is for dorky kids* attitude that a typical teenage guy has. Lets face it, most high school boys would find it socially devastating to be seen at Walmart doing a fundraiser in a scout uniform with a group of 6th-8th graders. But for the few who dont care about popularity, scouts is still there. I dont have a problem with uniforms, and im not going to make fun of someone for wearing one (im in marching band after all). Im just in a troop that chooses not to wear them.

-My troop is comprised of about 14 scouts and many adults (about 15 (not including leaders), however, not all come every week to meetings) that choose to hang around. Many of my friends that have already become Eagle still hang around. There are guys in their 20s 30s, who arent leaders, that still come to meetings almost every week. Sometimes we have more adults than kids go on campouts, just to hang out. We recruit our scouts through friends, family, and the church we meet at, no cub scout feeder troops. Almost all of our kids stick with it all the way through Eagle. Why? I cant say its because we dont wear uniforms, but i think it is a significant factor. At meetings sometimes we work on advancement or we plan campouts. We go on a campout once a month (the smoky mountains are 30 min away) and in the summer we go canoeing a lot on our regular meeting night. I think this is what keeps everyone around in our troop. We all love going camping and doing things outdoors. We also spend a lot of time going over first aid and various boy scout lifeskills and we do a variety of activities such as orienteering, canoeing, hiking, and rifle shooting. By using our week of summer scout camp as our major source of merit badge advancement, someone who starts when they are young has plenty of time to have fun in the troop without constantly having to worry about advancement. Although im not certain, I believe that our troop has been around almost 40 years or longer, with the same policy. We wear the red polos ( I hear people to it as *Class B* although we dont wear anything else like a belt or socks) at scout camp just to dress up for events so were not in our sweaty clothes that we have been wearing all day.

-User johndaigler said- Speaking of assumptions, it sounds like the uniforms are desired for Eagle events and other "photo ops". If that's the case, I would suggest that, THAT decision cheapens the original choice. Either believe that uniforms are worthwhile or believe that they are not.

In my opinion, we buy class as before eagle ceremonies to show the heritage and traditional customs of scouting. Its also a good way to proudly show off in a visual way the accomplishments weve made to our family and friends. We just dont use our time at meetings and campouts dealing with uniforms.

-Although we are smaller than a lot of troops, I know that I have had more fun in scouts than any other activity. I plan to hang around and continue going on campouts for as long as possible.

 

I am open to anymore questions or comments. Please place them on the forum for all the view.

 

[johndaigler]

drockstur,

 

Great post - thanks!

 

I see your point about the uni, but I think it's an obvious question to ask, "Why not use that reasoning ("to show the heritage and traditional customs of scouting. Its also a good way to proudly show off in a visual way the accomplishments weve made to our family and friends.") to have the uniform around earlier for the important steps on the path to Eagle? Eagle is a grand accomplishment, but the milestones of First Class, Star and Life would also be wonderful accomplishments to share with friends and family.

 

jd

[madkins007]

You know- in both our pack and troop, we had a few 'uniform optional' days where you could wear the Activity Uniforms instead of the Field Uniform. Even a few 'wear scuzzy work clothes' days. These were usually days when we planned to do things like repaint patrol boxes, clean the storage shed, work in the school or church yard, or have a picnic with games that would easily soil or damage a uniform, etc.

 

I often noticed that these days were remarkably well-attended when they were advertised. Scouts we had not seen in ages often showed up.

 

The pride WE may have in the uniform does not seem universally shared by the Scouts themselves. Like drocksur said "Lets face it, most high school boys would find it socially devastating to be seen at Walmart doing a fundraiser in a scout uniform".

 

Ah, uniforms! They have been hotly debated since the 20's. In fact, I think they have been a bone of contention since B-P's day.

[evmori]

Beav,

If I disagreed with the fence post, yes I would.

 

OGE,

I'll argue with anyone not just Bob. Try me!

 

Ed Mori

Troop 1

1 Peter 4:10

[tnp710]

I have chosen to get printed t-shirts for my scouts, and let them wear their uniforms for community service projects, ceremonies and other scouting outings.

[Tami the Mom]

My son just moved up to the Troop in February. Of the few meetings I attended, I would say maybe 70% of the boys were in uniform. The rest were in regular clothes.

 

In our Pack, we encourage all the boys to get a class A shirt, neckerchief, slide and belt. We have seen behavior improve when a boy puts on a nice shirt. We would never refuse a boy to participate in something for lack of the tan shirt, but if we're lining up for pics for the newspaper, the kids with their full uni on get the front row.

 

My son has told me he is proud of the badges and awards he has on his shirt. I like that he takes pride in his hard work and wants to show it off. I guess if he didn't want to wear the uniform, I wouldn't force him.

 

My question would be- what about your troop leaders? You say you have more adults than boys, why? Why so many adults hanging around? And do they wear the uniform? We see that the more adults we have in uni, the more boys are willing to wear them.