Can Adult Scouters wear medals earned as Scout

[OAEagleDude]

I consider the Eagle cloth badge to be a rank and the medal to be an award

[OldGreyEagle]

As the cloth rank badge and Eagle medal represent the same thing to me, I would love to hear an explnation of your statement

[drakmund]

I have always had trouble with adult awards, on the one hand they show a Scoutmaster or leader has had a lot of training or has work with his unit for several years on the other I've seen adults decorated like military generals with rows and rows of adult knots. Some of these leaders where their awards all the time while others reserve them for special occasions. As an adult leader I don't wear any knots or other items I've earned because I want to focus on the scouts and their awards, not mine.

 

The ONLY patch or medal I make a point to wear is the Eagle Scout patch. I've had a debate with this patch as well over the rules saying you should wear the knot as an adult. I have found that almost no one outside of scouting and very few within scouting actually knows the adult eagle knot. When a parent or scout sees the eagle patch, they immediately recognize it and know what it represents. I look at it from the point of view that as an Eagle, I want them to see that they too can be an Eagle Scout if they work hard and stick to the Scout Oath and Law.

 

Service Stars, Adult Knots, Medals, etc I don't have much use for or would want to wear but the eagle patch is very personal to me and regardless of the rules I do see the use of an adult wearing the eagle patch rather then the knot. As for the cloth badge and the medal, they both represent the eagle scout award, so I don't see the difference OAEagleDude.

[FScouter]

Badges of rank are for boys. We have one old guy in our council that insists on his "right" to wear the eagle badge despite the national regulation against this. It really looks silly on a grown man and people snicker behind his back.

[Herms]

For me it really depends on the situation. With the troop I only wear my Eagle medal and neckerchief for Eagle COH's. I would wear it to our pack's B&G, but usually I am in some sort of theme costume!

 

As far as knots go, I have three uniforms, 2 with the knots and one with just my AOL and Eagle knots (this is my camping uniform). I think it is important to be an example for boys to be proud of your uniform and accomplishments. All of my boys, crew, troop and pack know which one of my knots is my Eagle and AOL. I've also had boys say they would like to have knots like mine some year, so if that little spark leads to a future leader, I'll wear them!

 

Be proud of your accomplishments and the fact that you serve today's youth and wear your knots!!

[scoutldr]

Fscouter is correct. Once a scout becomes 18, the Eagle badge of rank comes off and is replaced with a square knot. How many square knots one chooses to wear is a personal choice, and nobody's business.

[LongHaul]

Drakmund,

The question I have for you is what type of an Example are you trying to set. You admit to the fact that wearing the cloth Eagle badge is against BSA National Policy yet you defend your choice to do it. You say you don't wear recognition knots because you want to focus on the scouts and their awards. If you set the example that awards are not important then why should the scouts seek them? I've been in scouting for over thirty years and like you never wore Adult awards. Then I took Woodbadge in 1998 and my Scoutmaster asked me that question. How is qualifying for , being recognized for and wearing an embroidered knot for Adult Training any different than rank advancement? Why should the scouts do it by the numbers and seek recognition if you dont. This is not saying that you should seek recognition as a goal but when being trained, serving youth and providing program qualify you for recognition why refuse it?

LongHaul

 

[packsaddle]

I am sympathetic to what I think was Drakmund's intent. There is a point at which attention to the regalia shifts from a boy-oriented program (a good thing) to an activity that is all about the adult (not good). It does seem for some adults who are heavily decorated (the Liberace effect ), that they are mostly interested in their own glory.

There are indeed leaders who selflessly give and ask little in return, and there are volunteers who seem to want attention drawn to themselves and offer little more.

I wear the knot for eagle and the religious award. And I may add the Inclusive Scouting one. But enough already. I think the best example is through action and deeds, not appearance.

[drakmund]

Long Haul,

 

packsaddle is correct on my intent. There are 2 adult leaders in my district that have about 12-14 adult knots plus their Wood Badge beads, plus several other layers of awards and the problem I keep seeing is adults that want titles, positions above others, recognitions and other awards. In some cases I've seen adults promote themselves to get a position then they don't do the job or they make a big deal that they are "in charge." This kind of example isn't the example I would want for my scouts. I want them to earn their awards and be proud of what they (the scouts) acheive, not what some adult does. This is the "Boy" Scout program not the "Adult" Scout program.

 

As for the Eagle Badge, I think I'll switch to using the medal instead but my problem is with the knot. As an Eagle, I want to represent what I want my scouts should be but the knot is unfamiliar to most scouts and parents.

[Trevorum]

Pack,

I wear the Inclusive Scouting knot, but on my optional patch pocket and not with my Eagle knot. Several other Scouters in my unit wear it above the pocket.

[SWScouter]

By "inclusive scouter knot" do you mean the knot that's used for the various trainer awards, e.g., Boy Scout Leader Training award?

 

Trevorum, what do you mean by, "optional patch pocket?" Do you mean the right pocket where temporary patches go? That seems strange. Why wouldn't you place the knot above the left pocket where the knots are supposed to go?

 

Thanks,

SWScouter

[FScouter]

My understanding is that it's "gay" knot, the purpose which is to make a statement of protest.

[Trevorum]

Elsewhere I have mentioned the Inclusive Scouting emblem. It is not an official BSA award but is issued by the New England Coalition for Inclusive Scouting. I wear it on my right pocket, where so-called "optional patches" may be worn (camporees, etc.), although others wear it above the pocket.

 

Yes it is controversial and I have recieved disapproving looks and comments from some Scouters. Others have inquired about it and now several Scouters in our unit wear it on their uniform.

 

I do not wear it primarily as a protest, but as a signal to the scouts in my unit that I strongly believe that all boys, no matter what, should have the opportunity to participate in our great movement. I am acutely aware that depression-related suicide is a leading cause of death among teen age boys and I want the fellows in my unit to know that I will accept them as Scouts, no matter what.

[LongHaul]

First off I will agree that some adults want to be Man Scouts instead of Boy Scouts. They gather with other adults on committees and in training situations where they can Lead adults. Often when there are no other awards or accolades to be had they fade away. You rarly find them delivering quality progrqam to youth. This type of display or example is not what Im referring to. Deliberately not wearing the awards one may be entitled to wear or not seeking those awards even if the required participation or work has been done seems to me to be counter to what we are working toward with Scout advancement. If doing the work is all that is important why should a boy seek advancement. Or are we telling them that seeking recognition until you are 18 is right but after 18 its self-indulgent? Second I find it odd that the same people that are saying wearing all your knots is not for them seem to be saying that wearing improper items on their uniform is OK. Using the Uniform to make a political statement in direct disregard for the expressed rulings of National is less an evil than boasting?

LongHaul

 

[packsaddle]

LongHaul, I can answer that, I think, because I have conflicting thoughts, some of which are along the lines of what you have written. The only resolution I can achieve is one that depends on individual judgement. I think you do understand the other side of the argument and that we all agree that this is about the boys, not the adults. As individuals, we must search our own thoughts and determine as honestly as we can, how to balance the selfish aspects of our outward displays against the selfless aspects of those displays in order to promote the scout spirit in the adults and boys around us.

It is a thoughtful task, I think you will admit, and some of us simply do not emphasize the adult awards as a result. In this council, I only know of a couple of adult leaders (they migrated in from other states) who populate their uniforms with mass regalia. For years, I was unaware of how these knots were acquired, much less what they stand for (and I still view everything past the eagle knot and the religious knot with doubtful knowledge, just a bunch of knots to me). This unit has never awarded a knot to an adult. It seems that most other units around here are similar.

 

However, because the program is about the boys, we have awards to provide recognition to them for their achievements. And that is proper because it IS about them. Each boy probably views this in their individual way as well. One boy may think of this is vain terms, another simply proud of the reminder of his achievement. Either way, the absence of some unintelligible knot from my uniform is unlikely to detract from them.

 

Trevorum, I want you picture me...scowling in disapproval..Scowl, Scowl!