What stays on a boy's uniform when he

[Torveaux]

I had heard that some units believed that only the higher cub religious award could confer transfer to the BS shirt. For Roman Catholics, that would be Parvuli Dei, not just Light of Christ. From everything I have been able to find, either one earns the knot and stays on the uniforms. Additional 'levels' just earn the pins.

 

Unfortunately, there does not seem to be a definitive answer anywhere that I could find. If anyone knows where this is clarified, it would help settle a small family wager.

 

 

[Rip Van Scouter]

How "definitive" do you need? The BSA Insignia Guide says:

 

"Religious emblem square knot,

cloth, silver knot on purple, No.

05007, may be worn by youth or

adult members who earned the knot

as a youth, above left pocket."

 

It says the same thing in three sections, under Cub Scouts, Boy Scouts, and Universal Insignia. There is no distinction drawn between the two programs. If it is earned "as a youth" it can be worn! There is also a footnote in the latter section which, I believe, further clarifies the situation:

 

 

"*The miniature device worn with the youth religious emblem square knot indicates emblem(s) earned as a youth. Wear Cub Scout device. No.00926. first-level emblem (God and Me, Maccabee. etc .) earned as a Tiger Cub or Cub Scout; Webelos Scout device. No. 00932. for second-level emblem (God and Family. Parvuli Dei. Faith in God, Light of the World. Aleph, etc.) earned as a Webelos Scout; Boy Scout device. No. 00927,emblem earned as a Boy Scout; and/or Venturing device. No. 00930. emblem earned as a Venturer or older Boy Scout or Varsity Scout. Only one knot is worn, but any combination of devices may be worn on the same knot."

 

So, if he earned it at the "first-level" as a Tiger, Wolf, or Bear, use the Cub Scout pin. Second-level, Webelos pin, etc.

 

Again, THERE IS NO DISTINCTION BETWEEN CUBS AND BOY SCOUTS IN WEARING THE KNOT! Anybody who tries to "read in" such a prohibition is out of there gourd. Ask them to show you where it is prohibited. I think the burden of proof is on them!

 

The text does not even say that the miniature device MUST be worn, only how they are to be worn if they are used. Again:

 

"Only one knot is worn, but any combination of devices may be worn on the same knot." ....devices MAY be worn, not MUST be worn!

 

Considering that pins on a uniform shirt can be problematic, especially if forgotten before washing, I would say don't even bother with the pins except on special occasions like Court of Honor, etc. Service star pins are a good example. I have lost several, and now do not bother with them except at Blue and Gold dinner. That is when I "dress up", including long-sleeve shirt, poly-wool pants, and even the "obsolete" (but still permissible) olive-colored leader tie (I hate bolo ties! ).

 

[kittle]

That is the exact answer I was looking for. I was wanting to take the knot off my son's shirt.

 

 

[VegasDJ]

Okay, now I have a question triggered by Rip Van Scouter's response. One of my den leaders earned our church's Cub Scout religious award (Faith In God), and the separate Boy Scout religious award (On My Honor), so he wears two silver knots with the purple background. It looks a little strange, especially since he has not earned the Adult On My Honor in order to wear the purple knot with silver background, but I think it is completely appropriate and correct. Do you think I'm right?

[mdutch]

Vegas,

Almost. At not time should anyone be wearing two of the same knot. Instead, they should wear one silver knot (purple background); and, if they want, put devise pins in it. Anyone who has ever earned a youth religious award, regardless of when, or what they are now, can do this, or atleast that is my understanding of the rules(This message has been edited by meamemg)

[Oak Tree]

FScouter,

 

I'm looking at the fourth printing of the eleventh edition. I didn't type it wrong, it doesn't have the word 'most'. It just says the Scout "who has earned the Arrow of Light has completed the Boy Scout joining requirements." So yes, I guess that would mean they did earn it as Cub Scouts. I've seen the badge presented to the boys when they reach the far side of the bridge. I think your approach would be just fine, and you could certainly do what you want, but I'm curious if you would tell boys you're ignoring those two sentences in the book? I guess you could hang your hat on the "With the approval of his Scoutmaster" phrase, but it's not clear under what circumstances the Scoutmaster would be justified in not approving - it clearly states the boy has completed the requirements.

 

National would make this type of discussion easier if all of their reference material were on-line.

 

Oak Tree

[VegasDJ]

meamemg,

 

So, if an adult had earned a Cub Scout award as a Cub Scout, and a separate Boy Scout award as a Boy Scout, he can only wear one knot?

 

Thanks for the clarification. Where are the rules to which you referred? I couldn't find anything that definitive in the Insignia Guide.

[OldGreyEagle]

The adult would wear one knot, but with the Cub Scout "device" (little pin) and Boy Socut "device" (another little pin"

[Rip Van Scouter]

VegasDJ, please go up 5 postings in this thread. You will see my previous posting where I quoted from the Insignia Guide. It is quite clear. Only one Youth Religious knot may be worn. Device pins designating at which levels the award was earned MAY be worn. By the way, in most denominations, the adult religious award is not earned by meeting requirements as the youth award is. It is given by a religious organization for outstanding service.

[VegasDJ]

Okay Rip,

 

First of all, I was not asking about the adult award, which in my denomination does have specific requirements.

 

Second, I went up five posts and found my own post. Going up two more, I did read yours again however, and you're right, you did quote from the Insignia Guide just as it is printed in my copy. My confusion was from the fact that I was unable to correctly interpret the concise, clear-cut rules that are so obvious to everyone else.

 

However, in the process of writing this response, I did a Web search and found a site that explains the whole issue with crystal clarity.

 

So, where do I obtain these device pins that I need to get to my DL in question?

[ScoutNut]

You (or the DL in question) can purchase the knot devices at your local council Scout Shop. If by some chance they do not carry them I am sure the shop folks will be happy to order them.

 

 

[kittle]

Vegas DJ,

 

You stated that you did a webshirt that explained this with clarity. Can you please link it so that I can print it up. I did my own web search before posting this question and was so confused, that is why I posted this.

 

 

[VegasDJ]

kittle,

 

Sorry for not replying sooner. My browser took a dive and I had to repair it. The Web site I found was http://www.mninter.net/~blkeagle/patchtop.htm and the page on which I found the answers to my religious knot issue was http://www.mninter.net/~blkeagle/devices.htm

 

And thank you ScoutNut for the info. I wish the folks at the shop at our council headquarters would ask adults buying knots questions to find out if they should have a device. Because the devices are not pictured in the Insignia Guide, I had no idea what they were.

[LPC_Thumper]

VegasDJ,

 

I can tell from your post that you and are have the same chartered organization for our units. Just another point...

 

When (notice I didn't say IF) you earn your Adult On My Honor Award, go get the reverse knot (purple on silver), and pat yourself on the back for me

 

Thumper